Joe Lycett

[theDudesmummy]

I had never heard of this guy before today (I am not a fan of stand up comedy) but I do listen to the political podcast The Newsagents, and they had him on as a guest. He sounded like a sensible person until he suddenly started talking complete faux-naïve bollocks about the trans issue. Something about how how boring it would be if everyone in society was expected to be the same, or some such stuff, and therefore anyone who opposes trans rights is being "boring" as well as wrong. Anyone else hear that? Is this guy in general a TRA or just stupid?

The thing is, if you mainly mix with other well-paid broadcasters, don't have kids or other dependents, will never go near a prison or social worker or need a domestic violence shelter etc - life is a delightful sexual smorgasbord and why shouldn't people express gender and sexuality in any way they like, how beautiful.

Basically he's immune to any of the negative aspects of TWAW, probably knows people who are queer and trans and cares about them and wants them to achieve personal fulfilment.

He's not wrong from his own perspective, but it's a perspective of privilege.

I am a big fan of Joe Lycett actually, in one of his shows he actually gave a definition of sex, being chromosomal and one of gender (how a person feels). There is no compulsion for him to add, "and trans women ARE women and of course should be in female changing rooms.etc.)

He's a Brummie, and as such not says it how it is. His anger is more at injustices like big businesses etc.

In the same comedy he said, he was of a sexuality of liking people who didn't like him back. Honest comedy in my opinion.

Did you know about Beckham and Qatar before he did it? If not, he made his point.

I didn’t. But I was responding to someone that felt he “wimped out” by not shredding £10k of actual money. I think it’s great he donated it to charity.

Just to update, on his TV show last night he announced that he has a girlfriend.

Some of his stuff is funny. Like his dealings with parking authorities, But I don't know there is something about him that I don't like. A smugness an undercurrent of nastiness if you got on the wrong side of him, he doesn't feel authentic. I cant pin point one thing , but something about him makes me wary of taking him at face value.

Yes I know what you mean.

I have no idea of his views specifically but as a mum with a son who likes sparkle, dance and dressing up, I think his TV shows are useful to show that there are lots of ways of behaving as a man. I want my son to be confident that he can be a 'he' and still enjoy all the things he likes doing, and watching travel man ( and Layton Williams on strictly) have been good for that I hope. I don't really care what either of their personal views are.

The problem is the men on tv who are showing boys and men that they can wear whatever they want are also showing that they can dismiss women safeguarding concerns.

Exactly. Wear what you want is not the same as do what you want. Something these men fail to understand.

Not sure if this is a stupid question as I don’t know what a pan sexual is, but can a pan sexual have girlfriends?

That's why I admire Marilyn for his stance on this issue. A genuine gender non conforming man who has stood up for the rights of women and girls. He hasn't had an easy life either. When you think about it, it's a bit of a kick in the teeth for men like him that pushed the boundaries (and would have suffered for it in some quarters) for it to all to go backwards. Men like him would be assumed to want to be the opposite sex now. Sad really.

Pansexual is bisexual, only you dont mind if your girlfriends wears a cravat.

(Its supposed to be trans inclusive, but then that does imply that bisexuals are trans exclusionary)

Joe Lycett is by far the worst dressed person on TV (his dress sense is as bad as his personality). Surely there are better role models than him?

Definitely happy to hear any other suggestions for men who might be good role models and are on something reasonably family friendly (fairly mature 10 year old). I am doing my best to make clear my views on women and girls rights in sport etc to my boys without overdoing it so much they start ignoring me...

Love Joe ❤️

Pansexual is bisexual but with politics.

As above, it’s similar to bisexual but means they will also date people who are trans, non binary etc.

Your day to day wouldn't be changed in any meaningful way by being supportive of trans people either? I feel like no-one's would... (except maybe trans people obviously)

@PistachioLuvr What do you mean by supporting trans people? Because if you mean, treating them as if they actually have changed sex in all circumstances, of course that would change things.

^This.

The two extremes of the debate have an extremely binary, black-and-white approach to this.

The extreme right-wing hate all things trans and will not tolerate even the slightest degree of recognition.

The TRAs require the complete acceptance of every singe trans demand, and if you do not 100% agree then you are 100% the enemy.

In the middle is where the real conversation lies. Unfortunately the "it's not that straight-forward" line rarely wins the argument in the minds of those with an ideological, belief-based interpretation of reality.

(Edited for spelling)

Lycett's a real twat, imho. He recently revealed he was the 'prankster' beyond planting loads of fake news stories about celebs in the media. Har har bloody har you might think but then you might now if you were an honest celeb and a damaging false story was placed about you. He also placed a fake story in social media about the Iranian Embassy being attacked in Syria. If you really worried about fake news, why would you stroll into dangerous geopolitics in so blase a fashion?

Narcissist and classic dunning kruger. He thinks he's a genius.

In general, the male stand up comedy community has a real problem with entrenched misogyny, so they are naturally aggressively TWAW and will bully, 'expose' or squeeze out anyone who fails to toe the line. Spend a bit of time on their professional forums and you'll see this. Francis Foster & Konstantin Kisin have also talked about it.

Yes,as long as they're non-stick and suitable for induction hobs.

In the middle is where the real conversation lies.

But what does this mean?

Either men are women if they say so, or they're not.

There isn't a position in the middle.

Exactly, this is a binary issue, no middle ground for the question of whether people can change sex, or that we should pretend they can.

The only middle ground to be discussed is an analsis of the extent of sex stereotypes in society, and how to undo the superficial ones.