Why don't trans women care if women feel unsafe?

[ItsCoolForCats]

I listened to the Stephen Nolan show earlier on BBC Sounds. They were discussing the FA ban on male players in the female category. A lady from SEEN in Sport was on and was great.

Then there were two transwomen on (one who is involved with Mermaids). There was lots of talk about their feelings and some quite infuriating twisting of scientific fact (women come in all shapes and sizes, so transwomen have no advantage). But one thing that came up several times was how they didn't feel safe using male facilities. Stephen Nolan did the faux naive thing quite effectively and tried to turn it around to get them to consider other people's viewpoints, unsuccessfully. It was back to their feelings again. The levels of entitlement was quite astonishing.

Why don't they ever consider women who feel unsafe sharing spaces with males? Is it because these women are just bigots that need to be re-educated and reframe their trauma?

clearly you know nothing about this issue and the effect of pushing gender ideology on women & children.

or you do know & you simply don’t care.

go do some reading & get up to speed.

You are making a fool of yourself.

Why does it makes some fools feel so smug and superior to have 51% of the a tiny, vulnerable population to demonize and pick on?

Fixed it for you. You're here on the biggest female space on the internet, supporting an aggressive male supremacist movement. How embarrassing for you.

You have to be male to identify as a 'transwoman'.

It's is not about being attacked so much as about the privacy and dignity one's sex in certain types of situation in which the body or biological function is paramount.

We have single sex spaces ( and most of them still are) to protect the dignity and privacy of females, primarily.

Women and girls in Britain have legal rights and protections

You can campaign for 'third spaces'.

pippy

The clownfish thing is a reference to a, well, what masqueraded as an argument, until about a year ago. Trans zealots basically said that because clownfish sometimes change sex, human sex must therefore be on a spectrum and of course men can become women.

Using that logic, as we share 40% of our DNA with bananas, I can change into a tomato.

I think by this stage it is safe to say that if you think that male people with transgender identities are no longer ‘male’, then you are showing just how indoctrinated you are into believing pseudoscience or straight out falsity. Or maybe you have been misunderstanding the terminology all along ?

If you make statements such as ‘transwomen are not male’ then you have to accept that you are not only incorrect but you are spreading falsehoods across the internet. And dangerous ones too if some people believe you and act on that information.

If you weren't trying to encroach upon and invade the space that belongs to another historically vulnerable group then you wouldn't be here laying on the emotional manipulation.

The trans lobby is not weak, powerless or even very 'nice'. It thinks its rights supercede the rights of all other groups and that everyone must do its bidding.

That's why there is such a meltdown now...the bubble has been burst. Transwomen are not only factually male people, but they are legally male people too.

Where is Darlington Bertha?

Solve the issue then, if not welcome in men’s loos, as for disabled loos, most lack ceiling hoists to be fully functioning, as disabled loos

It is for you to solve the issue. Women have had a hard time and enough to do with protecting their own interests without having to worry about your nephew's.
You must obviously feel some responsibility for his plight seeing that you have encouraged it in the guise of being kind.

why should we solve mens problems?

if your nephew fears using male toilets then that’s an issue of male violence plus all this “not welcome in” is completely unevidenced. There’s no evidence whatsoever of TW not being welcome in men’s toilets. They just don’t want to use them which is not the same at all.

And if he wants to use women’s spaces because it validates his feeling of being a woman then stop & think of how dehumanising that is for women. We’re reduced to no more than support humans, bit part actors to validate a man and what he wants with no sentience of our own.

also btw we spent years suggesting third spaces and were screamed at as bigots and transphobes. So you know we did try and now we don’t because nothing but complete capitulation to any and all demands is good enough

You seem to be under the impression that male people with transgender identities are not welcome in the male toilets? But they are.

Male people, whatever style of clothing they wear, however they look, whatever surgery they have, whatever their body shape (including breast enlargements) ARE welcome in male toilets. There is currently a male person on twitter who has taken over 1000 photos of themselves as a male transgender person wearing what some people call ‘feminem’ clothing (ie. a dress) and he has reported he has never had an issue. There are other stories out there.

Rather than arriving on this thread and complaining about people reacting ‘negatively’ to your posts, maybe you need to take it as a sign that you seem to have very limited knowledge about the topic and about the negative impacts of male people accessing female toilets.

Why is the issue of where male people with transgender identities go to the toilet something for feminists to resolve if those male people are successfully excluded from female single sex spaces? Ie female toilets.

Why is it an issue for society to resolve if some male people make deliberate choices to not use the male toilets based on no factual evidence ? If there is such a safety issue for this group of male people to use male toilets, that was and still is something for governments to address. Because male single sex spaces need to be safe for all male people.

And toilets were never ‘women’s’ or ‘men’s’. They were categorised for female and male people due to safety needs and usage patterns. It has been a misnomer to call them ‘the men’s’ because boys go there too. But it was this use of language that people used to leverage some male people who believe they are ‘women’ (despite it never being a reality) into those female spaces.

Why?

There is no issue to solve.

A male wanting to use the women's toilet is an incel. Incels are not nice. Trans Incels are Incels.

Why the fuck should it be up to women to solve?!??? It's MENS problem to solve. Stop asking women to come up with solutions for mentally ill men. Get them to take some responsibility for once.

Besides, we did come up with a solution; third spaces. THEY rejected it. So the ball is in their court.

Disabled people and disabled charities have been fighting for their rights for years, often with very little support, to have facilities useable for them. It is not for you to give away their spaces. There are spaces for men, however, plenty of them. I would say that disabled people are a much more vulnerable minority than men, should we let disabled males into the women’s facility too? Why should women solve men’s issues when we can’t stop women being murdered every week from them? You stop that first please.

They are not mentally ill, I wrongly worded, they have a right to use toilets as we all do!
Third spaces are impractical in most places, disabled loo is obvious choice, if available.
Btw i’:not responsible for my nephew, just great love

Loving someone is one thing.

Enabling them to harm or upset another group because of that love is not cool.

You act like you are the only person here who has a trans relative or cares about someone trans.

You are not.

Stop being the flying monkey. Stop enabling sexist behaviour. Start trying to find a way that accommodates women. Men can sort out their own dramas.

Your nephew is capable of advocating for himself rather than sending his aunt on a mission to lecture women who may have been abused, have no wish to be victims of vouyerism, have children or have a religion which prohibits sharing private changing or washing spaces with males, that they are mean and should come up with a solution for him.

Women are not here as support humans for males.

Of course people have the right to use a toilet. But not a toilet meant for the opposite sex if it is designated as single sex.

Is your nephew telling you that he cannot use the male toilets? Why can’t he?

And if you don’t know why he can’t, maybe that tells you it isn’t about safety, it is about him and his decision. Fair enough, there is plenty of media at the moment telling male people falsely that they have a right to use the female single sex spaces. But your nephew should be told that this is not actually right at all, it is not kind and respectful to female people at all. Despite what activists are saying, it is also not legal in the UK if the facility has been segregated into male and female.

I have not read the whole thread, but back to the original question... surely a better question would be "why would anyone suppose that men who claim to be women, who adopt female sex-based stereotypes and demand access to women's spaces in order to gain validation, comfort and even euphoria as someone of the sex that they are not, would be at all concerned with women's rights or happiness?"

Given their behaviours and wants there is not the slightest reason to suppose that women's rights and happiness are on their radar at all.

It seems clear to me that MCWs are have some sort of mental health issue (potentially incl internalized homophobia, depression, gender dysphoria etc etc), or some sort of paraphilia (incl Malaga), or are simply dishonest predators. It seems clear to me that there is zero reason at all to think that any of those groups would have any interest in protecting and uplifting women.

It is a mental illness. It's even classified as Gender Dysphoria and in in the DSMV.

Places can have male, female and gender neutral, so how is that impractical?

Recently I used a unisex toilet in a theatre. It was cubicle style with mirrors & hand washing facilities opposite. As I was leaving A man (not transgender) walked in unzipping his trousers the minute he walked through the door. Luckily it went no further although I did see the colour of his underwear. It was still unsettling and something I feel a woman shouldn't be afraid of happening in a public toilet, especially if worse.

This is not for women or the disabled to solve. Men can work it out for themselves.

Men are not a vulnerable minority. Piss off with the emotional blackmail.

They are not mentally ill, I wrongly worded, they have a right to use toilets as we all do!

There is a perfectly functional toilet for their use - the one for their sex.

Third spaces are impractical in most places, disabled loo is obvious choice, if available.

No, the disabled loo is not an obvious choice it is for people who are disabled only.

A number of places do have the fourth additional option of gender neutral/mixed. You and your nephew can campaign for more of them.