Girl Sues Hospital for Removing Her Breasts at Age 13

[zibzibara]

This is in the US, I hope she wins, this could be the beginning of the end for this gender ideology driven medical abuse over there:

https://www.theepochtimes.com/girl-sues-hospital-for-removing-her-breasts-at-age-13-post_5335492.html

I can't read that without creating an account.

Is there any report that doesn't require me to give clicks to the Epoch Times? Not a fan.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-11873443/California-teen-sues-doctors-breast-removal-surgery-13-Kaiser-Permanentes-2nd-lawsuit.html

https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4768514-us-detransitioner-layla-jane-suing-after-double-mastectomy-at-13

I'm not in the UK. A family member transitioned. They had many, many sessions with a pyschologist before any treatment at all could be started. It was not a matter of turning up and saying that they were a different gender. The parents were initially shocked (major understatement there) but came to accept that their child truly was transgender - yes I understand they tried reasoning, and frankly everything they could think of to convince the child that they were the original gender. They told me they were haunted by the idea of later regrets.

Their child did transition. The child is in a long standing relationship. They have friends. They are doing a post graduate degree. They are happpy. The family pulled together and adopted the new gender, even the grandparents got on board showing an amazingly broad minded side we had never seen before. So far as I know, the young person has not had a single regret a decade later. This is the other side of the story.

Did that child have their breasts amputated at age thirteen? What percentage of children facing regret at having healthy organs permanently removed is acceptable?

I think lawsuits and very big payouts is the only thing that will make America regain its moral compass on this.

As I said on another thread, my adult son is apparently trans. The sessions with a psychologist appear to be him saying 'I'm trans' and the professional agreeing. There have been hardly any , some were over zoom , so I could actually hear what my son was saying ( No I wasn't trying to snoop). My son does nothing, absolutely nothing, that would make any sane person think he is actually a she. I won't say more, but I am distressed by all of this because I know it will cause regret.

So what do you propose?

Since we have no idea when an 11 or 13 or 15 year old going through adolescense - an age when most have some identity angst / crisis, and are easily influenced, and spend a ton of time online, and want acceptance, and think they know a lot more than they do, and all the other developmental aspects of that age - decide they want body parts cut off or hormones to permanently alter their growth and development - and we know that down the road some will regret it and feel mutilated and harmed and others will not - what do we do?

Do we cut off the breasts of all 11/13/15 year olds who feel confused through puberty and just cross our fingers that they are happy with it ten years later and say too bad so sad to the ones who are devastated by the mutilation of their bodies? Or do we instead say no, we are not cutting off functional body parts or permanantly altering your growth and development as you are a child and once they are adults they can make those decisions if they still feel the same way.

I was given the option of a major surgery on my foot at the age of 15. My primary (and developmentally normal) concern at the time was the kind of shoes I could wear. I really didn't understand the repercussions of the surgery from an orthopedic standpoint or what osteoarthritis would feel like down the road or what other potential challenges there would be. I was mostly interested in what shoes I could or couldn't wear and how long would I be in a cast and would it interfere with getting my driver's licence and would recovery interfere with some holiday plans I had. If I had the discussion about my surgery at 25 or 35, it would have been extremely different to what it was at 15 as my wordview, life experience, priorities, indpependence etc were all different.

Our minds and decision making capabilities are limited at 13 by not only brain development but by our narrow environment and life experience and by how impressionable and suggestible children are. So many detransitioners have talked about how they were just really confused and struggling at that age and as adults they realized that it was more about sexual orientation or about mental health / illness or about childhood trauma or about self hatred / not fitting in or about peer pressure / acceptance from the trans community or about vulnerability to ideologies when they were young or not understanding the ramifications for them. Is it fair to gamble with their lives and bodies?

Since we're always being told that gender-affirming surgery is not done on minors, and since everyone on all sides appears to agree that is a good thing, perhaps everyone should aim to stick to that. Why are these families ending up with psychotically right-wing pressure groups to lead their lawsuits? Do any of them go to normal law firms and get turned away, or are these horrific groups ambulance-chasing to dig them out?

Right now anything perceived as anti-trans is still a bit of a career death knell so it is probably hard to get non right wing law teams to take it.

I agree it is unfortunate as it makes it seem like a politicial / religious ideological objection rather than what it actually is.

There can be no circumstances when it is appropriate to perform a cosmetic mastectomy on a 13 year old. Not one. It cannot be considered life saving for their mental health etc. That is what good mental health care and puberty are for. Only some terrible tragedy like cancer could justify such a procedure.

I agree. I really hope she wins and gets a massive pay out.

DD3 (14) was asking me when she could have 'all of this ripped out' (referring to her reproductive organs) because she's never going to want children so it's a waste anyway.

I said that many teenagers think they will never want children and most women change their mind at some point. Besides, she needs the hormones and it's really important for bone density, etc.

DD3 had no idea that her reproductive organs had any other function than creating babies. She had no idea that there could be medical implications from removing them. Our children need better education about what it is to be female, what our bodies do, how they function. Then they may respect the 'stupid baby making parts'.

This is such an important point yet rarely discussed.

Removing the breasts of a young teenager is akin to FGM

There cannot be another side to removing healthy breasts to support what is really, a big fat lie.

I'm glad in the case of the young person you know she's doing ok but it's an absolute travesty if healthy functioning body parts were removed.

i agree and I hope she wins . Unfortunately there are a lot more like her in the USA .it’s extremely sad .

@loislovesstewie I'm so so about what you're going through. Are you receiving any support? Get in touch with the Bayswater Support group. They're a gender critical support group run by parents for parents.

We so need to stop having cutsey names for things. " gender affirming care" thats adults gaslighting adults and children into believing the impossible.

Top surgery- its a double mastectomy. Ita a bloody major operation. Creates scar tissue which could prevent the child from being able to have full range if motion moving their arms because scR tissue doesn't scar/stretch like regular skin.

Bottom surgery- removing the oenis and testicals. Or having scalped your arm applying a rolled up piece of flesh.

The deliberate attempt to sanotise the language so we don't see it for what it is is disturbing. We can't use the C word but what else do you call removal of oenis and testicle. If you cant say it why are we doing it?

You are taking a healthy functioning body and creating disabilities. Incontinence etc

No one benefits except the medical profession.

And then of course if we say kids can consent to a.mastectomy and puberty blockers why can't the consent to sex? Can anyone see whare thats going ?

I'm.so glad no one pinned me down at 13 to be or do what I said because I was 13. I knew Jack.shit. imagine having your fertility and ability to breastfeed removed for life becuase of what you felt at 13.

Why are drugs so toxic they need to be handled with gloves considered safer than paracetamol fgs. We can discuss the side effects akd dangers of paracetamol but not of giving healthy cancer free bodies prostate cancer medication? Thats safer akd has less issues than calculations? Really ?

We have removed the ability for kids to know anything about their bodies with all these "people with vaginas " malarkey.

Funny how the same people who feel kids can consent and know who they are at 2 are also the same people who are removing any possible route to alternative options or biological facts. Why be so afraid of reality of you are right?

Less issues than calpol sorry for all the typos my phone screen is cracked and I haven't had a coffee yet

Some brilliant posts here. Spot on @Freefall212

Children. Cannot. Consent.

Violasaremyfavourite

I’m glad your family member had a lot of psychological assessment before they made irreversible changes to their body.

Unfortunately, that is not what is happening now in the US and the UK - proper psychological assessment is considered ‘conversion therapy’ and ‘transphobic’.

The clinics practise ‘affirmation’ which means that any exploration or questioning of a patients ‘trans identity’ is forbidden. The only criteria for the diagnosis of ‘gender incongruence’ is that the patient says that they have it. So diagnosis can be made after two brief appointments at the clinic. With plenty of time at the second appointment to discuss what treatments the patient would like, the long term side effects of the treatment (mostly unknown, but including sterility), and gain the patients ‘informed consent’.

The patient is then started on hormone therapy.

Thankfully, this has been stopped in the U.K. for children, but it is still happening in the adult gender clinics. To 18 year olds whose brains are not yet fully developed, with no experience of adult life.

There is no evidence that hormonal and surgical ‘transition’ improves patients’ mental health in the long term. It inevitably damages their physical health.

This is the biggest scandal in the history of medicine, and sadly many patients will deeply regret the damage done to their beautiful, young healthy bodies. And hopefully sue the doctors who did it, and the others who enabled it, including the NHS, because they were blinded by ideology.

I remember years ago, mumsnet was the only place that you could discuss opposing surgery like this and I remember people on here saying that in years to come there will be a lot of court cases.

Well here we go.

The last picture on that Mail article really tells a story- the mastectomy scars right next to self harm scars

How can people not connect the dots?

@TheHandbag Many thanks for that. I was not aware this group existed. I shall look into it.