Pronouns - I’ve peaked 🥺

[MotherEarthisaTerf]

I was a bloody typical “be nice” feminist.

I went from respecting all pronouns, to not respecting pronouns of people who didn’t respect women (eg Imane Khelif etc etc) and occasionally using they/ them.

Today I was reading a thread on Reddit re Dr Upton and it was such a world away from reading Mumsnet’s posts - where we happily call a spade a spade. Call a man a man.

Reading Reddit, the she / her pronouns just made the whole situation sound much worse for Dr Upton. It automatically appeared Dr Upton was going through more of an ordeal - and that’s not from the content of the posts, which were to be expected, the tone made me feel more sympathetic due to the pronouns used.

It feels much harsher but it’s MUCH clearer what the issues are when pronouns match the facts, not the niceties.

However it’s something I hugely struggle with. Anyone else out there who battle with this ick?

Well, exactly. I wouldn't.

I don't think his interaction with male coaches and so on bears any of this out.

Being a male person is objectively verifiable and doesn't rely on someone's concession or agreement.

It's literally not look up AIS but fine.

I see. If you were in Khelif's position, you would not concede that you were male, even though that has been shown through testing to be true.

And you then post a question about why people question Khelif's respect for female people? Ok.

Look up 5ARD. Your AIS theory don't stand up to scrutiny.

And maybe read the leaked endrocrinologist report linked up thread. That if it was false, would have been removed from the internet by now, and has not.

Wrong thread I have reported

Why are you so obsessed with this?

In the article linked, I thought the picture of the cis nurse must be the trans woman, before reading the caption -- thus disproving the oft-stated suggestion that we can always tell who is male and who is female. We cannot.

Why are YOU so obsessed with this?

What article are you referring to? There are lots of links now on this thread. Please be specific.

This one: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c8j8dygdm19o

I'm not obsessed but you seem to spend half your life banging on about this on here.

What do I spend half my life banging on about?

Sometimes a blurry photo of a man can look like a woman. And vice versa. So what?

"In the article linked, I thought the picture of the cis nurse must be the trans woman, before reading the caption -- thus disproving the oft-stated suggestion that we can always tell who is male and who is female. We cannot."

Are you saying that you, personally cannot tell, so you think that no one can?

And that the statement that within a population, over time and interaction that some other people are highly likely to (in fact across the population there will be someone who will with a high level of certainty) correctly sex someone, is incorrect?

It is also very usually said that a single photograph might be unreliable to correctly determine a person's correct sex.

Trans people. Have a nice day.

Do you think women should stay silent as their rights are eroded then?

I can tell. So can my female rescue dog.

But I realise some people cannot tell. IME it can often be an autism thing. Or a male thing.

Blokes are far more likely to think a fellow bloke in a frock is a woman than an actual woman is.

Ok. I'm not autistic or male.

Perhaps you need new spectacles then?

Of course, real life is very different to a photo - Dr Upton is over a foot taller than Nurse Peggie and has a proportionate head size for a male over 6ft tall, ie wouldn’t be able to wear an off-the peg hat from the women’s section unless it was a very stretchy, knitted style one.

I work for the NHS, I was role told to put pronouns in my email ( of which I think is a load of bollocks, I am clearly female).

I now have her/majesty on mine..

Indeed, why oh why can someone not think of the children!

Women respectfully punching someone in the face for fun and/or money is such a popular Western Idea.
Its too outragous to believe the progressive shrinking violets snowdrops of that family would not be mortified.

Nice move😬

I think nobody has properly considered how it must feel .......

Being a nice person you decided it would be a great idea to upload pictures of individuals so you can debate if the individual meets your definition of male or female.

But people can now claim that MN is "anti " and "mean" because someone uploades images

In the article linked, I thought the picture of the cis nurse must be the trans woman

So?

Ok. I'm not autistic or male.

Dr Upton says Dr Upton isn't male either. It's not something you can rely on to mean anything any more, thanks to the fringe ideology you appear to support.

There’s not been an announcement of relaxation of rules so it still feels like deletion roulette. I’ve had deletions in the past that have made no sense unless I’d slipped up and used a male pronoun for a male. We don’t get a copy of the offending post or a proper reason, it’s usually ‘not in the spirit’ if you get a reason at all.

I understand we’re ‘allowed’ to use ‘he’ for convicted rapists here.