NHS Fife tries to silence nurse - Sandie Peggie vs NHS Fife Health Board and Dr Beth Upton - thread #4

[nauticant]

Sandie Peggie, a nurse at Victoria Hospital in Kirkcaldy (VH), has brought claims in the employment tribunal against her employer; Fife Health Board (the Board) and another employee, Dr B Upton. Ms Peggie’s claims are of sexual harassment, harassment related to a protected belief, indirect discrimination and victimisation. Dr Upton claims to be a transwoman, that is observed as male at birth but asserting a female gender identity.

The Employment Tribunal hearing started on Monday 3 January 2025 and is expected to continue for 2 weeks.

Access to view the hearing remotely can be obtained by sending an email request to [email protected] headed Public Access Request (Peggie v Fife Health Board) 4104864/2024 and requesting access.

Thread 1: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5186317-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse

Thread 2: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5267591-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-thread-2

Thread 3: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5268347-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-3

The hearing is being live tweeted by https://x.com/tribunaltweets and there's additional information here: https://tribunaltweets.substack.com/p/peggie-vs-fife-health-board-and-dr. This also has threadreaderapp archives of live-tweeting of the sessions of the hearing for those who can't follow on Twitter, for example: archive.is/xkSxy.

An alternative to Twitter is to use Nitter: https://nitter.poast.org/tribunaltweets

Well you're NOT RESPECTING SP ON A BASIC LEVEL ARE YOU?

I wonder if some of those support people are other staff from the hospital. A massive intimidation tactic

I wondered that too.

DU You've got to respect each other on a basic level. 🙄

Is he implying that SP is putting patients at risk by ignoring him?

I expect it's a mixture of financial gain, underestimating SP, misogyny and dark ages NHS hierarchy.
I used to be a staff nurse and IME, nurses commonly do not have each other's backs like the BMA and drs have.

Talking now about how essential communication and trust with colleagues is. "Reflecting on it afterwards... we need to think about this going forward because in this case I was able to get the information I needed to make a safe decision about this patient but.... if I can't rely on someone to communicate with me then I can't do my job"

Yup.

The bloody NHS not providing single sex and separate gender whatever spaces is the problem here - that created a bad workplace environment.

Funnily enough women who are being abused and who don't have human rights aren't all sunshiny and happy all the time.

He's saying if he 'can't rely on someone communicating with me' it affects patients. But he has form for ignoring what SP says - he ignored her request for a single sex space. So why would she bother after that? He ignores her needs and perceptions!

I bet there were times when SP did speak to him about patients but he has conveniently not made notes of those times

This reported conversation where person C says to SP "So, DU was looking for you to ask if there was anything of concern when you saw patient X."

And DU noted that SP replied to person C to say "no, nothing of note"

That's it. That's the issue. That's the whole complaint. That she replied but addressed it to person C not DU even though Person C spoke to her and related the question.

It seems unlike many many other interactions the rest of us have had at work.

He really does think it's normal to document a running commentary on his interactions on his phone.

I "felt sad" "I tried to give people the benefit of the doubt but that is why to keep a record as evidence that something is happening... I didn't want to make a fuss and have a formal process... but if it did escalate which it is and it has the impact to impact on my care and patient care then it must be looked at"

Just got to the end of this and need to go out now. Wow just wow.

pictures on X of DU arriving at the tribunal today in a scarf over part of his face surrounded by a group of friends whose appearances are as expected.

Lawyers will usually IME completely avoid clients or witnesses giving evidence, and will usually suggest if it's over lunch that witnesses go their separate ways to avoid any potential suggestions. If it's a couple or family overnight, obviously you don't tell them not to talk at all, but give a strong warning about sticking to dinner / weather / anything-but-the-case chat.

Really stalkery.

commenting on the impacts of patient care of SP not being jolly with him. When he's overriden her boundaries.

Let's get on to patients who recognise your sex and the impact on them, please.

So, he had the correct information. But then threw mud about something that didn’t happen. But ‘IF’ I hadn’t. Sly bugg*r.

That would be a good question to ask - if she never spoke to him or looked at him in the work setting that would be unprofessional

Oh this is actually quite beautiful in terms of Operation Let Them Speak.

He honestly couldn't come across as more creepy and entitled if he tried.

He's getting very comfortable in telling his story. With no clue about how he's coming across.

Keep going sir...

Most of these 'sad incidents' wouldn't even make it on to busy A And E dept staffs radar, but he's got time to not only watch for all these details but make copious notes about it during his actual shift in one occasion.

Who's supposed to be the bully again?

It begs the question of how he manages to think about this whilst also working in A&E, which is a fast moving, high pressure environment in which things can and do go very wrong very quickly, and doctors need to be flexible and able to think on their feet. It doesn't suggest that he was patient focussed.

Woah, he made a wider allegation then. That SP's behaviour would have an impact on the care that he and others could provide.
He really has got it in for her.

As well as his obsession with making women comply with his demands for subservience and 'eye contact'. Ye gods.

My personal opinion from this testimony is that he is a danger to patients. How can he possibly be patient focused when he's this obsessed about minor transgressions - so she spoke to another colleague instead of him. So fucking what?

Which is probably why SP has had to press this to tribunal. She has been accused of bigotry, harrassment and poor professional conduct - potentially devastating claims for her privately and professionally. Not something you can let lie - I understand her need to clear her name and not IMO vexatious

This.