Page 23 | Rishi Sunak - "a man is a man, a woman is a woman"

Ellos · 2023-10-04T20:44:22+00:00

..and how we shouldn't be bullied into believing somebody can be any sex that they want. [[https://vm.tiktok.com/ZGJcxUehh https://vm.tiktok.com/ZGJcxUehh/]] AIBU to want to give him a round of applause? I know, it's convenient timing and obviously a strategy move but how good is it to hear that straight from the horses mouth when the country has spent the past god knows how long bowing down to the loud --and often disturbed-- minority. I still can't stand the Tories and won't be voting for them but cheers for acknowledging the insanity, Rishi.

EasternStandard · 05/10/2023 14:45

Somanyquestionstoaskaboutthis · 05/10/2023 14:42

Radical idea based on this idea. We could have separate toilet facilities for all females who cannot use mixed sex toilets for many reasons. So Muslim women, rape/ assault survivor women, women wanting to use the sinks without men there to clean up period products or period flooding, women who are gender critical feminists, women who do not want to be filmed under cubicle doors, masturbated next to or asked by men if they have a tampon, women who just don’t feel comfortable in mixed sex toilets ( so that includes Tandora who said they don’t in a later post) etc etc. Here’s the radical bit - we could call this the women’s toilets, and we could say men can’t use it.
We could also have toilets for all men, they would probably prefer that women can’t use that but I’m not a man so I’ll leave that to men to address.
Then we could have mixed sex toilets, for anyone who for any reason doesn’t want to go in the correct toilets for their sex, or who just doesn’t care.
Problem solved right? But apparently that’s not what some men want, so women have to share theirs. Mad.

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Sounds good

Looks like the solution is possible

Gagagardener · 05/10/2023 15:14

https://thecritic.co.uk/issues/october-2023/the-diversity-trap/

Someone referred to this Helen Joyce article in The Critic upthread, so when I found I could read it without a paywall I thought I'd post it here.

Some of you may also be interested in 'Seattle Activists Submit Formal Demand to School Board' "Get gender ideology out of our schools". [email protected]

The diversity trap | Helen Joyce | The Critic Magazine

This article is taken from the October 2023 issue of The Critic. To get the full magazine why not subscribe? Right now we're offering five issues for just £10. You’d have to be living under a rock not…

https://thecritic.co.uk/issues/october-2023/the-diversity-trap

RealityFan · 05/10/2023 15:16

Tandora · 05/10/2023 14:16

I was just wondering about the 2% really 🤷🏼‍♀️. Thats still quite a lot of people who need some pronouns 😆

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Ah, let me guess. 98% of sex offenders are men, maybe 0.5% of women are. That leaves 2% of men that aren't and 99.5% of women who aren't. And maybe 2% of men consider themselves women. And according to The New Law, there's likely to be close to 100% compliance of those non violent men and men who consider themselves women. And thus since close to 100% of transwomen are thus non violent, this then is close to the 0.5% of women who are abusive.

I mean, why did I not see this before? Isla Bryson, Barbie Kardashian etc. They are transwomen, part of that 2%, and de facto that 0.5% of bad women.

Yes, we can deffo rearrange society seamlessly based on these stats.

MavisMcMinty · 05/10/2023 15:25

I can’t believe nobody’s mentioned Lucy Letby yet.

ketchup07070 · 05/10/2023 15:26

Tandora · 05/10/2023 13:54

As stated I’m proposing we have men’s toilets and women’s toilets and disabled toilets, possibly some gender neutral toilets? (all of which operate as they currently do and may be used by trans people).

And then separate (optional!) toilets specifically for female-assigned , “gender critical” feminists, who are particularly worried about being raped by trans women in the other facilities.

Basically lots more toilets so we can all move on with our lives in harmony and peace and everyone has a place to relieve themselves where they feel comfortable and safe ☺️ 🌈

Edited

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Do you consider the rights of religiously observant women and those who have trauma in your thoughts at all? I'm quite happy with gender neutral toilets, but I can tell you that posters in college toilets forbidding women from challenging males meant that some women could not use the toilets - due to religious reasons or trauma. Do you think that is fair? If so, why are your female only toilets only for gc feminists, why don't you consider other groups?

RealityFan · 05/10/2023 15:38

Our trans visitors here aren't interested in solutions. So as we engage with them in the way they won't engage with any GCs on trans Reddit (funny, that), their terms of engagement become clearer and clearer.

Men have always walked amongst women (yep), and shared their spaces without women knowing (er no, that's a myth), and forced women to comply by securing their fear, silence and compliance (that's more the truth).

And thus after many years of women strangely enough following predictable behaviour (putting up and shutting up) with men following predictable behaviour (walking all over women), women are now expected to not only accommodate, but acquiesce and even approve (misgender at your peril).

As TRAs come on here to express human rights concerns as a cover for a rights revolution that has no permission from the group who are compromised en masse.

Meandermoanda · 05/10/2023 16:14

Some horrendous eye opening points put across on here. I had no idea things were thus bad

Just a thought for those on all sides of the debate...

A man who used to be a woman. Which toilet?

WickedSerious · 05/10/2023 16:15

The idea that men pretending to be women have walked among us,invading our spaces since time immemorial and women haven't noticed is complete and utter tripe.

Chersfrozenface · 05/10/2023 16:18

Meandermoanda · 05/10/2023 16:14

Some horrendous eye opening points put across on here. I had no idea things were thus bad

Just a thought for those on all sides of the debate...

A man who used to be a woman. Which toilet?

A man who used to be a woman doesn't exist. Humans can't change sex.

If you mean a natal / biological woman who identifies as a man and tries to look like one - women's toilet since that is the person's sex, or men's toilet if the person insists - the person will be no threat to men.

ArabellaScott · 05/10/2023 16:24

WickedSerious · 05/10/2023 16:15

The idea that men pretending to be women have walked among us,invading our spaces since time immemorial and women haven't noticed is complete and utter tripe.

Absolutely.

Women who are at risk, know they are at risk, and therefore say nothing.

When I was seventeen and met the aforementioned masturbating transwoman, I did not challenge him. I put my head down and got the fuck out of the toilet as quickly and quietly as I could. I did not tell staff of the restaurant. I did not report it to the police. I got the fuck out.

Women - how many of your sexual assaults have you reported to the police?

Failing to report does not mean we are 'okay with it'.

Hersecretserviceyourmaj · 05/10/2023 16:55

piesforever · 05/10/2023 12:51

This is an absolute disgrace. Let's watch hate crime go up even more. Focus on the real issues Rishi.

Are you saying women are not real? I think we've had enough of that.

Hersecretserviceyourmaj · 05/10/2023 16:57

It's. Sad day when you've got women. gaslighting other women, all in the name of politics.

EasternStandard · 05/10/2023 16:59

Hersecretserviceyourmaj · 05/10/2023 16:57

It's. Sad day when you've got women. gaslighting other women, all in the name of politics.

Yep

Tandora · 05/10/2023 17:17

Somanyquestionstoaskaboutthis · 05/10/2023 14:42

Radical idea based on this idea. We could have separate toilet facilities for all females who cannot use mixed sex toilets for many reasons. So Muslim women, rape/ assault survivor women, women wanting to use the sinks without men there to clean up period products or period flooding, women who are gender critical feminists, women who do not want to be filmed under cubicle doors, masturbated next to or asked by men if they have a tampon, women who just don’t feel comfortable in mixed sex toilets ( so that includes Tandora who said they don’t in a later post) etc etc. Here’s the radical bit - we could call this the women’s toilets, and we could say men can’t use it.
We could also have toilets for all men, they would probably prefer that women can’t use that but I’m not a man so I’ll leave that to men to address.
Then we could have mixed sex toilets, for anyone who for any reason doesn’t want to go in the correct toilets for their sex, or who just doesn’t care.
Problem solved right? But apparently that’s not what some men want, so women have to share theirs. Mad.

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I don’t want “mixed sex” toilets, I want trans people along with all other people to have a safe and comfortable place to go to the toilet.

You , and others on this thread, can continue to insist that we all share your use of language and your absolutist definition of “sex” but at some point you are going to have to accept that we don’t.

Tandora · 05/10/2023 17:21

BlurredEdges · 05/10/2023 14:20

It was perfectly clear what @ArabellaScott meant. Perfectly clear.

Your response to her sharing a horrendous, traumatic experience that happened to her as a very young woman is to take the piss out of her, with laughing emojis.

There's no excuse at all for that, it's just a horrible, callous, contemptible way to respond.

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you can continue to try to manipulate the narrative all you want , but at no point have I mocked anyone for being a victim of sexual abuse.

The only thing I seek to make light of is the prejudice/ transphobia, displayed by yourself and so many others on this thread. This joviality is to ease the sense of rage and despair that it generates in me, due to the profound injustice and cruelty that it represents.

Justaboutalive · 05/10/2023 17:24

Chersfrozenface · 05/10/2023 16:18

A man who used to be a woman doesn't exist. Humans can't change sex.

If you mean a natal / biological woman who identifies as a man and tries to look like one - women's toilet since that is the person's sex, or men's toilet if the person insists - the person will be no threat to men.

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I disagree here. Men do have a right to dignity too. Some will feel threatened if females are in their loos. Just not physically.

Males in the male toilet - irrespective of gender feelings
Females in the female toilets - irrespective of gender feelings.

Pre pubescent children allowed in the toilet of the appropriate sex of the adult accompanying then, or as per their sex if unaccompanied.

NO exceptions - few people pass as the opposite sex and no muddying of things. This means if you see a masculine looking person in the ladies, it is a masculine looking female, who has every right to be there.

As the water has been so muddied, I think it needs to be made a civil offence (with fines) if you use the other sex’s loos.

Tandora · 05/10/2023 17:26

Justaboutalive · 05/10/2023 17:24

I disagree here. Men do have a right to dignity too. Some will feel threatened if females are in their loos. Just not physically.

Males in the male toilet - irrespective of gender feelings
Females in the female toilets - irrespective of gender feelings.

Pre pubescent children allowed in the toilet of the appropriate sex of the adult accompanying then, or as per their sex if unaccompanied.

NO exceptions - few people pass as the opposite sex and no muddying of things. This means if you see a masculine looking person in the ladies, it is a masculine looking female, who has every right to be there.

As the water has been so muddied, I think it needs to be made a civil offence (with fines) if you use the other sex’s loos.

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Males in the male toilet - irrespective of gender feelings
Females in the female toilets - irrespective of gender feelings

😂😂😂. so basically your “feelings” about gender are the only ones that matter.

SerendipityJane · 05/10/2023 17:29

how can this thread get this far without someone adding "and small furry creatures from Alpha Centauri are small furry creatures from Alpha Centauri" ?

Justaboutalive · 05/10/2023 17:30

Males in the male toilet - irrespective of gender feelings
Females in the female toilets - irrespective of gender feelings

nope - gender feelings mean fiddly squat re the loo you use. Male/ female are the two sexes.

Tandora · 05/10/2023 17:34

nope - gender feelings mean fiddly squat re the loo you use. Male/ female are the two sexes

you will have to accept that this is your opinion and others opinions on both points are very different.

Chersfrozenface · 05/10/2023 17:44

"absolutist definition of “sex""?!

No, the factual, scientific, observable, provable definition of "sex".

Human sex is binary and immutable, as ins that of all mammals.

Reality, not fantasy.

Tandora · 05/10/2023 17:48

Chersfrozenface · 05/10/2023 17:44

"absolutist definition of “sex""?!

No, the factual, scientific, observable, provable definition of "sex".

Human sex is binary and immutable, as ins that of all mammals.

Reality, not fantasy.

this is absolutely not true. Scientific understandings of sex are much much more complex than this. “Sex” is a complex and dynamic developmental process with many components and variables, not just a single unitary measure.

You cannot claim consensus where there is none.

ArabellaScott · 05/10/2023 17:49

'humans are sexually dimorphous mammals'

'that's just your opinion'

How the hell did we get here?

ArabellaScott · 05/10/2023 17:49

Do we have to dig out the Endocrine Society's exasperated statement again?

EasternStandard · 05/10/2023 17:51

ArabellaScott · 05/10/2023 17:49

'humans are sexually dimorphous mammals'

'that's just your opinion'

How the hell did we get here?

It’s unbelievable