Prof Jo Phoenix vs The OU - Employment Tribunal Thread 5

[ickky]

Started on 2nd October at Watford Employment Tribunal (Radius House, 51 Clarendon Rd, Watford WD17 1HP 01923 281750)

You may attend in person or remote viewing has been quite limited but you can request log in details from

Email [email protected]

Header should read

URGENT CURRENT CASE - Public Access Request - J Phoenix - The Open University - 3322700/2021

Ask for access link and pin and please give your name and address in the email as they check when you connect to the tribunal.

The clerk will ask you (in a private remote room) to put your camera on to verify, this involves looking at you, but no ID is needed. You may turn off your camera after this pointless and unnecessary process.

Abbreviations

JP - Jo Phoenix, Claimant (C)
OU - The Open University, Respondent (R)
J - Regional Employment Judge Young
P - Panel or panel member
BC - Ben Cooper KC, Counsel for C
JM - Jane Mulcahy KC, Counsel for R

OU Departments & Networks:

HWSRA - Health & Wellbeing Strategic Research Area
FASS - Faculty of Arts and Social Sciences
SPC - Dept of Social Policy & Criminology
KMi - Knowledge Media Institute
GCRN - Gender Critical Research Network

OU witnesses

PB - Dr Paraskevi Boukli, Former Senior Lecturer Criminology, Deputy Head SPC 2021-22
IF - Prof Ian Fribbance Dean of FASS
MW - Prof Marcia Wilson, Dean EDI, 2020-23
CM - Caragh Molloy, Group People Director 2019-23
LD - Dr Leigh Downes, Senior Lecturer in Criminology (in SPC), Academic Lead for EDI FASS 2019-21
PK - Peter Keogh, Professor Health & Society, Member RSSH
DD - Dr Deborah Drake, Senior Lecturer Criminology, Head of SPC 2018-21
CT - Catherine Tomlinson, Senior Student Advisor
LW - Louise Westmarland, Prof of Criminology, Co-Deputy Head SPC, 2018-21, Current Head SPC
JD - John Domingue, Prof of Computing Science, Director KMi, 2015-22
CW - Dr Christopher Williams, Senior Lecturer History
SD - Shaun Daley, Head OU’s Resourcing Hub. Head Strategic Resources, Co-Chair OU’s LGBT+ Staff Network
HBC - Helen Bowes-Catton, Lecturer Social Research Methods
NS - Nicola Snarey, Assoc Lecturer Eng Language
NatS - Natalie Starkey, Outreach & Public Engagement Officer Sch Physical Sciences, 2019-22
CT - Cath Tomlinson, Senior Student Advisor
SJ - Samantha Jacobson, Employee Relations Case Manager
RH - Richard Holliman, Prof Engaged Research, Head School Environment, Earth & Ecosystem Sciences, 2019-22. Member of Investigation Panel investigating the C’s grievance

Witness for JP:

SE - Sarah Earle, Professor Modern History Uni of Oxford, Founding member GCRN

Tribunal Tweets - https://twitter.com/tribunaltweets

TT coverage so far - tribunaltweets.substack.com/p/professor-jo-phoenix-v-the-open-university

Prof Jo Phoenix Witness Statement (scroll to bottom of page and download)

https://jophoenix.substack.com/p/phoenix-v-open-university?sd=pf

Thread 1 https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4905118-jo-phoenix-vs-the-ou-employment-tribunal-2nd-october-whispers-ben-cooper?page=1

Thread 2 https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4913946-prof-jo-phoenix-vs-the-ou-employment-tribunal-thread-2?page=1

Thread 3 https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4917480-prof-jo-phoenix-vs-the-ou-employment-tribunal-thread-3

Thread 4 https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4918479-prof-jo-phoenix-vs-the-ou-employment-tribunal-thread-4

Here’s an alarmingly bad effort from ChatGPT. Leaves Vogon poetry for dead. I tried to get it to include “Include witness Leigh downes being a non-binary idiot spouting meaningless drivel” but ChatGPT refused on the grounds of derogatory or offensive language.

In a courtroom, hushed and stern,
Where justice's fires brightly burn,
A tale of rights and work's domain,
Professor Jo Phoenix's tribunal came.
With wisdom and resolve, she stood,
Fighting for what she believed was good,
In the realm of employment, she'd contend,
For her gender-critical views, she'd make her stand.
A learned scholar, her mind ablaze,
In legal battles, she'd navigate the maze,
To uphold principles, so just and true,
For all who toil, for me and you.
Yet in the heart of this trial's turmoil,
A narrative of discrimination did uncoil,
Against Professor Phoenix's beliefs and creed,
The Open University's stance took heed.
She claimed they judged her with disdain,
For her gender-critical views, they'd blame,
A clash of perspectives in the workplace,
Where diversity should take its rightful place.
The courtroom watched, with bated breath,
As the story unfolded, a battle with depth,
A complex struggle of rights and needs,
As differing beliefs clashed in this legal reed.
In this drama, there appeared a sage,
Super King's Counsel Ben Cooper, in the legal stage,
Known as BCKC, a master of his craft,
He sought the truth, navigating the draft.
For the rights of Professor Phoenix, he'd defend,
With eloquence, he'd reach around the bend,
In the quest for justice, he'd not relent,
As beliefs and rights their voices sent.
The verdict came, justice's decree,
A moment etched in history's tree,
A reminder to workplaces far and wide,
That beliefs and rights must stand side by side.
In Professor Jo Phoenix's tale, we'll recall,
A symbol of how discrimination can appall,
In the employment world's intricate dance,
A call for fairness and true tolerance, perchance

And if you put in a beat pause you can have "Freed from the gender .. binary"
I'll stop now. Honest!

That's impressively bad, @LargeSquareRock. Did you ask it write in the style of William McGonagall, or was that its own initiative?

McGonagall was my first thought. Or a poet that I can never identify who, from memory wrote something like:

And he, her lord, looked on with horrid ken
As one, who dead, had wronged, come back again.

(iirc, her husband had died. She'd taken up with another man, plausibly a relationship initiated before the husband's death. The husband's ghost visits at an in flagrante moment.)

The chicken is a noble beast
The cow is much forlorner
Standing in the pouring rain
With a leg in every corner.

Kuc, that reminds me of Ivor Cutler. No idea if it's true, but he said he once made a recording that he played at a zoo saying “This is an animal. It has four legs – one at each corner, to keep it up off the ground”.

tbh, altho' classic McGonagall, I was briefly wondering about Joseph Gwyer, (self-appointed poet laureate and potato salesman) and James McIntyre (preferred topic for poetry was cheese, I'm not judging, I always prefer it to pudding, but the oeuvres were not good).

They can't say Mumsnetters aren't deep thinkers.

I love Ivor Cutler (and Dave Allen).

I'm off for a dreich Sunday afternoon listen of Life in a Scotch Sitting Room.

AmaryllisNightAndDay
(Edited because I had a bit of a dither and decided I like "people" better than "women", which I put first. Hum what you like!)

"folk" would scan better than either? If you put the emphasis on "cate" in "educated", anyway.

That . . . . that is BEAUTIFUL

<wipes away an appreciative sentimental tear (single tear, left eye, obviously)>

Someone has just pledged £10,000 to Jo's field of fightbacks. I hope it's really real.

Oh wow AutumnCrow I hope it is real also! That would be fantastic!

It's showing up on the fundraiser! Along with George ( hurray for you too!)
You've got to put your financial info in for it to go through. So I think it's real?

Perfect @AskingQuestionsAllTheTime
so now we have

Three little theys who, all unwary,
Come from an OU seminary,
Educated folk must be non-binary --
Three little theys from school!

So glad to hear the crowdfunder is doing well too. I gardened yesterday, then started reading JP's witness statement and it's making me want to garden again. Don't make my mistake and start reading it late at night. It's very hard to stop!

I'm in awe of BC but there is one useful thing he could introduce into his advocacy for these hearings. It relates to the concept of "trans exclusionary". The statement of claim should point out that the claimant is not "trans exclusionary" because they would welcome transmen into women's single sex spaces, and so, to be accurate, they are "incorrect sex exclusionary". With this introduced BC could then use it against witnesses when they talk about "trans exclusionary" to point out that being "incorrect sex inclusionary" is a perfectly reasonable position.

Separately, I am irritated that despite sending a number of emails to Watford requesting access I got zero engagement from them. Open justice my arse.

That's supposed to be:

With this introduced BC could then use it against witnesses when they talk about "trans exclusionary" to point out that being "incorrect sex inexclusionary" is a perfectly reasonable position.

Maybe JKR?

My first thought too @chilling19.

I just saw it had jumped and wondered why. Not withstanding this incredible donation it’s wonderful to see so many people donating.

Gosh, that's amazing. I thought she'd reached her target?
I've still got Pilgrim, Aldwyn and an individual mentioned by Helen Joyce to support, hoping my visit to buy bedding plants for Jo is enough.

Typo, Almut.

I think Jo P had to stretch her target again due to the inability of some people at her tribunal to give concise answers and of others to stay anywhere near the agreed timetable. Sadly and unfairly, this means more fundraising by Jo when it's not her fault.

Where can the £10,000 pledge be seen? Can't find it in the comments (so wonderful to see all the pledges and comments!)

Yep, seen the new target is £240k. It's absolutely infuriating that so many witnesses are called, what is Jo, some sort of Maffia don or Bill Cosby type?

There should be a maximum of six witnesses.
And that idiot who didn't even do their job to read the complaint against her, either at the time or crazily, in preparation for being called a witness, should have been reprimanded by the judge and sent off for an early bath. Preposterous!

And all the time wasting. If this was a football game, there'd be a half hour of added time.

Spurious charges, ritual humiliation, lack of humanity. What have our institutions, especially academia, become?