Page 8 | French Gynaecologist Suspended for refusing to treat a TW

TwistedWonder · 2025-01-30T16:03:16+00:00

[[https://reduxx.info/france-gynecologist-suspended-from-practice-after-lgbt-organization-files-transphobia-complaint https://reduxx.info/france-gynecologist-suspended-from-practice-after-lgbt-organization-files-transphobia-complaint/]] Despite telling the TW it wasn’t his area of expertise and offering to refer him he’s deemed transphobic apparently. FFS make this BS stop

Winterwonders24 · 31/01/2025 07:25

PokerFriedDips · 31/01/2025 04:50

I agree. This response is genuinely transphobic. It's not transphobic for a gynecologist to decline to treat a transwoman but doing so in such a rude way is wrong.

He could have written:

>>

Dear (name) [no need to use sir to make a nasty point or to use madam to be sycophantic] Regretfully I am unable to provide the service you ask for. I am a specialist in the female reproductive organs, and these are very different from the physical situation of transwomen whether pre or post surgery. It would be very unprofessional of me to offer care and treatment for your situation when it is not my field of expertise. Please seek appropriate care from a specialist in healthcare for transwomen.

>>

That wouldn't have been transphobic. I find it hard to support the gynecologist when he has been so nasty. It's perfectly possible to be both GC and respectful and polite, without pandering to unrealistic fantasies.

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You're right; but polite is a choice, and respect is earned,and the aggression and boundary pushing he was faced with does not earn respect.

Original poster

TwistedWonder · 31/01/2025 07:30

Pinkcornfield · 31/01/2025 00:39

Apparently it shouldn’t matter what bits a person has.
The Times reports that Espace Santé Trans, a transgender health group, said in a statement: “Gynaecologists should treat trans women even if they have not had genital reassignment surgery or hormonal treatment.”

(They don’t seem to have ever heard of medical specialties…)

How bloody ridiculous

So a gynaecologist who specialises in women’s reproductive health is supposed to examine a set of cock and balls outside his area of expertise just because the p rein chains to be female?

It’s got beyond parody

OP posts:

2021x · 31/01/2025 07:51

I don’t think a TW would have genuinely booked an appointment with a gynaecologist. They are dysphoric not delusional.

This is a set up by an attention-seeking twat, who met their match. The response was after abusive behaviour by the patient.

Carriemac · 31/01/2025 07:52

InvisibleDragon · 30/01/2025 16:51

I'm going to go against the grain and say that his message, as shown in the image above, is unnecessarily rude and dismissive. It says:

SIR,
I am a gynaecologist and I look after real women. I am not qualified to look after MEN, even if they shave their beard and come to tell my secretary that they have become women. My GYNAECOLOGICAL examination table is not adapted for examining men. You have specialised and extremely competent services to look after men like you.

Whilst I understand the factual position that a gynaecologist works with female reproductive organs, to repeatedly refer to the client as a man, sir and so on is inflammatory and not particularly helpful to anyone.

Inflammatory to tell the truth??? Come on don't be ridiculous

Waterboatlass · 31/01/2025 07:55

Winterwonders24 · 31/01/2025 07:25

You're right; but polite is a choice, and respect is earned,and the aggression and boundary pushing he was faced with does not earn respect.

Show quote history

Not in a this instance, no. A patient presenting to a Dr , even if they can't be treated, doesn't need to 'earn the right' to civility and discretion, plus behaviour that doesn't publicly discuss their gender status without their explicit consent to do so. Dr A should have ignored the comment, responded privately or maybe put something general about the scope of his work. Social media rowing isn't part of a doctor's role.

I am very gender critical but this comment was out of line. Whatever one's politics, this holds true and he was right to be pulled up. It's not what he did, it's what he said.

RoyalCorgi · 31/01/2025 07:59

A bit of helpful advice, Sharp. Advertising your ignorance of a subject - in this case, Reduxx, which is a news site full of superb investigative journalism on topics that should be covered by the mainstream press, but aren't - isn't a convincing way of demonstrating how much cleverer you are than everyone else.

Now let's all take a moment to relish the irony of Sharp calling for critical thinking to be made compulsory.

HipMax · 31/01/2025 08:00

Waterboatlass · 31/01/2025 07:55

Not in a this instance, no. A patient presenting to a Dr , even if they can't be treated, doesn't need to 'earn the right' to civility and discretion, plus behaviour that doesn't publicly discuss their gender status without their explicit consent to do so. Dr A should have ignored the comment, responded privately or maybe put something general about the scope of his work. Social media rowing isn't part of a doctor's role.

I am very gender critical but this comment was out of line. Whatever one's politics, this holds true and he was right to be pulled up. It's not what he did, it's what he said.

Show quote history

If it was genuinely about what he said, he wouldn't have been told that he has to treat TW (men) I'm future, or fave further sanction.

MrsOvertonsWindow · 31/01/2025 08:03

SharpOpalNewt · 31/01/2025 05:39

I've said my piece and can see that no further constructive discussion is possible on this thread.

While some of your comments are positively dripping in "constructive discussion" 😂

"...-What the fuck is Reduxx when it's at home and why are you relying on this site for coverage of news?
-Do you not think it may convey a certain slant on trans issues and what you are reading may be seen from a different, more objective and less inflammatory angle?
I really wish media studies and critical thinking were complusory in education."

You've simply been disagreed with on a thread full of constructive discussion, information, some exasperation and at times some women being very cross.

HipMax · 31/01/2025 08:07

If a man went to a dentist and demanded he dealt with piles and look up his arse, do you think the dentist would need to patient, kind, respectful, devise a treatment plan.....

Nah.

AstonScrapingsNameChange · 31/01/2025 08:23

IdaGlossop · 30/01/2025 22:46

It's the tone that has defined the transphobia in this case. 'Men like you' must have been said with the intention of being hostile.

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Sorry but you can't speak to the contents of another person's mind - you can't reasonably assert what the Dr 'must' have meant or intended, we can only comment on what was actually said.

The person is a man, that is the whole point of the conversation. If he wasn't there would be no issue.

If by 'transphobia' you mean misgendering - sometimes sex is relevant, like in this scenario.

Justme56 · 31/01/2025 08:38

https://www.euronews.com/2023/09/15/a-cavity-is-not-a-vagina-trans-woman-refused-healthcare-in-france

The event was covered at the time by other media too. I can understand the Dr’s original reaction, which he appears to have apologised for but he does suggest that the TW was allegedly abusive to his staff at the incident. Obviously abusive patients are an issue. The name of the partner (from the tweet) brings up a political activist in the area although this could be someone completely different than this person with the same name.

Vertigo2851 · 31/01/2025 08:42

I agree. This response is genuinely transphobic. It's not transphobic for a gynecologist to decline to treat a transwoman but doing so in such a rude way is wrong.
He could have written:
>>

Dear (name) [no need to use sir to make a nasty point or to use madam to be sycophantic] Regretfully I am unable to provide the service you ask for. I am a specialist in the female reproductive organs, and these are very different from the physical situation of transwomen whether pre or post surgery. It would be very unprofessional of me to offer care and treatment for your situation when it is not my field of expertise. Please seek appropriate care from a specialist in healthcare for transwomen.

>> That wouldn't have been transphobic. I find it hard to support the gynecologist when he has been so nasty. It's perfectly possible to be both GC and respectful and polite, without pandering to unrealistic fantasies.

What is your definition of transphobia? Being a bit rude isn’t transphobic is it.

AllPlayedOut · 31/01/2025 08:53

Going to such lengths to avoid addressing the very pertinent fact that he is a man, considering that his being male exactly why the Doctor can’t treat him, is pandering to unrealistic fantasies imo.

Waterboatlass · 31/01/2025 09:01

HipMax · 31/01/2025 08:00

If it was genuinely about what he said, he wouldn't have been told that he has to treat TW (men) I'm future, or fave further sanction.

Show quote history

The comments forum response to this one patient 's frustrations (or their family 's) was not the time or place for Dr A to push back against policy using ad hom and insensitive language. The patient identifies as a trans woman. There is a lot wrong with trans ideology and expectations but a doctor simply cannot rant about beards and suchlike at a patient publicly. Gender dysphoria is associated with a number of MH and ND conditions and this behaviour may prevent the cause long term by entrenching this polarised view, and preventing patients seeking healthcare. I think some posters are a political win when there is not one. A correct clinical judgement, yes, but not a reasoned response in his position.

Waterboatlass · 31/01/2025 09:01

See a political win**

Justme56 · 31/01/2025 09:16

I think it’s human nature to get riled when a person has allegedly been abusive to your staff because they have been told no, as respectively as possible, especially when this can affect a person’s livelihood. Going forward I hope gynaecologists make it clear on their websites etc who they are able to treat and who they cannot.

IAmTheLittleThings · 31/01/2025 09:17

The madness is now affecting men doing their jobs.
How many men will it take for them to wake up and start to see the problems through our eyes? Maybe lend support and voices?

Whether this appointment was for a personal thrill or to discredit gynecologists in general, it definitely wasn't because a smear test was required!

BunfightBetty · 31/01/2025 09:21

HipMax · 31/01/2025 08:07

If a man went to a dentist and demanded he dealt with piles and look up his arse, do you think the dentist would need to patient, kind, respectful, devise a treatment plan.....

Nah.

He’d be seen as the vexatious eejit he was, instead of tip-toed around as the most vulnerable.

ArabellaScott · 31/01/2025 09:26

Dysphoria and delusion are certainly not necessarily mutually exclusive. There may be an argument that the former often stems from or is associated with the latter. See also anorexia, BIID, etc.

Datun · 31/01/2025 09:28

I can't help sighing that people think if he'd only said it like this, or like that.

The fact he wasn't going to treat this person, purely on the basis that they are not female, was the issue. It wouldn't have mattered what he said. The furious pushback would've been ongoing.

And if the partner of the transwoman is indeed an activist, entirely deliberate. Well of course it's deliberate. Activist or not

You might then get into the situation where you say, well he shouldn't let himself be goaded. But then where the fuck are we?

I was struck by OldCrone's comment here.

It may have been the first time he'd been faced with transactivism, and thought he was just stating facts that all reasonable people would agree with. I think we forget on here sometimes that large numbers of people really have no idea what's going on.

Because people's knowledge of this, and therefore reaction to it, is indeed on a spectrum.

Many women know the score, know when they're being set up, know they're being intimidated, coerced, and threatened, and this is an example of it, and their reaction is no, this is ridiculous, he's a bloke, end of.

And many people have no idea that what this transwoman is doing is transactivation. They just know a man has walked into their surgery and demanded to be treated by gynaecologist. And their reaction will be exactly the same. No, this is ridiculous, you're a bloke! Outrage and incredulity is a normal reaction.

It's a testament to how much we have been trained by this ideology that what would've been considered a completely normal reaction 10 or 15 years ago is now considered unprofessional and rude.

selffellatingouroborosofhate · 31/01/2025 09:33

IdaGlossop · 30/01/2025 22:46

It's the tone that has defined the transphobia in this case. 'Men like you' must have been said with the intention of being hostile.

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Show quote history

There's a difference in English between "men, like you" and "men like you". The first doesn't carry the perjorative subtext of the second.

The original French text may not read to a French person the way that the translation reads to an English person. We cannot really judge tone based on a translation.

PinkoPonko · 31/01/2025 09:34

InvisibleDragon · 30/01/2025 16:51

I'm going to go against the grain and say that his message, as shown in the image above, is unnecessarily rude and dismissive. It says:

SIR,
I am a gynaecologist and I look after real women. I am not qualified to look after MEN, even if they shave their beard and come to tell my secretary that they have become women. My GYNAECOLOGICAL examination table is not adapted for examining men. You have specialised and extremely competent services to look after men like you.

Whilst I understand the factual position that a gynaecologist works with female reproductive organs, to repeatedly refer to the client as a man, sir and so on is inflammatory and not particularly helpful to anyone.

But the TW going to the gyno and insisting on being treated isn’t inflammatory at all? There comes a point when people need to stop being placated when they are behaving badly, whether they are trans or anyone else. The TW took a valuable appointment from a female patient who actually would need it, and then tried the usual ‘discipline and punish’ tactics when refused treatment. Well, it worked, and the gyno is paying for it.

Wemaybebetterstrangers · 31/01/2025 09:37

“Just because it’s a cavity doesn’t mean it’s a classic vagina.”

😂

selffellatingouroborosofhate · 31/01/2025 09:41

Datun · 31/01/2025 09:28

I can't help sighing that people think if he'd only said it like this, or like that.

The fact he wasn't going to treat this person, purely on the basis that they are not female, was the issue. It wouldn't have mattered what he said. The furious pushback would've been ongoing.

And if the partner of the transwoman is indeed an activist, entirely deliberate. Well of course it's deliberate. Activist or not

You might then get into the situation where you say, well he shouldn't let himself be goaded. But then where the fuck are we?

I was struck by OldCrone's comment here.

It may have been the first time he'd been faced with transactivism, and thought he was just stating facts that all reasonable people would agree with. I think we forget on here sometimes that large numbers of people really have no idea what's going on.

Because people's knowledge of this, and therefore reaction to it, is indeed on a spectrum.

Many women know the score, know when they're being set up, know they're being intimidated, coerced, and threatened, and this is an example of it, and their reaction is no, this is ridiculous, he's a bloke, end of.

And many people have no idea that what this transwoman is doing is transactivation. They just know a man has walked into their surgery and demanded to be treated by gynaecologist. And their reaction will be exactly the same. No, this is ridiculous, you're a bloke! Outrage and incredulity is a normal reaction.

It's a testament to how much we have been trained by this ideology that what would've been considered a completely normal reaction 10 or 15 years ago is now considered unprofessional and rude.

I can't help sighing that people think if he'd only said it like this, or like that.

There's a reason why I keep talking about tone-policing.

That a trans-identifying male can demand treatment from a gynaecologist, slander the staff as transphobic in their own workplace, libel the gynaecologist online, and then get such a pandering and frankly batshit response from the gynaecologist's professional body absolutely gives the lie to the "most oppressed people evar" claim. Do you think that an actual woman complaining would have resulted in such a sanction?

Many women know the score, know when they're being set up, know they're being intimidated, coerced, and threatened, and this is an example of it, and their reaction is no, this is ridiculous, he's a bloke, end of.

And many people have no idea that what this transwoman is doing is transactivation. They just know a man has walked into their surgery and demanded to be treated by gynaecologist. And their reaction will be exactly the same. No, this is ridiculous, you're a bloke! Outrage and incredulity is a normal reaction.

And people wonder why I'm now on high alert around anyone who looks like they might be trans, has blue hair, or puts pronouns in their email. I'm constantly worried that I will be the next victim of an activist's stitch-up.

Shortshriftandlethal · 31/01/2025 09:55

Somone coming to consult you as a professional in your area of specialism, knowing full well, that their requirements cannot be met by you is simply taking the piss. To waste the doctor's time in this way is pure self indulgence.

"Gynaecologists treat female reproductive systems. You are not female -whatever surgery you have had performed. If you require corrective surgery or treatment you need to see a gender specialist who is qualified to help you. Please stop wasting everyone's time, including your own. Goodbye"