Horrible news story

[MumblesParty]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-sussex-66107716

And I can't help wondering if the "women" assailants are actually women.
Poor kid.

I will say it again I'm not cis. I do not have a feminine gender identity. Please do not misgender me by calling me cis.

@evieowlette

I think the litmus test for if a word is offensive at this exact moment is if it's used in modern research papers

All that is a litmus test of is how foolishly indoctrinated modern researchers can be.

The aim of using the terms 'cis' and 'trans' is not clarity, if is a deliberate tactic to control language in a totalitarian manner to suppress the truth, that is, that human beings are sexually dimorphic and cannot change sex.

Male and female are the determinants of sex characteristics.

Transexuals still exist and it is in the law.

How do you erase people? By telling women that there's no word for the class of adult human females, only words for any adult?

So woman means male and female and man means male and female?

Why will you no stop saying we have a gender identity of women? No we don't? That is offensive. I am a person with a personality and a vagina and a mother and no funking way am I cis gender. I will act how i like thank you and I do no identify as a certain stereotype because of my body.
Women are oppressed because pf their vaginas or bonus hole as your friends might call it and I refuse to accept you pushing a cis identity on to me. How dare you? Repeatedly.

It's obvious @Tallisker you are not even trying to understand what i'm saying. It's like being in bible study all over again.

You cannot convince me that a scientific term to distinguish sex characteristics is a slur. In the same way you cannot convince me using the term Transexual is a slur for the same reason.

It does not mattter what you believe

MNHQ consider it a deletable offense IF you persist in calling posters cis

they do allow use of the word if used to describe your self

It is not a scientific term it is possible made up term. Transsexual is a scientific ish term. Tw and tm are made up terms! And please stop I have now reported you.

You need to describe realistic scenarios if you want to make a point.

"Walking up to a woman and calling them a woman" isn't an illustration of anything. It's not a normal occurrence.

We know there are people that use the identity transwomen. They exist or you would not be here attempting to school people.

Referring to men as men irrespective of their personal identity does not cause them to cease to exist.

It's simply an accurate word for male humans.

Gender ideologists attempting to categorise all people as cisgender or transgender is as stupid and offensive as (some) religious people categorising themselves and others according to their own faith.

Christians may view me as a heathen; Jews may view me as a gentile; Muslims may view me as an infidel. As long as they keep their views to themselves that’s fine. If they start trying to insist I refer to myself as a heathen, or try to sack me because I refuse to use their religious words to describe my experiences, that’s when we have a massive problem.

It doesn't distinguish sex characteristics. It denotes identity.

Not everyone has a gender identity. It's quite rare.

The census proved it.

Please can you stop trying to force people to accept the terms cis, cis woman, cisgender. You have been asked to stop, please would you listen. Thank you.

Why is identity a voluntary question in monitoring data?

Is it perhaps because we don't all have one?

You cannot convince me that a scientific term to distinguish sex characteristics is a slur. In the same way you cannot convince me using the term Transexual is a slur for the same reason.

We don't have the same beliefs.

Are you unwilling to accept that people have different beliefs to you?

Women are not just oppressed because of there sex characteristics. What a ridiculous statement. It is a part of the oppression against women and a pretty significant part of it. The risk of an unwanted pregnancy still terrifies me.

I want to make the point about Trans Women now because you consider Trans Men Women anyway from what I can tell. If not that's one hell of a double standard.
Trans Women can face the same levels of misogyny with an added sprinkle of Transphobia. The risk of assault, especially Sexual Assault doesn't go down for Trans Women either and there are added challenges for Trans Women that Cisgender women don't have to worry about. Not as much as periods or the risk of pregnancy but they do exist.

I wont argue when I say I think Trans Women may have it easier in some cases but from what I can tell they also experience dysphoria which is impossible really for other people to understand, especially those happy with there sex characteristics. my non binary friend always tells me the the worst thing about being non binary isn't the identity in itself it's trying to explain to others and the hatred they get from just existing and dressing androgynous, asking people to use They/Them pronouns etc...

It doesn't distinguish sex characteristics. It denotes identity.

The issue is that evie doesn't seem to be up-to-date with gender identity - evie is frequently talking about transsexuals, and seems to be using "trans" to mean "transsexual", or "has had some sort of surgery to attempt to imitate the opposite sex". Which then makes "cis" "has not had some sort of surgery to attempt to imitate the opposite sex".

Given those definitions, "cis" is meaningful. It's true that most of us have "not had some sort of surgery to imitate the opposite sex".

But that's NOT the definition of "trans" in common use, and hence it's not the definition of "cis".

"Trans" means "has a gender identity different from their sex/assigned-sex-at-birth/assigned-gender-at-birth/whatever-you call it". "Cis" means "has a matching gender identity".

That is the offensive nonsense - the claim about our non-existent gender identities.

@NecessaryScene evie also doesn't realise that all it takes to be a transwoman is to say you are. No diagnosis of dysphoria needed, no change of clothes, no needing to appear feminine

I'm not forcing anyone to use the term. You don't have to use the term if you don't want i'm just making an explanation of why calling Trans Women "Men" erases there unique experiences entirely which is pretty offensive. If you don't want to call a Trans Woman a Woman don't. Call them a Trans Women. Seriously what is the issue here?

As I described above as well the experiences of most Trans Women are not similar in any way to those of a man as well. For Trans Women who undergo GRS or take hormones there are additional factors such as an increased risk of breast cancer which are all erased if you ignore the term "Trans Women"

Seriously what is the issue here?

The issue is "trans women are women". Before anyone started saying that there was no real problem with using the term transwomen, because it seemed that everyone understood they weren't women, they were men being given certain accomodations.

But now it seems they're being placed into women's prisons and sports "because they're women". Hence we have to be very, very clear that they are not.

If they stop saying they're women, we'll be able to stop saying they're men.

Women are not just oppressed because of there sex characteristics. What a ridiculous statement.

How rude of you, given how patient people have been with you. Why else are women oppressed then, apart from their biology? I'll wait.

And too right it's like being back in bible study.
Cisgender is, I'll repeat ,not a scientific term as it doesn't describe anything scientific. It describes a gender identity, which is a minority belief. It is in no way concrete or observable.
Don't confuse science and social science.

It's a unique experience only men have.

The issue I have is everyone using the term "Men" when describing Trans Women. It doesn't make any sense. There are the terms AFAB and AMAB which are commonly shared in Trans communities and although a bit weird as acronyms they describe what you're on about and make it obvious you are talking about sex instead of a persons gender. I will repeat if you think sex is the same as gender fine but I can't agree to that because there is a reason for having 2 separate terms to help categorise peoples experiences properly.

For Trans Women who undergo GRS or take hormones there are additional factors such as an increased risk of breast cancer which are all erased if you ignore the term "Trans Women"

Quite. They need to be treated medically as men who are taking cross-sex hormones and possibly have had certain surgeries. Anything else is foolish and dangerous.

Am I a transwoman? I was born female so can I be a transwoman and if not why not?

@evieowlette