Women's 'Private Spaces'

[Howseitgoin]

Clearly private spaces for women are considered a necessity by many due to a propensity for male sexual violence. Given this threat is much greater by orders of magnitude in the work place as opposed to public bathrooms, isn't it inconsistent not to demand private spaces there as well?
Thoughts?

Gosh.... look at this...

And yet... the OP then tried to declare that they 'ignored' the case while saying they didn't know Dolatowski was a woman.

Maybe OP can clarify this post. Somehow we are to believe that Dolatowski is not a woman yet 'was allowed to use the women's toilets'....

The contradictions just in this aspect of the discussion are startling.

Come on @Howseitgoin your answer is ???

Did we ever find out who are 'handlers' were apart from JK Rowling?

Was it Thor? I mean OP told us we had a lord protector! Was it Thor?

I can only dream of being on WhatsApp terms with JK Rowling.

And let's remember this contribution which was then backed up by that farce of a study.

HOW THE FUCKITY FUCKING FUCK IS USING YOUR PENIS TO RAPE SOMEONE "EXHIBITING A TEMPERAMENT MORE IN COMMON IN FEMALES"?

'For the risk to be assessed as unacceptable evidence from harm from Trans women not men needs to exist.'

Just coming back to this.

This OP has determinedly ignored the harms to female people by the inclusion of some male people because the OP narrows these 'harms' to physical harm.

Many of us on this thread, and another thread have told this OP that 'harm' is not limited to physical harm. There are many harms that will never be captured as data, those harms will never be recorded or reported. That does not make those harms to female people any less important nor does it make those harms not able to considered.

The outcome of those harms however, can be drawn from the responses to direct questions such as 'do you agree that some male people should be able to access female single sex spaces'. And for that we have the answer that I will post in a minute.

However, it is important to keep reminding the OP that harm is not limited to physical harm at all.

'So women are the humans that like to shop, wear sexy dresses and makeup, are nurses not doctors, and are always soft spoken and endlessly kind to children and animals?'

So men are the humans that punch on more than women?

Yes it works both ways. Seems data legitimises gender stereotypes.

https://hbr.org/2009/09/the-female-economy

https://ilostat.ilo.org/blog/where-women-work-female-dominated-occupations-and-sectors/#:~:text=Unsurprisingly%2C%20women%20still%20occupy%20traditionally,as%20those%20related%20to%20apparel.

😂

Guess who's 'offended' by reality…

Leaving aside what we think of the study, is the OP envisaging a situation where a GRC is granted or withdrawn depending on compliance with expected behaviour?

Could somebody be reported for non-compliant behaviour?

Where does this leave non-binary people?

This fellow Australian?

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2025/jun/15/trans-australian-uk-britain-tolerance

But even if it were limited to physical harm, there is ample evidence of it which the OP has chosen to ignore, to the point of claiming to be ignorant of who Katie Dolatowski is, despite being told about 20 times in this thread alone.

The majority of female people do not want any male person over the age of 8 years old in their single sex spaces, or any male person in their sport.

Comparing 2018 answers too.

In the following questions a transgender woman is someone who was biologically male at birth, but now identifies as a woman. A transgender man is someone who was biologically female at birth, but now identifies as a man.

Do you think transgender women should or should not be allowed to…
Take part in women's sporting events?2018 in italics, 2022 in [brackets vs 2024
Should be allowed 27 [16] 12% 2018 - 2024 this is decrease by 15%
Should not be allowed 48 [61] 74% 2018 - 2024 this is increase by 26%
Don't know 25 [22] 14%. 2018 - 2024 this is decrease by 11%

Use women's changing rooms? 2022 in brackets vs 2024
Should be allowed 42 [34] 25%. 2018 - 2024* this is decrease by 17%
Should not be allowed 33 [43] 58%. 2018 - 2024 this is increase by 25%
Don't know 25 [23] 17%. 2018 - 2024 *this is decrease by 8%

Use women's toilets? 2022 in brackets vs 2024
Should be allowed 46 [38] 33%. 2018 - 2024 this is decrease by 13%
Should not be allowed 30 [41] 51%. 2018 - 2024* *this is increase by 20%
Don't know 23 [21] 16%. 2018 - 2024 this is decrease by 7%

Use women's refuges? 2022 in brackets vs 2024
Should be allowed 47 [39] 29%. 2018 - 2024 this is decrease by 18%
Should not be allowed 27 [36] 55%. 2018 - 2024 this is increase by 28%
Don't know 26 [25] 16%. 2018 - 2024 this is decrease by 10%

No surgery question was asked in 2018

And the specific non surgical question from 2020:

Do you think a transgender woman who has not had gender reassignment surgery should or should not be allowed to...
Use women's changing rooms? 2020 in italics, 2022 in [brackets] vs 2024
Should be allowed 26 [25] 19%. 2020 - 2024 this is decrease by 7%
Should not be allowed 46 [48] 63%. 2020 - 2024* *this is increase by 17%
Don't know 28 [27] 18%. 2020 - 2024 this is decrease by 10%

Use women's toilets?
Should be allowed 31 [29] 23%. 2020 - 2024* *this is decrease by 8%
Should not be allowed 41 [46] 60%. 2020 - 2024 this is increase by 19%
Don't know 27 [25] 18%. 2020 - 2024 this is decrease by 9%

And finally:

This question was also not asked in 2018

Do you believe that allowing transgender women to use spaces reserved for women, such as women's toilets or changing rooms, does or does not present a genuine risk of harm to women? 2020 in italics, 2022 in [brackets] vs 2024
Does not present a genuine risk of harm 39 [32] 25%. 2020 - 2024 this is decrease by 14%
Does present a genuine risk of harm 32 [39] 55%. 2020 - 2024 this is increase by 23%
Don't know 29 [29] 20%. 2020 - 2024 this is decrease by 9%

d3nkl3psvxxpe9.cloudfront.net/documents/Transgender_data_2018.pdf

https://d3nkl3psvxxpe9.cloudfront.net/documents/Transgender_data_2020.pdf

https://d3nkl3psvxxpe9.cloudfront.net/documents/Internal_TransgenderIssues_220720_final_extraXbreak_FINAL.pdf

https://ygo-assets-websites-editorial-emea.yougov.net/documents/YouGov_-_Transgender_study_2024.pdf

There was also a Sex Matters poll done within days of the YouGov tracker. These are the results of it compared to in the past too. Just pulling them together, the Sex Matters (2533 adults polled) results were often more supportive than the YouGov results (2078 adults polled).

https://d3nkl3psvxxpe9.cloudfront.net/documents/SexMatters_Gender_241219_ZMwbM2T.pdf

In the following questions a transgender woman is someone who was biologically male at birth, but now identifies as a woman. A transgender man is someone who was biologically female at birth, but now identifies as a man.

Do you think transgender women should or should not be allowed to…
Take part in women's sporting events?2018 in italics, 2022 in [brackets vs 2024 SM (YG 2024)
Should be allowed 27 [16] 11%SM 2018 - 2024 SM this is decrease by 16% (YG 12%)
Should not be allowed 48 [61] 74%SM 2018 - 2024 SM this is increase by 26% (YG 74%)
Don't know 25 [22] 15%SM. 2018 - 2024 this is SM decrease by 10% (YG 14%)

Use women's changing rooms? 2022 in brackets vs 2024
Should be allowed 42 [34] 27%SM. 2018 - 2024SM this is decrease by 15% (YG 25%)*
Should not be allowed 33 [43] 56%SM. 2018 - 2024SM this is increase by 23% (YG 58%)
Don't know 25 [23] 17%SM. 2018 - 2024 SM this is decrease by 8% (YG 17%)*

Use women's toilets? 2022 in brackets vs 2024
Should be allowed 46 [38] 33%SM. 2018 - 2024 SMthis is decrease by 13% (YG 29%)
Should not be allowed 30 [41] 51%SM. 2018 - 2024SM this is increase by 20% (YG 55%)
Don't know 23 [21] 16%SM. 2018 - 2024 SM this is decrease by 7% (YG 16%)

Use women's refuges? 2022 in brackets vs 2024
Should be allowed 47 [39] 31%SM. 2018 - 2024 SM this is decrease by 16% (YG 29%)
Should not be allowed 27 [36] 47%SM. 2018 - 2024 SM this is increase by 20% (YG 52%)
Don't know 26 [25] 22%SM. 2018 - 2024 this is decrease SM by 4% (YG 20%)

And the specific non surgical question from 2020:

Do you think a transgender woman who has not had gender reassignment surgery should or should not be allowed to...

Use women's changing rooms? 2020 in italics, 2022 in [brackets] vs 2024SM (YG 2024)
Should be allowed 26 [25] 20%SM. 2020 - 2024SM this is decrease by 6% (YG 19%)
Should not be allowed 46 [48] 62%SM. 2020 - 2024 SM this is increase by 16% (YG 63%)
Don't know 28 [27] 18%SM. 2020 - 2024 SM this is decrease by 10% (YG 18%)

Use women's toilets?
Should be allowed 31 [29] 26%SM. 2020 - 2024 SM this is decrease by 5% (YG 23%)
Should not be allowed 41 [46] 58%SM. 2020 - 2024 SM this is increase by 17% (YG 60%)
Don't know 27 [25] 16%SM. 2020 - 2024 SM this is decrease by 11% (YG 18%)

I wouldn’t be able to post, i’d spend the entire time thinking

say something clever…say something clever 🤯

then she’d think i was ghosting her and she’d block me 😭

oh my actual god i can’t take the stress of even imagining it!!!!!

I think this thread should be critically analysed as an exercise in humanities degrees. My first comment would be about the title with quotes round ‘private spaces’.

Also OP you didn’t answer my safety question.

"Yes it works both ways. Seems data legitimises gender stereotypes."

Crime statistics? I don't think the Crown Prosecution services generally concerns itself with data on make-up preferences, but perhaps things are different in Australia.

And whether you assume that men have a greater propensity to violent crime because of nature or nurture, it is undoubtedly a more dangerous characteristic than wearing lipstick, so it doesn' really 'work both ways'.

A very good question.

But one that I believe will be dismiss with 'female people commit sex crimes too', while ignoring that female people don't have penises and therefore don't commit sex crimes with penises. And that the numbers of female sex offenders are rare... but magically they would be significant enough for this poster to rely on, while also being dismissed by that same poster if used to support an argument they disagreed with.

It really has been a mindfuck of a thread.

https://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/entry/comb-feet-toddler-tantrum-trick_uk_68a594fce4b0a58e154241e8?utm_source=firefox-newtab-en-gb

Fear Not MN.

Howseitgoin is not the only poster who can post random pointless irrelevant links.

Any other meltdown hacks?
Prevention is key. Take lots of snacks and toys to keep them occupied. Tablets can be useful if your child is of an age where they can be distracted by TV shows and films for periods of time.

One parent swears by painter’s tape to keep her child occupied on a plane – it’s cheap, easy to rip (and remove from surfaces, once stuck), and colourful. Just make sure you clean it all up before you disembark.

If your child is in the thick of a tantrum and the comb trick isn’t working, you could try asking them a “tiny, non-threatening question”, according to Jo Walker, a hypnotherapist at Walker’s Therapy.

The question should have nothing to do with the tantrum. So, Walker gave an example of, “hey, I just noticed your shoes. Where did you get those from?” or “what is the animal on your T-shirt?”.

Other parenting pros, like Jon Fogel, have recommended similar techniques, such as the colour game, where you ask your child to find something of a certain colour.

Other tips that experts say can help children during tantrums include whispering and getting down to their level, while verbalising why they’re upset and what you’re seeing.

Engaging with you would require engaging with the fact that the only choices are mixed sex and single sex services, so the only question is the relative safety and appropriateness of either, not whether some men should arbitrarily be allowed to use women's toilets.

A typically female way to commit a sex crime is to spike someone's drink on the instructions of your drug dealer (who controls your access to heroin) so that he can rape them.

What is the relevance to women 'punching on' to the statement that you quoted?

You are incoherent at this stage. All the sarcasm and emojis cannot help you.

https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/woman-who-smeared-faeces-nursery-35698025

This person fits OP's definition of 'this is a woman because they say they are a woman'.

This is what you are relying on in order to say transwomen aren't men but actually women? Honestly you're spouting absolute nonsense.

Try better next time because this thread has shown your argument for why you think men can magically turn into women to be bollocks.

Howseitgoin · Today 06:12

"Are you now saying that tranwomen are women… except when they are in prison? Is that why you refer to Dolatowski as ‘he’? So, apparently being incarcerated male people with transgender identities are no longer to be considered women? Yet you have spoken about these males being part of womanhood (and by extension, girlhood). However, being a woman or girl is not something that can be ever taken away. Because it is an abiding category label for a human of the female sex.
Incarcerated female people are still women…
It is pretty clear that you never believed that a group of male people were female. Female people having single sex provisions seem to really agitate you though."
No. Trans women just like CIS women are capable of committing rape. Their individual criminality has no bearing on whether they qualify as women.
--------------

Ah the women do it too argument. Well for starters over 98% of sexual crimes are commited by one sex. I'll let you guess which. Secondly, in the UK, rape is committed with a penis, making it an exclusively male crime. TRA's hate that they can't obfuscate rape statistics.

I actually do, even if they are not trans, I believe they are both misogynistic and ASD (and possibly intoxicated) and I slightly pity them as it must be hard to exist in such an angry state all the time.

Even is this poster is not genuine other TRAs watching this will be, and it’s good to give a framework of questions to ask themselves.

1. Why does behaviour and affiliation to certain patterns of thought define one’s gender and how does this trump genitals in the definition of sex
2. How many gold medals have to be won by transgender women for you to realise their is a significant biological advantage
3. What is your threshold for number of women being assaulted in toilets by men claiming to be TG women before you realise their danger this forced change in society rules is causing?

I have been enraged and depressed about it and that didn’t change anything and just caused me extra stress, so I am choosing a different tack.

"I want to watch this 18+ movie"
"Its not legal. You aren't watching it"

"But Sarah's Mum lets her watch 18+ movies."
"Yes and? I'm saying its not a good idea"

"Sarah's Mum is cool and it hasn't done Sarah any harm. Why can't you be more like Sarah's Mum".
"I'm not Sarah's Mum".

"But its a really good film and got loads of awards and its got my favourite actor in it."
"I'm sure it is, but it still doesn't mean you are watching it"

"But Sarah says its ok and not as bad as everyone says"
"We have movie ratings for a reason"

"But no one is going to be able to tell if I've watched it and I won't tell anyone"
"We can always tell the kids who have watched adult stuff"

"Well Louise says that its rated 15 in France so it must be ok"
"We aren't in France. We are in the UK and its the law in the UK."

"But Mum, I'm really mature for my age, I'll be fine with it"
"You are 12. And you don't know that"

"Well Jane says that studies have shown that children who are treated with maturity and exposed to a wider range of cultural experiences do better at school in Mongolia. You are stunting my education"
"How exactly does that apply to you watching Nightmare on Elm Street?"

"Well I'll just go to Sarah's house and watch it there"
"You aren't going to Sarah's house then"

"This is persecution! You are violating my liberty and human rights! I'm reporting you to social services!"

Here is another that qualifies

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-67144375