Is anyone worried about pressure now to change the Equality legislation?

[Unbeleevable]

There's a lot of wisdom in this forum - I wondered in the happy afterglow of the very clear-cut SC and EHCR pronouncements on biological sex … is there a risk that behind this, someone is pulling strings to publish strong statements hoping this will to trigger a surge of pro-trans-rights sentiment leading to a widespread acceptance the EA must change to encompass rights based on declared gender identity? And eventually a political mandate for the same?

In other words - we can’t expect the TRAs will give up. Have we won the battle but not the war?

I have long felt I have landed on the wrong side of history in my GC convictions - I can’t shake the feeling that the recent developments are too good to be true.

Also has only limited bearing on the EA, which is supposed to balance rights equitably, not dole them out as a charitable service.

Lawyer Peter Daley looks at the prospects for a case. Basically it is a no hoper so lets hope the TAs waste their time and money on it. Especially as it looks like Agent Joylon may be the one taking it to court - with him in charge they are particularly doomed.

The assertion is being made that the Supreme Court judgment in FWS places the UK in breach of its ECHR obligations, as laid out in the case of Goodwin v UK. A court case is apparently being prepared on this basis.
I think this may be seriously misguided.
https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/1916519030279594463.html

Why do you think it will need to be ‘enforced’?
Are trans people really so disrespectful of women that they won’t obey the law en mass?

This is deffo not just a U.K. thing, trans overreach does appear to have germinated in the Anglosphere but it’s spreading everywhere (a Scottish parliamentarian recently likened trans ideology to ‘Japanese Knotweed’) and as the overreach spreads, so will the pushback.

Here’s an Austrian feminist describing a remarkably similar situation to where the U.K. was pre the Forstater ruling at the Court of Appeal:

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=_q4hQea-4Ak

Invi

I don't think this is the realistic scenario. On the other hand UK policy now states that everyone should use facilities based on "SEX". So then the question is, how UK is going to enforce this...

You don't think that women will now be emboldened to challenge men, who had hitherto relied on a misrepresentation of the law to bully and hector them? Or that their shouts won't bring other people?

Males are not a 'minority'. Males are the oppressor sex class. And their violence is shown in the way they have lashed out in protests. These men are violent and dangerous, and prove our point. Laws exist to protect females because we are vulnerable. You males are not vulnerable, and your hateful misogynistic bigotry and ignorance won't change that.

It doesn't mean the male sex class, if that's what you're wondering.

You still have exactly the same healthcare we all do. What you no longer have, is the right to use dangerous drugs that will harm and kill you or innocent children, nor sterilise and castrate them.

in order to make bigots more comfortable

This just PROVES you think with Male Pattern Thought Process. No woman or rape survivor like me is a 'bigot' for wanting privacy, dignity and safety. You, are the bigot for thinking your male privilege is more important than my right to privacy, dignity and safety. You are the bigot. And you think with such a self-absorbed intense level of Male Entitlement that there is nothing female in how you think. You have no empathy for women and girls. You're the bigot here. And the more you call rape survivors 'bigots', the more I admit hoping you do suffer through this. That you violated female spaces for decades says more about your lack of humanity and about your Male Entitlement than you could imagine. We are the marginalised group, you are the oppressors. Women said no more!

It's about privacy and dignity away from the male gaze, not just safety. But as you're a male I don't expect you to get that. And you've shown a profound lack of ability to have any empathy for anyone, other than males.

@Invi thanks for responding.
I find your post confusing. Why do you assume that sex segregation will need enforcing beyond explaining clearly for everyone how the law works?
I don't want to extrapolate too much from your posts but it seems like you're saying stealth trans women will feel compelled to do as much as they can get away with? (Insofar as accessing services and amenities set apart for female people).

May I ask you, why do you expect someone who lived as a woman over a decade, have female friends, career, family and whole circle of friends who don't know about my past to disclose? Why would I do that? That's a sincere question.

Not using female bathroom for example would pose a question why. Answer to that question would place me among pariah class which is now labeled as problem, as mentally ill, incapable, dangerous (thanks for that). Also using male spaces as UK expects of people like me would be humiliating, loss of dignity and I cannot even imagine male stare at my body in changing room. That's insanity and that's why ECtHR will rule against it.

This whole concept of passing trans women in men's rooms will never work because it's counter intuitive. Mammalian brains went through millions of years of evolution to evolve sex recognition system based on genitals and secondary sex characteristics. Courts nor governments can legislate that out.

Perhaps you should have considered the consequences before trying to fool everyone you’re close to into thinking you’re something you’re not first then? By the way one cannot ‘live as a woman’ unless one is a woman.

So because you might be embarrassed in front of your friends, women should be unable to meet without men, be raped and assaulted in prisons and on hospital wards, be compelled to undress in front of any man who claims the privilege with no right of refusal, be compelled to surrender to a strip search from a man who claims he's a woman, have no right to privacy or dignity from men or right to same sex carers, be unable to have a lesbian only group, or have access to a single sex refuge to escape a life threatening relationship? Have I got that right?

Are you serious?

Also using male spaces as UK expects of people like me would be humiliating, loss of dignity and I cannot even imagine male stare at my body in changing room. That's insanity and that's why ECtHR will rule against it.

But you've been perfectly happy to inflict that on women.

And you expect the ECtHR to defend such things for men, but not women?

I think any male person who has made their life now unmanageable because they made choices based on their philosophical belief about their own identity that are not materially real probably needs to have extensive mental health support. Because now they need to understand that entering female single sex provisions was never appropriate and was not consented to.

It is not up to female people to continue to accept being disrespected in this way. Society was not there to be manipulated to suit someone’s belief about their identity that was not based on material reality.

The law you wish to overturn is women and homosexual people's equality, rights and protections in law, because them having boundaries and rights is inconvenient to you. Largely you want the legal right of supremacy over them so that you can override their consent and right to say no to you, even about your access to them in a state of undress and to intimately handle them (if you chose to become a cop for example.)

And you think this is your 'human right'

May I ask you, why do you expect someone who lived as a woman over a decade, have female friends, career, family and whole circle of friends who don't know about my past to disclose? Why would I do that? That's a sincere question.

You should do what every law-abiding person would do and follow the law. And in this case if the service is for women only, you keep out.

It really isn't difficult, or complicated or as outrageous as many commentators are suggesting, otherwise we wouldnt have had the services in the first place.

NRTFT but worried that the new thing will be services and businesses going from providing things as single sex to making them all mixed sex to avoid all the hassle. Which will be shit for women. See government quotes about gender neutral toilets being the way forward etc.

And remember everyone, this philosophical belief that some people have that in no way reflects material reality, has in the past been referred to as ‘living authentically’. But it is not authentic, it never was.

It all relied on forced changes to language and society being emotionally manipulated into accepting falsehoods to be ‘kind’.

What we have see in the massive outpouring of male people telling us they are going to just ignore the law is how deep this mass emotional manipulation has gone. It was never about safety for them really.

Not providing single sex provision could be seen as indirect discrimination.

Also, women have a lot of purchasing power and influence. I dont go to a local restaurant because im not happy using their toilets. If enough people think the same way, the company would have to do something about it to keep custom.

If you can’t think of a good reason why a woman who believes TWAW would choose to use a toilet other than women-only at the moment, you don’t sound like a very good trans ally at all.

Why couldn’t you just say that you’re not using women-only bathrooms at the moment because trans women can’t? If you pass as well as you say you do, why do you think that would out you as trans?

It sounds like you’re more interested in ensuring you continue to pass as a woman who believes transwomen are men, even if it’s to the detriment of the majority of trans people who don’t pass. Essentially kicking the ladder away behind you now that you apparently pass.

Oh god this is a pointless discussion...

I shared what was asked for, how we passing trans women perceive the situation. That's all.

People like me won't destroy their life a over non-issue. If you want to help all women, you will deal with the invaders who aren't even medicalised. But you clearly are those people from 90s who hated on everything which they don't undertand.

Have a nice evening in the UK. This is the last message from the IRL undisclosed trans person who is disappearing back in the normal life.

Firstly, you won't pass so you won't be outed anyway.

Why do you think your choice to pose as a woman outweighs the rights and needs of actual women and girls?

Why do you not consider the loss of dignity for women and girls for having a male in our space?

ECtHR have already said they're not touching it, and even trans lawyers and advocates have said it has no chance in being changed by them, so you're delusional.

Mammalian brains went through millions of years of evolution to evolve sex recognition system based on genitals and secondary sex characteristics.

Which is exactly why males like you need to stay out of female spaces, @Invi .

Last comment, because you seem to be at least trying to discuss and get to know my opinion instead of lecturing me about how I should live my life:

The answer is empathy.

Women: No
Transwoman: That's not fair. Why can't I be considered
Women: No. Privacy. Dignity.
Transwoman: I'm going to do it anyway. I've done it for years. Toys. Pram. I'm just like a woman cos I pass. You aren't listening to me.
Women: We listened. We disagree. The answer is still no. They are our toilets in law. Not yours.

Again, I promise you don't pass. None of you do. So it's not a secret.

And you're running away rather than listening to other people's point of view and considering the needs of someone other than yourself. Your whole attitude reeks of selfish and self-absorbed male entitlement, you don't understand how women feel because of your male entitlement. Your entire attitude outs you as male.