Horrible news story

[MumblesParty]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-sussex-66107716

And I can't help wondering if the "women" assailants are actually women.
Poor kid.

Women are oppressed on the basis of their biology. Gender is the social expression of how the differences between men and women are viewed, therefore gender is sociatal oppression of women.
Anyone who willingly describes themselves as a ciswoman is colluding with their own oppression, and calling me cis is attempting to force me into that too.

I don't agree at all with the rebranding of gender as an identity. It's a made-up nonsense, a nouveau religion for the atheist west. Have your religion by all means but don't attempt to coerce me into joining it, that is no better than the church in the middle ages. Don't call me cis.

I think the litmus test for if a word is offensive at this exact moment is if it's used in modern research papers. The fact that you would be happy to declare these papers "offensive" for the use of a word that has been used since the 1990s and added into the dictionary 8 years ago is kind of baffling.

Not to mention the word "cis" has existed forever and has plenty of scientific purposes for e.g. The prefix “cis-” comes from the Latin meaning “on this side,” as opposed to “trans-” which means “on the other side of” or “beyond.”
I've used the word "cis" to describe different isomers in chemistry.

I am way more concerned about erasing words than adding prefixes for the purpose of identification especially since the English language unlike for e.g. the German Language already lacks a bunch of useful descriptors for specific things.

The issue I think is this term originated from Transgender groups and Trans supportive LGBT groups and anything that comes from these groups according to you is automatically bad. Regardless of it's usefulness

See my post just above yours.

The issue I think is this term originated from Transgender groups and Trans supportive LGBT groups and anything that comes from these groups according to you is automatically bad. Regardless of it's usefulness

You think wrong. I am a woman, an adult human female, assigned female at conception, a word as old as time. I do not need any prefix, everybody knows what a woman is even if they pretend to #BeKind.

There are women and men, and there are trans women and trans men.

I don't really get the issue you have with the term "Ciswoman" though. You want categories to distinguish peoples sexual characteristics and the easiest way to do this without asking about someones genitals is to ask "Are you Transgender or are you Cisgender". Just because it's a new word doesn't mean it's offensive. It seems like everyone here is shooting themselves in the foot. Another thing is trying to convince a Trans Woman they are a Man is just going to fast track an end to any conversation with them so why not find a common term.

Equally not everyones Gender is based around there Sex. Some people (namely Transgender and Non-binary people) refuse this statement and I think that makes sense. If Gender is determined entirely by a persons sex characteristics there is no need for the word. What happens when someone changes there primary or secondary sex characteristics as well then? If you really look into it as well the only way you can accurately determine someones sex is if they are on the developmental pathway to develop the large or small gametes from what I read from Kathleen Stocks book. I don't see how this definition is helpful in any way outside of scientific research.

I should add "Outside of scientific research and medical concerns". You aren't going to ask a partner "Do you produce the large gamete" after all.

I don't really get the issue you have with the term "Ciswoman" though. You want categories to distinguish peoples sexual characteristics and the easiest way to do this without asking about someones genitals is to ask "Are you Transgender or are you Cisgender". Just because it's a new word doesn't mean it's offensive. It seems like everyone here is shooting themselves in the foot.

What do you understand "cisgender" to mean, evieowlette?

The terms "men" and "women" are fine. We're basically talking at cross-purposes because you have a particular belief that you're mistaking for objective reality.

You don't need to ask what sex I am ; I am clearly female, an adult, therefore a woman. People who are trans are just that, and it's often obvious that they are.

"Please use a condom as I don't wish to have your small mobile gametes fertilising my large immobile gametes, dear."

I'm just going to grab the definition from the dictionary at this point. Denoting or relating to a person whose gender identity corresponds with the sex registered for them at birth

Another thing is trying to convince a Trans Woman they are a Man is just going to fast track an end to any conversation with them so why not find a common term.

It's more the other way around. They try to convince people they are not men. That's the starting point.

Volkmar Sigusch (11 June 1940 – 7 February 2023) was a German sexologist, physician and sociologist who coined the term cisgender.

He was also an apologist for paedophilia.

I don't use the term cisgender.

Denoting or relating to a person whose gender identity corresponds with the sex registered for them at birth

Again that's just a religious belief though. Like a soul. You're talking about gender identity like it's a concrete thing but it's just a belief, that not everyone shares.

Denoting or relating to a person whose gender identity corresponds with the sex registered for them at birth

Ok, so assuming that gender identity is an inner sense of gender that can only be defined by the individual in question, and assuming that the person in question doesn't believe gender identity as a concept, then they aren't included in this definition are they?

I never said they weren't but equally why can nobody here acknowledge "Transgender" as a valid term. You can have more than one word for the same thing it's not possible. Those words can be more detailed descriptions of the original one as well.

Like if you wanted something to sit on you would ask for a Chair. If you want a rotating chair ask for a swivel one. This just requires a very basic understanding of the english language.

Man = an individual who belongs to the class that produces small mobile gametes.

Therefore, transwomen are men.

If you want a description of something that actually has the potential to be oppressive look no further than the removal of the words "Male and Female" when discussing sex characteristics. This is because saying "Someone with a Penis or with a Vagina etc..." is inherently more confusing for the vast majority of people especially younger folk and erases a potentially useful descriptor.

FFS STOP Calling Us Cis!

Just stop it. It's offensive to me. It is so rude to impose a derogatory and disrespectful term on people who have repeatedly asked you not to.

Also, this offensive term is not allowed to be used on this board. People who choose to continue to ignore women who ask you not to refer to them in that way, can and will be removed from the site by MN.

Language should be useful and relevant. Discussing whether someone owns the correct Gametes or more so where on the developmental pathway to them is only useful in medical and science topics. Asking your mate "Do you produce the large Gamete" is kind of useless especially since they probably wont even know and you cannot actually determine that by looking at someones genitals which you shouldn't do anyway (obviously)

I'd also argue trying to remove a term "Cisgender" which is inherently a scientific one used to help determine differences in sex characteristics is just inherently bad. Some Transgender people consider the term "Transsexual" offensive because of what it remains in scientific papers because it is a useful descriptor. Removing the word Cisgender is doing exactly the same thing and proves you are not better than the people you claim to try and erase.

"because of what it implies but it remains..."

It's not a scientific term as it's not describing a scientific phenomenon.

The prefix “cis-” comes from the Latin meaning “on this side,” as opposed to “trans-” which means “on the other side of” or “beyond.”

Exactly so transwomen are on the other side to women, AKA men.

Anyway many people, myself included, have told you not to use it in relation to us yet you persist, which is offensive. Stop it.