Rishi Sunak - "a man is a man, a woman is a woman"

[Ellos]

..and how we shouldn't be bullied into believing somebody can be any sex that they want.

https://vm.tiktok.com/ZGJcxUehh/

AIBU to want to give him a round of applause?

I know, it's convenient timing and obviously a strategy move but how good is it to hear that straight from the horses mouth when the country has spent the past god knows how long bowing down to the loud and often disturbed minority.

I still can't stand the Tories and won't be voting for them but cheers for acknowledging the insanity, Rishi.

A persons gender, just like their sexuality, is not superficial

On the contrary. 'Gender identity' is very superficial, because it is based on absolutely nothing but stereotypes. I have never heard anyone manage to give a definition of what constitutes 'living as a woman' or 'having a female gender identity' that isn't entirely made up of stereotypes (none of which actually make you a woman).

anyone who finds what rishi said offensive is no friend to women. I care about trans people but that doesn't mean humans can change sex.

there are also people who are strictly gay. Denying their realities, trying to change them, trying to persuade them that sexuality is all fluid and superficial anyway, etc, causes immeasurable harm.

So you agree with the LGB Alliance then that immeasurable harm is being done to to gay men and lesbians who are told their same sex attraction is bigoted?

First sensible thing you've said on this thread.

Are actually, seriously laughing at infertile women? On Mumsnet?

How utterly ridiculous and divisive,
also polls show that a significant proportion, if not the majority of, women don’t agree with you.

Oh there you are again, trying to manipulatively accuse me of utter bollox.
No I am not laughing at infertile women, I was laughing at what that poster said because it was funny,

What a pile of nonsense. we reproduce when a sperm (made by a man) meets an egg (produced by a woman). We are sexually dimorphic. Some people have disorders of sexual development. The end. Genetics determines sex. Sex is set at conception and can never change.

You're wrong again. Is it ridiculous and divisive to say that men can become women. I think most women are a lot nicer than you're giving them credit for and actually care about others hence would not be offended by rishi failing to bow to the male supremacists.

Genetics determines sex

I think I’ve said what I have to say on this topic and the posts are there to read . We are going round in circles, it’s certainly not that simple, as you acknowledge yourself when you briefly reference “disorders of sex development”,

Oh I wouldn’t rely on those polls. I don’t know one single person who disagrees with what Rishi said on this occasion.

Hmm, maybe check the recent polling that the ex-head of Stonewall was pining over, saying it showed Brits were becoming less understanding (ironic, because I'd say Brits are really starting to understand).

Ask a bunch of women in the workplace of a Fortune 500 company or the NHS, where the trans McCarthyites are listening in on every word, you'll hear not a peep against gender ideology (yes Andrew Boff, as you know it is very much a thing).

Get the same women out on a night together, down the pub (Bud Light, anyone?) or coffee bar (Costa, anyone?), then take the temperature on what they think about gender ideology, even you would blush.

When this was in aibu 70 percent of people agreed with the premise.
I suspect that the usually low number (usually any do women have penis's type polls on aibu get a 90+ split) is because people agree with the prime minister about biological reality but hate his other policies.

And hardly any of these so called polls elsewhere state the obvious by what all the language means 'transwomen' etc. When it does the polling has been shown to skew in favour of biological reality.

But yeah, big words, word salad, bigot dinosaur, THE SCIENCE, nothing can defeat the PENIS...

I wonder if gender identity is which sex you identify with? I can get that people feel wrong in their bodies, or wrong trying to live by gender stereotypes, but gender identity is difficult for me to grasp, even after being obliged to read an amount of Judith Butler.

A person can change their faith if they choose; and there is no role for biology in the development of a particular religious belief. It is not a helpful comparison to gender identity. Sexuality is a much more appropriate comparator.

If you think that true spiritual faith is a matter of choice then you have no understanding of it.
You can't force yourself into a religious belief either if you simply don't believe.
Nor can you force yourself to have a gender identity if you don't have one. It's an entirely appropriate comparison, except that my Christian friends and family don't insist that I believe exactly what they do, they are actually respectful of different viewpoints and don't claim it undermines their very existence.
Possibly they are more secure in their religious beliefs than people are in their gender ones, who knows.

I am a woman.

Nothing I wear denotes this.
Nothing I do denotes this.
No-one I am attracted to denotes this.

I am a woman because I have the the female physiology that I was born with.

The 'gender' you describe, the look of the 'transwoman', is based on outdated and misogynistic stereotyping.

I have yet to see a transwoman that isn't pouting thick lipstick, displaying giant talons and brandishing a whimsical handbag, wearing pink, pink, red, pink.. It's just bullshit. That is NOT being a woman. Very very very few women dress this way. A vast vast majority of transwomen dress this way. It's a stereotype. It's degrading to women.

It's an entirely appropriate comparison

Would you compare religious belief to sexuality ?

I wonder if gender identity is which sex you identify with?

yes it is exactly this.

I have yet to see a transwoman that isn't pouting thick lipstick, displaying giant talons and brandishing a whimsical handbag, wearing pink, pink, red, pink.. It's just bullshit

this just proves how ignorant you are about actual trans people and their lives. I recommend this book for dismantling such stereotypes
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Whipping-Girl-Transsexual-Scapegoating-Femininity/dp/1580056229?nodl=1&dplnkId=c8cd5d34-d4de-4761-881f-0c98796cbaf8

I don't thik that's true. I know, by sight only, a couple of local trans women who are probably in their 40s. They wear things like longish skirts, cardigans, sensible shoes. Whatever Jan Morrison's faults, I don't think their style was as you described either.

Some people are born without legs. This doesn't mean humans are not a bipedal species. Nobody is out there campaigning for recognition of a leg spectrum.

We know why DSDs happen and once again it's zero to do with bog standard, XY, small gamete producing men who happen to like heels, kittens and lipstick.

Actually there’s a huge movement of people with disabilities , of various types , trying to challenge various assumptions about human development.

it would be entirely a inaccurate to say that all people have two legs, just as it’s innacurate to say that all human bodies fit into binary biological sex classifications.

A conversation about sex is entirely relevant to a conversation about gender, which is why this topic is for “sex and gender discussions” and why people consistently route their objections to trans people in absolutist definitions of sex.

Tell you what's bloody brilliant.

Yes, he's saying it because he thinks it's the majority opinion and will win votes.

Ahem. A politician who is good enough at politicking to rise to the very top recognises that the majority of the country knows what a woman is and it's not identity, and cares enough that it might affect their voting intentions.

I hope he's right about the voting intentions. And I hope other parties twig quickly enough to sort out their manifestos and put Rosie Duffield in charge so I can vote for a party I actually want to vote for on all fronts.

Julia Serrano?

Here is Julia mansplaining feminism:

'“[U]ntil feminists work to empower femininity and pry it away from the insipid, inferior meanings that plague it - weakness, helplessness, fragility, passivity, frivolity, and artificiality - those meanings will continue to haunt every person who is female and/or feminine.” '

Fuck off, Julia.