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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions
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32
ApocalipstickNow · 04/11/2024 11:40

A friend of mine posted some finger wagging stuff about IK at the time of the olympics (nothing about his fellow countryman who had raped a child though🤔).

No, I am not expecting his to address it now.

There’s not going to be any “sorry, we wuz wrong” going on, it’ll be social media amnesia.

lcakethereforeIam · 04/11/2024 11:40

lcakethereforeIam · 04/11/2024 11:30

This bit

The report concludes by recommending Khelif be referred for “surgical correction and hormone therapy,” to help him physically align with his self-perceived gender identity, and adds that psychological support would be required because the results had caused a “very significant neuropsychiatric impact.”

made me have the slightest soupçon of sympathy for him. I can only think because I'm a little soft in the head. Then I read back, the tests were done in 2923, and any sympathy I had evaporated.

However, I don't think he's the real or, maybe, only villain here. He was enabled, even encouraged by a whole rotten apparatus.

Then there's the other guy, Taiwan's Lin Yu-ting. Khelif doesn't seem to have been the only male cheat in the boxing. I don't think it's right that Lin Yu-ting should escape scrutiny. I'm not sure why that's happened.

Bugger, fat fingers

the tests were done in 2023!!!

But, if in 2923 they should dig up Khelif's bones (from where they'd been deposited after a long life spent acquiring wisdom) they'd be recognisably male.

RVEllacott · 04/11/2024 11:41

Helleofabore · 04/11/2024 11:34

This male boxer had all the facts and chose to deliberately act this way. You can empathise all you like but this needs to be acknowledged. Before getting into the ring, this person understood they were male and had even been excluded from two boxing federations bouts because of it.

This. I have a DC with a chromosome disorder and have huge sympathy for anyone navigating this but competing at the Olympics is a choice. They choose to put themselves in a position where they had an unfair and dangerous advantage over their opponents knowing they would be under scrutiny on the world stage.

BecauseRonald · 04/11/2024 11:43

lcakethereforeIam · 04/11/2024 11:30

This bit

The report concludes by recommending Khelif be referred for “surgical correction and hormone therapy,” to help him physically align with his self-perceived gender identity, and adds that psychological support would be required because the results had caused a “very significant neuropsychiatric impact.”

made me have the slightest soupçon of sympathy for him. I can only think because I'm a little soft in the head. Then I read back, the tests were done in 2923, and any sympathy I had evaporated.

However, I don't think he's the real or, maybe, only villain here. He was enabled, even encouraged by a whole rotten apparatus.

Then there's the other guy, Taiwan's Lin Yu-ting. Khelif doesn't seem to have been the only male cheat in the boxing. I don't think it's right that Lin Yu-ting should escape scrutiny. I'm not sure why that's happened.

He hasn't courted the limelight and done stuff like "sue JKR"

Keenovay · 04/11/2024 11:43

Don't the women boxers who fought him have a good case to sue the Olympic committee that permitted this? It was extremely reckless of them, to show this disregard for women's safety.

Unless the OC are playing a risky version of Operation Sunlight / Let Them Punch?

eatfigs · 04/11/2024 11:44

Same DSD as Caster Semenya: 5-ARD.

These guys keep showing up in women's sport and are so brazen about it even when they know fine well that they're male.

CandyLeBonBon · 04/11/2024 11:46

They all knew. We all knew. It's so depressing

BecauseRonald · 04/11/2024 11:47

Mainoo72 · 04/11/2024 10:46

He’s such a cheat. I hope his Olympic medal is stripped.

But thats what the problem is. No rules were broken. I am seething again

BecauseRonald · 04/11/2024 11:58

BigFrau · 04/11/2024 11:33

Who are you referring to as 'she' in this scenario?

Imane Khelif

I understand that Khelif identifies as a woman. I'm happy to be corrected. Personally I think that people with DSD should be able to choose their social identity if that makes sense. For DSD and sports, I think the criteria that olympics athletics has is pretty good.

theilltemperedqueenofspacetime · 04/11/2024 11:59

Well, I think he's been ill-used. He should have been given appropriate medical treatment/counselling as soon as he started going through male puberty, instead of which he's been turned into a public spectacle and subjected to (potentially health-damaging) androgen blockade.

Sure, he had choices. But he's also a very young person being used by a massive sports promotion money-making machine.

IOC could stop this ever happening to anyone again, by introducing mandatory sex testing (eg SRY gene plus androgen sensitivity) for female sports categories.

Boiledbeetle · 04/11/2024 12:01

Shocked face.

theilltemperedqueenofspacetime · 04/11/2024 12:01

BecauseRonald · 04/11/2024 11:58

Imane Khelif

I understand that Khelif identifies as a woman. I'm happy to be corrected. Personally I think that people with DSD should be able to choose their social identity if that makes sense. For DSD and sports, I think the criteria that olympics athletics has is pretty good.

I disagree. World Athletics requires androgen blockade, which is both unhealthy and does not reverse male physiological advantage.

ETA I agree with you about social identity, though, for people with DSDs

TomatoSandwiches · 04/11/2024 12:04

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

ExitPursuedByABare · 04/11/2024 12:06

Well colour me surprised.

Ereshkigalangcleg · 04/11/2024 12:07

What a truly astounding turn of events.

lcakethereforeIam · 04/11/2024 12:12

There should be mandatory chromosome/sex testing, because I'm feeling generous, some immediate help available for the athletes that might fail. Some of them may genuinely not have an earthly that they're genetically male.

Freydo · 04/11/2024 12:13

Good. I had a row with my woke DD who insisted he was a woman. She later consulted with her ‘non-binary’ friend who despite being woker than woke, also thought he was a man!

duc748 · 04/11/2024 12:15

All this is to no-one's surprise, but all the people who were screaming about it on SM and claiming IK as some heroic victim of prejudice won't believe it when it's in Reduxx. Maybe, just maybe, if it was plastered all over the BBC and the Guardian...

duc748 · 04/11/2024 12:20

And no sympathy for IK himself (and even less for the Taiwanese boxer), he has been pretty brazen and cynical. But the IOC come out of this as the real shits. They are the complete antithesis of what the Olympic spirit is supposed to be about.

PronounssheRa · 04/11/2024 12:21

In other news bears do indeed shit in the woods

On a more serious note the IOC are a disgrace to let this happen, as is IK for going along with it knowing that women could get seriously hurt.

HappyTwo · 04/11/2024 12:22

I think what happened in the Olympics is appalling and people with XY chromosomes should not be in women's sport and I am also a huge advocate for safe women's spaces - but I think publishing someone's private medical records is appalling too.

RatitesUnite · 04/11/2024 12:22

Looked like a duck, walked like a duck, quacked like a duck…quelle surprise.

Boiledbeetle · 04/11/2024 12:22

The “ hormonal exploration ” reveals a “male type testosterone level of 14.7”, while the female gender does not exceed the maximum level of 3.

archive.is/sPWL9

BeBraveLittlePenguin · 04/11/2024 12:24

lcakethereforeIam · 04/11/2024 11:30

This bit

The report concludes by recommending Khelif be referred for “surgical correction and hormone therapy,” to help him physically align with his self-perceived gender identity, and adds that psychological support would be required because the results had caused a “very significant neuropsychiatric impact.”

made me have the slightest soupçon of sympathy for him. I can only think because I'm a little soft in the head. Then I read back, the tests were done in 2923, and any sympathy I had evaporated.

However, I don't think he's the real or, maybe, only villain here. He was enabled, even encouraged by a whole rotten apparatus.

Then there's the other guy, Taiwan's Lin Yu-ting. Khelif doesn't seem to have been the only male cheat in the boxing. I don't think it's right that Lin Yu-ting should escape scrutiny. I'm not sure why that's happened.

Because up until the time the report came through he thought all girls had testicles?

PronounssheRa · 04/11/2024 12:27

I think publishing someone's private medical records is appalling too.

I agree to a point, but when there is a cover up, including the IOC and that cover up can harm women, I fear this was the only way the truth would out.

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