NHS Fife tries to silence nurse - Sandie Peggie vs NHS Fife Health Board and Dr Beth Upton - thread #34

[nauticant]

Sandie Peggie, a nurse at Victoria Hospital in Kirkcaldy (VH), has brought claims in the employment tribunal against her employer; Fife Health Board (the Board) and another employee, Dr B Upton. Ms Peggie’s claims are of sexual harassment, harassment related to a protected belief, indirect discrimination and victimisation. Dr Upton claims to be a transwoman, that is observed as male at birth but asserting a female gender identity.

The Employment Tribunal hearing started on Monday 3 February 2025 and was expected to last 2 weeks. However, after 2 weeks it was not complete and it adjourned part-heard. It resumed on 16 July and the last day of evidence will be 28 July and then there will be 2 days of submissions from counsel meaning that the hearing will end on 30 July.

The hearing commenced with Sandie Peggie giving evidence. Dr Beth Upton gave evidence from Thursday 6 February to Wednesday 12 February.

Access to view the hearing remotely was obtainable by sending an email request to [email protected] by 5pm on Wednesday 9 July. Detailed instructions were provided here:

drive.google.com/file/d/16-9POEZ7yHWUr6EmbfquJZO18Gv78bSm/view

The hearing is being live tweeted by x.com/tribunaltweets and there's additional information here: tribunaltweets.substack.com/p/peggie-vs-fife-health-board-and-dr-005 and tribunaltweets.substack.com/p/peggie-vs-fife-health-board-and-dr-bd6. This also has threadreaderapp archives of live-tweeting of the sessions of the hearing for those who can't follow on Twitter, for example: archive.ph/WSSjg.

An alternative to Twitter is to use Nitter: nitter.net/tribunaltweets or nitter.poast.org/tribunaltweets

Links to previous threads #1 to #29 can be found in the header of thread #30.

Thread 30: mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5375337-nhs-fife-tries-to-sil
ence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-30
Thread 31: mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5375819-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-31
Thread 32: mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5376072-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-32
Thread 33: mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5376608-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-33

Celery is tolerable if well cooked and hidden in a dish but unacceptable any other way. Same applies to aubergine 🤮

This may be a historic hangover. When my father qualified there was a doctors' changing room (male) and a nurses' changing room (female). The rare female doctor changed with the nurses. I know when I was a student (mid-90s) that the badging had changed, but the rooms hadn't, so what had been the nurses' changing room became the all female staff, and vica versa.

TBF How many young women have the time and opportunity to watch a case like this? If they're anything like I was in my thirties they'll be running round like blue-arsed flies holding down a job, looking after kids and a home, and a thousand other things besides.

I believe the originator of it put them on a bouncy castle, too.😂

Twin pack?

I love the fact that we've gotten up to page 5 of this thread essentially whilst just mucking about waiting for the action to start, and that we're now, courtesy of @nauticant, up to thread 34. Especially when you consider that there's only actually four of us and a lot of sock accounts..

I don't know if it's an urban myth but isn't celery one of those spooky food that uses more calories to digest than it provides?

The garlic mayo will screw with that though.

43 and still WFTCHTJ. Would absolutely love to know what's going on given the statement(s) debacle.

Others I know who are following by other channels are 30s, 40 and early 70s. We're all women, and all but one mothers and she's a fully invested aunt to a neice.

A little bit younger than Sandie, quite a bit older than Upton.

Love celery - I do a sort of bastardised version of a Waldorf salad - chopped up celery, apple, cheese and walnuts with a light emulsion dressing.

The mention of spring onions has made me think of the Scottish word for them - Syboes (pronounced cy bees).

Isn't the age demographic during the day going to skew older, e.g. retired or now working part-time?

Yep, that's me but I am still trying to keep up with the threads!

61, old enough and Scottish enough to remember celery being a thing you nibbled at instead of eating a Tunnock's Teacake when you were "slimming", not something you'd put in actual food.

57

Is "swivel-eyed" the new "rights-hoarding dinosaurs"? I've loved the dinosaur outfits women have been wearing at protests, but I think translating the swivel-eyed idea into a wearable costume is going to be more challenging.

My mum used to make celery soup honestly kinda delicious!!

You haven't tried my parmigiana.......you have to salt the aubergine first, then lightly fry it. I also layer courgettes, then add my delicious tomato sauce ( with celery in it ) plus lots of grated mozzzarella. Celery is great in a lentil, tomato and sweet potato soup as well. You blend it at the end, so not bits.

ooh - Interesting question!

Is there a case against Fife by DU regarding their lack of written policy and the verbal advice/confirmation/approval given that he could use the female CR. When SP asserted her right to a SSS, he objected thinking it was "proper procedure" under the false guidance given. He is not responsible for the ham fisted way that NHS Fife behaves and he ends up as R2 and on the front of the newspapers = invasion of privacy and impact on future earnings/employability/wellbeing etc etc?

Obviously that does not totally fit with how DU presented on the witness stand, (although he did say everyone should have access to single cubicles) could he argue they should have advised him his request was unlawful? Or would that mean having to admit he was not a biological woman?

30s. For lots of English schools, today is the first day of the summer holidays so where mums with school age children could drop in during coffee breaks during the day last week, they are potentially on child care duties now, so that will have an impact on age ranges.

I'm currently wondering how much screen time to allow DS so that I can keep up during the day today…

I always put celery in a blender and then add to whatever, that way you get the flavour but never have to eat a piece.

It’s interesting as Fife was just following the noxious self ID policy half of Scotland seems to have adopted. The BBC and the Guardian must know it’s noxious as they don’t cover it properly, or the obvious consequences to women. As soon as these obvious consequences are played out in the press there is uproar.

Give it a min. for the image

I remember seeing a Scottish lady on a quiz show decades ago - what is the Scottish word for spring onion, she didn't know - given the answer she said We call them green stocks - has anyone heard them called Green Stocks?

I also have memory of 6 Scots all being baffled by an Englishman asking "Whats a skelf?" like skelf in your finger - nobody could think of the English word for skelf!

Yes, I used to make celery and cashew nut soup......partly blended at the end. I can imagine it may be the stuff of nightmares for some here, though.

From TT 10:31

We're still waiting to enter the hearing room and do not know what time the hearing will resume today