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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

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Rishi Sunak - "a man is a man, a woman is a woman"

1000 replies

Ellos · 04/10/2023 21:44

..and how we shouldn't be bullied into believing somebody can be any sex that they want.

https://vm.tiktok.com/ZGJcxUehh/

AIBU to want to give him a round of applause?

I know, it's convenient timing and obviously a strategy move but how good is it to hear that straight from the horses mouth when the country has spent the past god knows how long bowing down to the loud and often disturbed minority.

I still can't stand the Tories and won't be voting for them but cheers for acknowledging the insanity, Rishi.

PoliticsJOE on TikTok

#fy #fyp #fypシ #tory #conservative #rishisunak #trans

https://vm.tiktok.com/ZGJcxUehh

OP posts:
Thread gallery
18
BlurredEdges · 05/10/2023 13:11

You don't get to force women and girls to participate in playing your make-believe games in order to cater to your 'feelings'. Take it up with a therapist. Our rights are not yours to take away. Our safety is not yours to dispose of. Our dignity is not yours to shit all over. I'm going to do some work. I'm confident the other women here can see you as well as I can.

ArabellaScott · 05/10/2023 13:11

This footage is really interesting. Kay Burley, newsreader, claims that Sunak has 'broken the law' by saying you can't change sex. She is insistent.

'PM says a man is a man, a woman is a woman. The Equalities Act 2010 says you must not be discriminated against because of gender reassignment. So isn't Sunak breaking the law, Transport Sec@MarkJHarper?'

How many people are labouring under such massive misapprehensions?

Poll recently showed massive chunks of the electorate think a 'transwoman' is born female.

https://twitter.com/KayBurley/status/1709840600537710936

https://twitter.com/KayBurley/status/1709840600537710936

Tandora · 05/10/2023 13:12

SomeCatFromJapan · 05/10/2023 13:10

To clarify, the “harm” I was referring to - caused to trans women by banning them from women’s spaces - isn’t primarily the risk of victimisation by men.
The harm I’m speaking of is the indignity , suffering , oppression etc. caused to trans people when they forced to live in a gender role that feels unnatural/ inauthentic/ alien to them.

How is this the problem of women and girls to solve?

women and girls are humans, and like all other humans, we have the responsibility not to discriminate against others in a way that causes profound harm and suffering to other humans.

ArabellaScott · 05/10/2023 13:13

BlurredEdges · 05/10/2023 12:42

I've also spent 30+ years doing those things.

it's only in the last 5 or so years that I've had 6 ft 5 males with large fake breasts and long hair enter the gym changing room while I'm there and not had any recourse to ask them to leave or to seek help.

it's only in the last 5 or so years that I've had to try to prepare my teenage daughter for how to deal with situations with aggressive and predatory males when she can be arrested if she names them with the right pronouns.

it's only in the last 5 or so years that my friend who runs a women's shelter in the South of England has had to allow trans-identifying males to use this shelter, resulting in a number of abused, vulnerable women leaving the shelter and becoming homeless.

it's only in the last 5 or so years that a woman has been raped by a trans-identifying male in an NHS hospital ward and been told by the police and NHS that she was lying because that male said he was a woman.

it's only in the last 5 or so years that universities have put up posters telling young women that they have to accept males in their single-sex toilets, and that if they complain, they are bigots.

Don't pretend things have not changed. They have.

Christ, that's a bleak list.

Tandora · 05/10/2023 13:13

BlurredEdges · 05/10/2023 13:11

You don't get to force women and girls to participate in playing your make-believe games in order to cater to your 'feelings'. Take it up with a therapist. Our rights are not yours to take away. Our safety is not yours to dispose of. Our dignity is not yours to shit all over. I'm going to do some work. I'm confident the other women here can see you as well as I can.

This is so messed up 😢😢😢😢

ArabellaScott · 05/10/2023 13:13

Tandora · 05/10/2023 13:12

women and girls are humans, and like all other humans, we have the responsibility not to discriminate against others in a way that causes profound harm and suffering to other humans.

Safeguarding is a form of discrimination.

EasternStandard · 05/10/2023 13:15

ArabellaScott · 05/10/2023 13:11

This footage is really interesting. Kay Burley, newsreader, claims that Sunak has 'broken the law' by saying you can't change sex. She is insistent.

'PM says a man is a man, a woman is a woman. The Equalities Act 2010 says you must not be discriminated against because of gender reassignment. So isn't Sunak breaking the law, Transport Sec@MarkJHarper?'

How many people are labouring under such massive misapprehensions?

Poll recently showed massive chunks of the electorate think a 'transwoman' is born female.

https://twitter.com/KayBurley/status/1709840600537710936

This is madness. Rip it all up it’s not working

That statement as a crime is out of a dystopian novel

OvaHere · 05/10/2023 13:15

Tandora · 05/10/2023 13:12

women and girls are humans, and like all other humans, we have the responsibility not to discriminate against others in a way that causes profound harm and suffering to other humans.

Women saying no to men is a hate crime.

Bananasandcorn · 05/10/2023 13:21

lifeturnsonadime · 05/10/2023 11:02

It is possible to be both:

Bothered by NHS cuts

AND

Bothered that a woman was raped by a transwoman on an NHS ward.

Bloody hell I'm dumfounded that Labour Voters are supposed to just 'suck up' gender ideology and the consequent harms to women as though it is fine as collateral damage.

No I won't I expect MORE FROM THE LABOUR PARTY.

The Tories are giving us NHS cut and women raped in NHS Hospitals, the 2 are related, better funding gives the NHS the ability to have single sex wards.

Starmer has said what a woman is and the the law is a man with a GRC is a legally a "woman"
If you don't agree with this (and i do not) blame the party in power?

Apply for a Gender Recognition Certificate if you want your affirmed gender (sometimes called an ‘acquired gender’) to be legally recognised in the UK.
Having a certificate means you can:

  • update your birth or adoption certificate, if it was registered in the UK
  • get married or form a civil partnership in your affirmed gender
  • update your marriage or civil partnership certificate, if it was registered in the UK
  • have your affirmed gender on your death certificate when you die

The Tories have had 13 years to change this.

Beowulfa · 05/10/2023 13:22

To clarify, the “harm” I was referring to - caused to trans women by banning them from women’s spaces - isn’t primarily the risk of victimisation by men.
The harm I’m speaking of is the indignity , suffering , oppression etc. caused to trans people when they forced to live in a gender role that feels unnatural/ inauthentic/ alien to them.

The worst thing that can happen to a transwoman in a women's toilet/changing room is that a woman asks them to leave.

The worst thing that can happen to a woman forced to share a toilet/changing room with a transwoman is that she is assaulted, raped and impregnated.

I am quite happy to prioritise the physical safety of women over the hurt feelings of men.

ArabellaScott · 05/10/2023 13:23

Beowulfa · 05/10/2023 13:22

To clarify, the “harm” I was referring to - caused to trans women by banning them from women’s spaces - isn’t primarily the risk of victimisation by men.
The harm I’m speaking of is the indignity , suffering , oppression etc. caused to trans people when they forced to live in a gender role that feels unnatural/ inauthentic/ alien to them.

The worst thing that can happen to a transwoman in a women's toilet/changing room is that a woman asks them to leave.

The worst thing that can happen to a woman forced to share a toilet/changing room with a transwoman is that she is assaulted, raped and impregnated.

I am quite happy to prioritise the physical safety of women over the hurt feelings of men.

Men are afraid women will laugh at them.
Women are afraid men will kill them.

EasternStandard · 05/10/2023 13:23

Bananasandcorn · 05/10/2023 13:21

The Tories are giving us NHS cut and women raped in NHS Hospitals, the 2 are related, better funding gives the NHS the ability to have single sex wards.

Starmer has said what a woman is and the the law is a man with a GRC is a legally a "woman"
If you don't agree with this (and i do not) blame the party in power?

Apply for a Gender Recognition Certificate if you want your affirmed gender (sometimes called an ‘acquired gender’) to be legally recognised in the UK.
Having a certificate means you can:

  • update your birth or adoption certificate, if it was registered in the UK
  • get married or form a civil partnership in your affirmed gender
  • update your marriage or civil partnership certificate, if it was registered in the UK
  • have your affirmed gender on your death certificate when you die

The Tories have had 13 years to change this.

And Labour introduced the law in 2004

What legislation do you want to see?

ArabellaScott · 05/10/2023 13:25

Tandora · 05/10/2023 13:12

women and girls are humans, and like all other humans, we have the responsibility not to discriminate against others in a way that causes profound harm and suffering to other humans.

And in no way are girls - female children - obliged to save grown men from 'suffering' due to feeling dysphoric.

We are not fucking support humans.

We are equally as important as men.

Agesifent · 05/10/2023 13:26

Transgender hate crimes increased 11% in the last year. Wonder why.

Years ago, people would defend homophobia based on a theoretical scenario about a "gay criminal or pervert". They'd point ar one very rare or theoretical case and use it to justify hating all gay people. It was wrong and thankfully we moved on from that.

But it's the same today with transgender rights

People use extreme theoretical scenarios and fears to justify hatred.

I've mixed in very cosmopolitan social scenes and never once come across transgender people in the loo anyway (not that I'd care) so I very much doubt Susan from beckington will experience the horrendous inconvenience of a man in a dress in her local loo.

And if a criminal did put on a dress to enter ladies loos to do harm then that is because he is a criminal not transgender

We shouldn't hate a whole community because of a few theroetical or rare criminals.

This is all so horrid. And now thanks to Tory culture wars, hate crimes are up. Just like hate crimes against foreigners went up post Brexit campaign.

Idiots getting their knickers in a twist over an imagined enemy again

SomeCatFromJapan · 05/10/2023 13:26

women and girls are humans, and like all other humans, we have the responsibility not to discriminate against others in a way that causes profound harm and suffering to other humans.

That certainly does not include the responsibility to welcome males into single-sex spaces, or indeed the responsibility to put males ahead of ourselves at any juncture.

EasternStandard · 05/10/2023 13:27

Agesifent · 05/10/2023 13:26

Transgender hate crimes increased 11% in the last year. Wonder why.

Years ago, people would defend homophobia based on a theoretical scenario about a "gay criminal or pervert". They'd point ar one very rare or theoretical case and use it to justify hating all gay people. It was wrong and thankfully we moved on from that.

But it's the same today with transgender rights

People use extreme theoretical scenarios and fears to justify hatred.

I've mixed in very cosmopolitan social scenes and never once come across transgender people in the loo anyway (not that I'd care) so I very much doubt Susan from beckington will experience the horrendous inconvenience of a man in a dress in her local loo.

And if a criminal did put on a dress to enter ladies loos to do harm then that is because he is a criminal not transgender

We shouldn't hate a whole community because of a few theroetical or rare criminals.

This is all so horrid. And now thanks to Tory culture wars, hate crimes are up. Just like hate crimes against foreigners went up post Brexit campaign.

Idiots getting their knickers in a twist over an imagined enemy again

The answer is still no.

Women have a voice

You’ll have to accept we don’t all prioritise men.

SomeCatFromJapan · 05/10/2023 13:29

You’ll have to accept we don’t all prioritise men.

Even if we're not "very cosmolopolitan", and live in (horrors) Beckington.

Tandora · 05/10/2023 13:29

Beowulfa · 05/10/2023 13:22

To clarify, the “harm” I was referring to - caused to trans women by banning them from women’s spaces - isn’t primarily the risk of victimisation by men.
The harm I’m speaking of is the indignity , suffering , oppression etc. caused to trans people when they forced to live in a gender role that feels unnatural/ inauthentic/ alien to them.

The worst thing that can happen to a transwoman in a women's toilet/changing room is that a woman asks them to leave.

The worst thing that can happen to a woman forced to share a toilet/changing room with a transwoman is that she is assaulted, raped and impregnated.

I am quite happy to prioritise the physical safety of women over the hurt feelings of men.

The worst thing that can happen to a transwoman in a women's toilet/changing room is that a woman asks them to leave

So you think it’s ok for all trans people to have no comfortable public place ever to use the toilet, because of some prejudiced fantasy that trans people are likely to be sex offenders entering the toilet to rape girls?

Im out as I have high blood pressure and this conversation is not good for my health 😅.

Beowulfa · 05/10/2023 13:30

We shouldn't hate a whole community because of a few theroetical or rare criminals.

Do you think we should have safeguarding rules for Catholic priests and Scout leaders? Or are such rules hateful to the community?

Tandora · 05/10/2023 13:31

ArabellaScott · 05/10/2023 13:25

And in no way are girls - female children - obliged to save grown men from 'suffering' due to feeling dysphoric.

We are not fucking support humans.

We are equally as important as men.

God now it’s all about the children.

remember when all gay men were thought to be peados? This is you.

Bananasandcorn · 05/10/2023 13:31

If you believe the GRA is wrong and should go, ask yourself why after 13 years its not even been reformed?

As for your reasonable Q: I want to see properly funded public services, single sex wards, rape prosecutions up, i want to see the GRC reformed so that the balance is put back in favour of women and girls, so men do not have the right to go into a DV refuge for example, with the onus on the refuge to justify their exclusion.

But overall, i believe that men in women's spaces is primarily caused by a lack of funding.

I also think that 90% plus of GRC's being handed out is far too high, its almost self ID isn't it?

BlurredEdges · 05/10/2023 13:32

Agesifent · 05/10/2023 13:26

Transgender hate crimes increased 11% in the last year. Wonder why.

Years ago, people would defend homophobia based on a theoretical scenario about a "gay criminal or pervert". They'd point ar one very rare or theoretical case and use it to justify hating all gay people. It was wrong and thankfully we moved on from that.

But it's the same today with transgender rights

People use extreme theoretical scenarios and fears to justify hatred.

I've mixed in very cosmopolitan social scenes and never once come across transgender people in the loo anyway (not that I'd care) so I very much doubt Susan from beckington will experience the horrendous inconvenience of a man in a dress in her local loo.

And if a criminal did put on a dress to enter ladies loos to do harm then that is because he is a criminal not transgender

We shouldn't hate a whole community because of a few theroetical or rare criminals.

This is all so horrid. And now thanks to Tory culture wars, hate crimes are up. Just like hate crimes against foreigners went up post Brexit campaign.

Idiots getting their knickers in a twist over an imagined enemy again

so I very much doubt Susan from beckington will experience the horrendous inconvenience of a man in a dress in her local loo.

In 2018 Katie Dolatowski filmed a 12-year-old-girl who was using a public toilet. A month later, he sexually assaulted a 10-year-old girl in the women’s toilets at a supermarket. He grabbed the terrified child by the face, forced her into a cubicle, threatened to stab her and ordered her to take off her clothes. He pleaded guilty to voyeurism and sexual assault charges.
In 2019 Dolatowski was back in court on two separate occasions, accused of deleting the internet history on his phone and then of making <a class="break-all" href="https://archive.ph/o/nFKm3/www.thecourier.co.uk/fp/news/courts/866968/sex-offender-who-targeted-young-children-in-fife-supermarket-toilets-given-jail-warning-for-breaching-strict-community-order/" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">‘alarming’ internet searches. In 2022 it was revealed that he had been accommodated in a domestic violence refuge for vulnerable women and children after he tricked the centre’s staff by using a false name and pretending to be an abuse victim.
In November 2022 Dolatowski was <a class="break-all" href="https://archive.ph/o/Xymar/www.thecourier.co.uk/fp/news/courts/3871936/friday-court-round-up-disablist-slur-and-drugs-cupboard/" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">sentenced to four months imprisonment. He was originally incarcerated at Polmont Young Offenders’ Institution. There he ‘battered’ another male inmate. Witnesses saw Dolatowski, who is 6 feet 5 inches tall, “Holding (the victim) over a table and punching him to the back of his head”. Warders ‘escorted’ Dolatowski back to a cell and he was subsequently placed on report. He was then moved to Cornton Vale women’s prison.

Idiots getting their knickers in a twist over an imagined enemy again

Hospital staff advised police that a patient could not have been raped because her alleged attacker was transgender, the House of Lords has been told.
Officers investigating the attack, which allegedly occurred a year ago, were told that “the rape could not have happened” because no male was there.
Neither the hospital nor the investigating police force have been named.
Baroness Nicholson of Winterbourne, who raised the issue during a debate on single-sex wards in hospitals, said: “They forgot that there was CCTV, nurses and observers.
“Nonetheless, it has taken nearly a year for the hospital to agree that there was a male on the ward and, yes, this rape happened.
“During that year she [the victim] has almost come to the edge of a nervous breakdown because being disbelieved about being raped in hospital has been such an appalling shock.
“The hospital, with all its CCTV, has had to admit that the rape happened and that it was committed by a man.”

Police are still investigating the case. Under the legal definition, a rape can only be carried out by a physically intact man.

Nicholson said that the case was a direct result of the NHS policy, known as Annex B, which allows patients to be placed on single-sex wards according to the gender with which they identify.

Speaking in the Lords, she said: “The result of Annex B is that hospital trusts inform ward sisters and nurses that if there is a male, as a trans person, in a female ward, and a female patient or anyone complains, they must be told that it is not true — there is no male there.

“I think it is completely wrong that the National Health Service should be instructing or allowing staff to mislead patients to tell a straightforward lie. It is not acceptable.”

The peer called for the policy to be withdrawn, arguing that it “gives priority to trans people over women” and therefore threatens the “dignity, privacy and safety” of female patients.

The former Tory MP said that the policy “undermines” the provision of single-sex wards and protections for women that “took at least 50 years to come through”.

Transgender paedophile duped staff for 71-day stay at women's refuge

Paedophile Katie Dolatowski, 22, who was born male, duped staff into letting her stay at a Leeds domestic violence refuge for women and children for 71 days.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-11392601/Transgender-paedophile-caught-duping-staff-71-day-stay-domestic-violence-refuge.html

EasternStandard · 05/10/2023 13:32

Tandora · 05/10/2023 13:29

The worst thing that can happen to a transwoman in a women's toilet/changing room is that a woman asks them to leave

So you think it’s ok for all trans people to have no comfortable public place ever to use the toilet, because of some prejudiced fantasy that trans people are likely to be sex offenders entering the toilet to rape girls?

Im out as I have high blood pressure and this conversation is not good for my health 😅.

Trans people have to find another comfortable place

Women and girls are prioritising safeguarding, dignity and privacy

BlurredEdges · 05/10/2023 13:34

Tandora · 05/10/2023 13:29

The worst thing that can happen to a transwoman in a women's toilet/changing room is that a woman asks them to leave

So you think it’s ok for all trans people to have no comfortable public place ever to use the toilet, because of some prejudiced fantasy that trans people are likely to be sex offenders entering the toilet to rape girls?

Im out as I have high blood pressure and this conversation is not good for my health 😅.

You're out because you can't face the objective facts being presented, because you can't cope with women saying no, and because you're so upset by the fact that women and girls are more concerned with protecting ourselves from violent sexual assault that you've resorted to playground insults.

Good.

Bananasandcorn · 05/10/2023 13:35

@Beowulfa Vast vast majority of women and girls raped and killed are raped and killed by non trans men.

I won't vote Tory again because they have allowed this, they ve allowed violent men to become police officers, they ve allowed rape prosecutions to fall off a cliff, a senior Met officer said most rape claims were "regretful" sex, he is still in position i believe.
They ve effectively got rid of single sex wards in many hospitals due to under funding and allowing staff shortages.

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