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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Cisgender lesbian forcibly removed from toilets by male security after being wrongly accused of being a man

315 replies

Christinapple · 07/05/2025 15:51

This isn't the first time this has happened is it? I expect IMHO there will be more cases like this happening given the current obsession with trans people and how masculine or feminine people look.

https://gomag.com/article/hotel-guard-barges-into-womens-restroom-accuses-lesbian-guest-of-being-a-man/

https://www.thepinknews.com/2025/05/07/liberty-hotel-boston-bathroom-lesbian-trans/

https://www.msn.com/en-nz/news/other/same-sex-couple-demands-answers-after-hotel-security-threw-one-out-of-bathroom-thinking-she-was-a-man/ar-AA1Eh00e

"A woman and her girlfriend were thrown out of a luxurious five-star hotel after a security guard allegedly accused her of being a man using a female bathroom.
Ansley Baker and her partner, Liz Victor, were at the Liberty Hotel in Boston, Massachusetts, attending a Kentucky Derby party on Saturday.

The couple was using the women’s restroom in the foyer when they heard a bang on the stall doors, they told CBS News Boston.
Baker said she was in one of the stalls as Victor waited around the corner near the sinks. The hotel says that security was alerted by several women that the couple was sharing a single stall. Baker and Victor deny being in the same stall.
The male security guard allegedly began urging Baker, who was born a woman and identifies as a woman, to get out of the bathroom and accused her of being a man
“All of a sudden there was banging on the door,” Baker told the local news station. “I pulled my shorts up. I hadn't even tied them. One of the security guards was there telling me to get out of the bathroom, that I was a man in the women's bathroom. I said, ‘I'm a woman.’”"

OP posts:
Thread gallery
13
TheKeatingFive · 07/05/2025 18:37

dylexicdementor11 · 07/05/2025 18:33

I’m not interested in blaming anyone. I’m interested in protecting people from harm.

If my area of concern (obstetric violence and poor maternal health outcomes) received half as much attention from all of the warriors on this and so many other threads, the media etcetera, I’m sure we could actually start to improve the life chances of women and girls. But no, we are stuck in a nonsensical debate about WCs. If you care about women’s health and futures start advocating for reproductive justice.

This is not just about WCs and you know it. Quit minimising the issue.

Its about sport, prisons, domestic violence shelters, rape counselling, intimate care for the sick and disabled, lesbian dating spaces, changing rooms for young girls and orthodox religious women. I could go on.

LadyBracknellsHandbagg · 07/05/2025 18:38

dylexicdementor11 · 07/05/2025 18:33

I’m not interested in blaming anyone. I’m interested in protecting people from harm.

If my area of concern (obstetric violence and poor maternal health outcomes) received half as much attention from all of the warriors on this and so many other threads, the media etcetera, I’m sure we could actually start to improve the life chances of women and girls. But no, we are stuck in a nonsensical debate about WCs. If you care about women’s health and futures start advocating for reproductive justice.

squirrel eating GIF

Look, there’s a squirrel 🐿️

GarlicPile · 07/05/2025 18:40

Oh, hi, Chris, you're back! 😄

CassOle · 07/05/2025 18:40

My special area of concern is single-sex intimate care for disabled, paralysed and injured women and girls (also for men and boys if they would also like the option of requesting single-sex care).

Toilets are talked about a lot, but they represnt far more than just loos, it is the whole concept of something being single-sex.

Ther SC clarified the law (EA2010) the activists need to accept this. I think it is perfectly reasonable for people to be upset as they have been misled by activist groups who have willfully misrepresented the law which has not changed since 2010.

Boiledbeetle · 07/05/2025 18:44

dylexicdementor11 · 07/05/2025 18:26

Women are most at risk of sexual violence in their own homes. If we really want to protect women from male violence we should focus our attention on domestic abuse.

I live on my own so statistically I'm more in danger in a public toilet if a man decides to use the women's toilet. I appreciate that's not the case for all women, but I'm sure as hell putting myself and my safety front and centre thanks very much.

dylexicdementor11 · 07/05/2025 18:46

TheKeatingFive · 07/05/2025 18:37

This is not just about WCs and you know it. Quit minimising the issue.

Its about sport, prisons, domestic violence shelters, rape counselling, intimate care for the sick and disabled, lesbian dating spaces, changing rooms for young girls and orthodox religious women. I could go on.

My point is that men dressing up as women and/or claiming to be women so that they can access women only spaces so that they can harm women - does not come close to comparing to the harm caused to women by men (dressed as men and identifying as men).

GarlicPile · 07/05/2025 18:47

I've just watched the video of Ansley Baker being interviewed. The women who reported were lying (they said a couple had entered the cubicle) and the security guard must have been a bit of a twit, as she looks & sounds female.

Still, none of this would be happening if the gender borg hadn't inserted men into women's facilities. You've made women justifiably anxious. And I don't much care about one American lesbian having an awkward moment in a hotel loo.

Seethlaw · 07/05/2025 18:48

dylexicdementor11 · 07/05/2025 18:46

My point is that men dressing up as women and/or claiming to be women so that they can access women only spaces so that they can harm women - does not come close to comparing to the harm caused to women by men (dressed as men and identifying as men).

"Oh, this group is only a little dangerous and harmful to you, so why are you bothering to protect yourselves against them?"

Seriously???

GarlicPile · 07/05/2025 18:48

dylexicdementor11 · 07/05/2025 18:46

My point is that men dressing up as women and/or claiming to be women so that they can access women only spaces so that they can harm women - does not come close to comparing to the harm caused to women by men (dressed as men and identifying as men).

Why, is harm less harmful if the actor wears a dress?

dylexicdementor11 · 07/05/2025 18:48

Boiledbeetle · 07/05/2025 18:44

I live on my own so statistically I'm more in danger in a public toilet if a man decides to use the women's toilet. I appreciate that's not the case for all women, but I'm sure as hell putting myself and my safety front and centre thanks very much.

No, statistically you are more at risk of poverty.

Merrymouse · 07/05/2025 18:50

dylexicdementor11 · 07/05/2025 18:46

My point is that men dressing up as women and/or claiming to be women so that they can access women only spaces so that they can harm women - does not come close to comparing to the harm caused to women by men (dressed as men and identifying as men).

They are all men - what is the difference?

ThatCyanCat · 07/05/2025 18:50

How is it that transgenderism is so insignificant that we should spend no time on it until we have achieved an otherwise perfect world, yet so important that people spend all their time telling us not to spend time on it?

And why is it that we should do absolutely anything except run a campaign educating and encouraging men to be welcoming of transwomen in the gents'?

Boiledbeetle · 07/05/2025 18:50

dylexicdementor11 · 07/05/2025 18:48

No, statistically you are more at risk of poverty.

<Checks bank balance>

Ha!

Wrong.

TheKeatingFive · 07/05/2025 18:51

dylexicdementor11 · 07/05/2025 18:46

My point is that men dressing up as women and/or claiming to be women so that they can access women only spaces so that they can harm women - does not come close to comparing to the harm caused to women by men (dressed as men and identifying as men).

I'm not sure why you need to make a distinction. It's all fundamentally the same thing. Men harming women.

The major difference is that if these men say they 'identify as women' they think they have the rights to our single sex spaces thus easier access to women.

But you don't think this is an issue 🙄?

dylexicdementor11 · 07/05/2025 18:52

GarlicPile · 07/05/2025 18:48

Why, is harm less harmful if the actor wears a dress?

Sorry, I should have been more clear.

More harm (as in quantifiable instances of violence) are inflicted on women by men dressed and identifying as men.
less harm (as in quantifiable instances of violence) are inflicted on women by men pretending to be women.

LadyBracknellsHandbagg · 07/05/2025 18:53

Arniesaxe · 07/05/2025 16:32

https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/_chat/4651722-butch-women-and-public-loos-not-sure-if-correct-place-to-post?page=2

A lot of them were deleted, but only after I reported them!

My ex ex (!)about ten years ago was dragged out of a bathroom in a bar and shoved against a wall, by a doorman. She was a confident person though. Let him do it and then lifted her top up revealing a rather large pair of...
He was mortified, we all felt quite sorry for him in the end and he bought us all a drink. He was just doing his job, we understood-but it happens and did then.

My most recent ex (obviously my partner at the time of posting that thread) was so nervous about the reception she got, that in her past she'd often gone for hours without going to the loo-even on boozy days out, making herself ill and giving herself a terrible kidney infection-of course I see that this is entirely a matter of her own making and she should have found better ways around it, but my point is, this was years before we met, which in itself was a good few years ago. A 'new' thing, it is not!

It had happened to them both at school, too.

I marveled at the trans accusations. As a rule, transwomen present as feminine. Long hair, skirts etc. Nothing like what either of my aforementioned previous partners looked like.

I don’t have long hair and I rarely wear skirts, does that make me unfeminine?

Bannedontherun · 07/05/2025 18:55

Yep i knew it was @Christinapple before i opened the thread massive yawn

Merrymouse · 07/05/2025 18:56

dylexicdementor11 · 07/05/2025 18:52

Sorry, I should have been more clear.

More harm (as in quantifiable instances of violence) are inflicted on women by men dressed and identifying as men.
less harm (as in quantifiable instances of violence) are inflicted on women by men pretending to be women.

What is the difference between a man identifying as a woman and a man not identifying as a woman?

dylexicdementor11 · 07/05/2025 18:59

Boiledbeetle · 07/05/2025 18:50

<Checks bank balance>

Ha!

Wrong.

Single women living alone in the UK are more at risk of poverty than they are of getting attacked by a man dressed as a woman in a public WC.
Obviously, and happily, it does not follow that you are poor or have a low bank balance. 🤭

Seethlaw · 07/05/2025 19:03

dylexicdementor11 · 07/05/2025 18:52

Sorry, I should have been more clear.

More harm (as in quantifiable instances of violence) are inflicted on women by men dressed and identifying as men.
less harm (as in quantifiable instances of violence) are inflicted on women by men pretending to be women.

So you are seriously saying that just because a group does less damage, there's no reason to try to protect against them.

Boiledbeetle · 07/05/2025 19:04

dylexicdementor11 · 07/05/2025 18:59

Single women living alone in the UK are more at risk of poverty than they are of getting attacked by a man dressed as a woman in a public WC.
Obviously, and happily, it does not follow that you are poor or have a low bank balance. 🤭

You said I was statistically more at risk of poverty. And in that respect you are wrong.

So for me personally I'm more at risk from the man trying to use a woman's single sex toilet.

spannasaurus · 07/05/2025 19:05

The two women must have been in the toilet for a while if there was enough time for other women to find a guard to complain to and for that guard to make his way to the toilets

BackToLurk · 07/05/2025 19:08

dylexicdementor11 · 07/05/2025 18:52

Sorry, I should have been more clear.

More harm (as in quantifiable instances of violence) are inflicted on women by men dressed and identifying as men.
less harm (as in quantifiable instances of violence) are inflicted on women by men pretending to be women.

Do you have any other comparisons? Disabled men. Gay men. Men over the age of 90. Shy men. Asexual men.

MissScarletInTheBallroom · 07/05/2025 19:10

dylexicdementor11 · 07/05/2025 18:52

Sorry, I should have been more clear.

More harm (as in quantifiable instances of violence) are inflicted on women by men dressed and identifying as men.
less harm (as in quantifiable instances of violence) are inflicted on women by men pretending to be women.

That's because most men don't dress like women.

It doesn't mean men dressed like women are any safer than men not dressed like women. (Indeed, the prison stats would indicate the reverse.)

dylexicdementor11 · 07/05/2025 19:14

Seethlaw · 07/05/2025 19:03

So you are seriously saying that just because a group does less damage, there's no reason to try to protect against them.

No, you must have miss understood.