"Period experiencing humans"

[UsuallyJustLurk]

Hope this is the right place. Like many others I've learned a lot from these boards and receiving an email with this language today from ModiBodi (in celebration of the scrapping of VAT on period products) made me so angry. I'm not brave enough to put myself as GC on my socials but did fire off my thoughts in a contact form to the brand directly. Just pointing out that removing "women" from language is degrading and to be truly inclusive, we as women should be included. language IS important. Might not help but wanted my voice to be heard

You make me feel
You make me feel
You make me feel
Like a Period Experiencing Human 🙃

I’m every Period Experiencing Human
It’s all in me…

FFS

WHY can’t they say Women/Girls/Females because even transmen/non-binaries KNOW they’re female even if their ‘gender’ does not align with their sex. Surely that’s the definition of being trans ‘your gender does not align with your sex assigned at birth’ - surely saying Female is therefore not an issue? Or is an issue they can begrudgingly accept when it comes to their menstrual cycle?

Is this ever going to go away? It gets more insane year on year. I hope my DD isn’t having to put up with this shit when she’s my age. What do you reckon? Another 5, 10, 15, 20, 30 years? Forever?

Sinead Watson, an outspoken detransitioned woman who is very active on social media, has actually said that when her gender dysphoria was at its worst and she was "living as a man", she certainly didn't want to be called a person with a cervix or a person who menstruates because these were precisely the things which triggered her dysphoria.

So I have a feeling that this inclusive language isn't even supposed to help people who are truly dysphoric, it's all about the people who appear to be doing it more for political reasons. Probably the same people who go through pregnancy and childbirth whilst claiming to be living as a man.

Yep.

As I said upthread, it feels more lately like those who adhere to the ideological principles of that movement have stopped listening to trans people. Because if some are saying they are triggered by language reminding them they have a cervix or a period whatever, using that specific language is also not working for them.

Yet, those who seem to be ideological in their views cannot reconcile there is an issue. They have to affirm what has been taught mindlessly.

The lobby groups have done a grand job in creating that automated response and normalising pure acceptance over analytical assessment of the impacts of such changes. When you strip away the mantras such as ‘it is inclusive’, you are left with a truth that must be fucking uncomfortable for those who think they are the tolerant and inclusive ones. They have become the unthinking, mantra repeating drones.

Can you imagine the marketing team for the big pharma brands deciding to advertise cough mixture as "for tussis experiencing people"?

I'm really stuck on this thought: what happens in the worst case scenario, if these unwell men succeed in commandeering the word woman? It won't change their reality. They will still be men. Now laws may be changed which is worrying but, at some point, humans will need a word distinct to the category of woman and laws will need to be remade to accommodate reality again because men with confused identities are still not and can never be women. It's such a ridiculous waste of time and a terrible injustice to half the world's population just to appease a small bunch of reality deniers.

I have to admit I don’t care about being «inclusive» regarding a teeny, tiny minority who seem to be triggered by everyday life.

They should get appropriate help.

The rest of us ARE women and girls, men and boys because of our biology - which was determined at conception.

Just one of those things, I’m afraid.

Most women menstruate at fairly regular intervals throughout their lives. Some don’t. We are still women.
Some girls start menstruation very early in their lives, some much later.

So this only happens to girls and women. Not men. Never a single one.
Language is important.

Well really it depends what the objective is, doesn't it?

There will always be both adult and juvenile biologically female humans who alone will experience biological processes relating to menstruation, pregnancy, childbirth, breastfeeding and the menopause. This group will continue to exist and be observed in nature regardless of whether there is a name for this group of people or not.

If the objective is for biologically male people who identify as women and girls to actually be part of this group, they will never succeed because being part of this group depends on fulfilling objective criteria which they can never fulfill, regardless of what hormones they take or what surgery they have.

If the objective is to prevent the people who are actually in that group from having a word for themselves or any sex based rights, spaces or services which exclude biological males, that is something that can be achieved.

So the former is impossible and the latter is very clearly unreasonable.

it feels more lately like those who adhere to the ideological principles of that movement have stopped listening to trans people.

I'm afraid this movement has never been about representing, listening to and caring about trans people - in the same way the use of LGBT as a label does not represent, listen to or care about gay people. They are merely a tool to be used by the political forces that are the likes of LOJ.

It was one of the biggest eye openers to me when I began to have doubts about what the truth was beneath the shiny lovely glittery speak. But you can easily find evidence for yourself: look at how the political lobby speaks to trans people who do not stay on message, or dare to voice wishes or experiences or feelings that do not help the lobby's agenda. I've seen TRAs turn on them in threads here on FWR. If you think they're vicious to women you ain't seen nothing yet, I was appalled. 'Uncle Tom' was one of the mildest things said to them.

Look at how detransitioners are spoken to and treated. Look at how Miranda Yardley and Debbie Hayton are treated. I do not agree with everything they say or their agenda in some cases by any means, but look at how the 'we do it all for trans people' lobby speak to trans people whose lives are not serving their political purpose.

This movement uses. There are two kinds of people. Those whose lives and power through their protected characteristic are useful in the moment to leverage for what the movement wants - sometimes as a lesbian I'm used as useful, while being told that my homosexuality is awful and should be made to stop but also that I am LGBT and can't escape their ownership even though I've been excluded - and those who are not.

And those who in this moment are not useful tools are just dirt under the feet. That's all. That really is all.

I too would like to know why this isn't good enough.

Because it continues to permit the visible reality that women and girls exist as a biological reality.

Which means men are not yet successfully owning womanhood.

Women's reality and lives and needs can't get in the way of less than 1% of men's wants.

Quite. The hypocrisy is fucking astounding.

I no longer think it is hypocrisy, I increasingly think it's just plain old dysfunctionality : a core belief of 'the world and everyone else in it only exist and matter in how I'm affected personally'.

Someone from this political lobby, come prove me wrong. Find a crap to give about others who are not useful to you just because of basic human compassion and equality of values for two minutes. Go on, it's Christmas. Try hard.

I no longer think it is hypocrisy, I increasingly think it's just plain old dysfunctionality : a core belief of 'the world and everyone else in it only exist and matter in how I'm affected personally'.

I agree. Fuelled by narcissism and disordered thinking.

Nobody can change their sex. A female cannot become a male.

If you are so in favour of a laissez faire approach to terminology then whey do you think that some femles object to be referred to as such? Why can they not cope with the word 'woman' - as they attend a female health clinic.

Why must the vast majority of women/females be referred to in such de-humanising ways, do you think?

Yes. I have started thinking that some posters really shouldn’t stop posting because their disconnected thinking becomes clearer and clearer. It seems to be motivated not by trying to understand the truth and navigating inconsistencies in the ideological thinking that is around this issue, but in virtue signaling their own compliance to that faith like belief that they demonstrate in their posts.

The immediate response they feel when reading posts seems to be to scold and attempt to shame women who don’t comply the way that they do. I have given up now expecting any type of in depth engagement because there are some posters who claim to be highly educated yet seem to never produce evidence to discuss that ever supports their position. And it more than one poster that does this.

I wonder if they ever analyse why that is. Why these highly educated posters (from what they say about their qualifications historically that is) can do nothing but post inane posts when they should be able to clearly articulate their position, with evidence to support and be some of the most convincing posters on this forum and beyond?

Supposedly, these are the people with indepth knowledge and supposedly the ability to analyse and discuss information at a higher level than the rest of society. They tell us this proudly in some of their posts. Yet, they cannot post a convincing argument to support their thoughts on this issue. Why is that?

It really does comes across as ideological following rather than independent thinking.

It is what will eventually sink this political movement.

If it had the capacity to even be able to face up to and acknowledge the issues, the conflicts.

If it had the capacity to care about anyone other than itself (the political movement) and it's own agenda and primacy.

If it had the capacity to realise that words like inclusion and kind and tolerant were actually words with meaning that require it equally on both sides rather than a code for 'give me exactly what I want right now' in the manner of Verucca Salt.

There would be the possibility of negotiating answers that work for all, and finding ways that provide what everyone needs.

Instead you get 'evidence/women's voices/issue' and an immediate 'that doesn't exist, everything is wonderful'.

The relationships board is deep in advice on managing a difficult relationship with a dysfunctional person who is unable to be reciprocal and whose actions are damaging to others: that you cannot reason with or change the situation, you cannot explain in a way that reaches through the 'I can't hear you' and 'reality is what I tell you it is'. You can only put up strong boundaries to limit the damage they do while they do their thing. We're seeing this move from an individual relationship level to an entire national political movement level; however any Local Authority or service will tell you, trying to deal with a customer with this kind of dysfunctional behaviour is very similar.