They / them at work

[pootlefump]

I've just written a long post and it's disappeared so in brief - how do you deal with staff who are they/them at work? I will really struggle to call a very obvious biological male 'they'. I also can't loose my job and do want to be respectful but also can't change my view on this nonsense !

The bold is what you said just after 9 and I have quoted my own answer back to you.

But what do the average members have to do with the sporting team?

Your second example doesn’t make sense, because you would be the one at the disadvantage, not the whole team. The Lia situation is the other way round.

You know full well that trans women have physical advantages over all women. Larger hearts, longer bones and ligaments, and hormones can’t undo that.

I’m not saying Lia is trans except when she’s not. Quite the opposite. I’m saying she is always trans, and therefore her body has some differences that give her an unfair advantage.

It’s really not that difficult to understand.

Yes,LT is a man and cannot escape from having a male body. The changes are only hormonal and cosmetic ones.

I hear you, Tathing. Those instances are awful. But I don’t believe that an entire group’s rights should be taken away because of a few bad apples.

If that were the case, no one would be allowed to shop, because of shoplifters.

No one would be allowed to catch trains, because of ticket-dodgers. Etc.

People weren’t saying they were a subset of men at all - ie their own thing. They said that they were men, full stop. So trans women don’t exist.

A group of men with a common claim are clearly a subset of men, no?

But I don’t believe that an entire group’s rights should be taken away because of a few bad apples.

I don't believe men ever have the right to use women only spaces. The "bad apples" are certainly relevant but other considerations are more relevant for me.

Trans women are men, so the groupthink goes here.

It must be a novelty to find a space where your ideology is questioned.

Eh, what? I’ve spent this whole thread advocating AGAINST trans women in women’s sport! I DON’T think Lia should swim against women, no matter her transitional stage. Hormones can’t shorten bones and ligaments or make hearts and lungs smaller.

I’ve said over and over that I don’t think Lia should compete against women.

For you too.

But you think this person is a woman, don't you? Why would they not be able to compete against other women?

men being bigger and stronger than women is one of the main reasons we have single sex spaces, services and sports.

Lia shouldn’t be allowed in women’s sports OR women’s spaces.

For you too.

Your ideology holds sway in most of the internet. So it's not a novelty to find someone chanting its mantras and spreading its misinformation, no.

*Eh, what? I’ve spent this whole thread advocating AGAINST trans women in women’s sport! I DON’T think Lia should swim against women, no matter her transitional stage. Hormones can’t shorten bones and ligaments or make hearts and lungs smaller.

I’ve said over and over that I don’t think Lia should compete against women.*

But why? If you think LT is a woman?

You think sex offenders should have the right to access children’s change areas?

Yes we do take away the rights of men to be around women when they are vulnerable even though it is only a small percentage that will do women harm because 99% of sexual assaults are carried out by MEN. So we do not allow men access to women when they are vulnerable because we don't know who can be trusted thus almost eliminating the source of sexual assaults.
Transwomen are male and guess what? Their pattern of behaviour is NO different to males as a class. So it is correct to also exclude them as a group.
You have zero evidence that transwomen sexual assault rates are different do you?

We do have things like CCTV and security guards. So we don't entirely throw our hands up and say "eh, bad apples, what can you do!"

Some of the girls who have shared changing rooms with Lia Thomas allege that Lia flashed Lia's male genitalia at them. Lia should not be in women's spaces.

See, you’re still talking about them as men. So trans women don’t exist to you. You don’t believe they exist. You think they are all man, all the time, no matter what surgery or hormones they’ve had.

Because it’s much easier to hate a man, isn’t it, than to have to acknowledge that there’s a vulnerable group in deep psychological pain who can solve it by becoming as close to being a woman as they can, but for their own safety, they need to share your toilets. The answer from many is no. No matter how much surgery they get or hormones they take or how long they live fully as a woman. You want to deny their existence as trans women, turn them back to the male loos after transition, where they’ll be made mincemeat of, and you don’t care. It’s horrible.

Trans women aren’t out to get you. They transition because they strongly feel
they must in order to be happy. Any man could lie in wait in a loo. You don’t need to go to the trouble of being trans to do that!

This.

See, you’re still talking about them as men.

Why wouldn't I? They're a subset though, aren't they?

OP as you can see, this is what the problem is. You get women thinking about safeguarding and a poster comes on and contradicts himself, has no answers to the important questions because he hasn’t thought it through so ignores and diverts. The 2 studies he does link to to try and support his views are v poor and biased (I have an MSc and the methodology is shocking) and hasn’t got any answers to evidence presented. However you do have lots of links to evidence now to show your workplace.

Going to bed now.

Biological women cannot be transwomen, ergo all transwomen are biological men.

how long they live fully as a woman.

Something you are apparently unable to define. I don't believe it's possible because they are male. Males are not living as women.

Yes, of course you’re denying he exists! To you, he’s a man. So he does not exist as a trans woman. To you, trans women do not exist. You are denying the existence of trans people because you think there are only people who exist are men and women who remain the sex they were at birth.

Your view: Trans people do not exist.

Oh, I know how to define living as a woman. It’s you who doesn’t know. And I think teaching you that is out of my skill set.