Should they have told me they were trans?

[DuckDuckDiva]

Or is it the same as not telling someone you have kids until after a week or so of messaging? I've been messaging a guy I met online last week. It's been 6 days of messaging. Was due to meet up tomorrow, but they've chosen to tell me now that they're trans but haven't had reassignment surgery yet. I haven't messaged back yet, and am unsure if my annoyance is justified or if I should just let it go? You'd never know by looking at them, facial hair, sounded male on the phone, big build etc (I know women can also have big builds). I'm not attracted to women, and the idea of being with someone with a vagina is not something I would consider. I'm not sure how to word my next message to them. AIBU to think they should have been clear on their profile, or told me off the bat?

For anyone who thinks I'm not genuine, I absolutely am, have been on mn for a while, but have name changed this evening. Am not here to cause a trans debate, just feel a bit duped.

Careful @Shugga My post was deleted and was far less explicit than yours.

Just feels off that I've technically been chatting to a woman all week when I'm not attracted to women. That doesn't feel OK.

I agree.

You were specifically looking for a heterosexual relationship; this isn't it. Your boundaries are perfectly acceptable.

At least they told you & didn't gaslight you for longer than a week.

But correct sexing.

I think this is appalling, and would feel upset at the deception too. It's really not ok at all. I'd ghost this one, she doesn't deserve a response after bullshitting you all week.

"Trust you with a secret" is creepy AF.

Considering some of the posts on here I can see why someone wouldn't want to disclose being trans unless they felt a connection. Imagine risking replies like some of the ones suggested on here every time you disclosed it? I think most would be selective about who they told. Surely whatever you can be GC and recognise why someone wouldn't want to risk getting responses like some on here with multiple people they had no connection with.

Op, they told you before you met and didn't try and dupe you into meeting them without disclosing. I they were just trying to avoid receiving messages that would be hurtful to them. I would just politely decline in your shoes.

Why would they get those responses if they matched with people who specifically say they are into trans people?

If they target people on heterosexual dating sites knowing they are the same sex as the people there messaging what do they expect?!

If they messaged people on trans dating sites who say they are open to trans people there would be ZERO issue.

The risk of getting 'responses like these' is based in the fact they are knowingly trying to have a sexual relationship with people who they know won't want to have one!

It's really sad that young people don't seem to understand that being trans will make your chances of finding a sexual and romantic relationship much smaller.

They need to know this!

YANBU, OP.

I agree. It’s heartbreaking that vulnerable people are being lied to, told that others only ‘see’ their gender identity.

In reality, the overwhelming majority of people are attracted to primary and secondary sex characteristics - they are the things that actually turn us on, and if you mess around with their appearance and function with medication and surgery, you are going to make yourself much less attractive to the vast majority of people, only an extremely rare person with a fetish for that specific kind of bodily intervention will not be put off.

Lesbian, gay, straight, bi. We all are attracted to the characteristics of a person’s actual sex.

“Imagine risking replies like some of the ones suggested on here every time you disclosed it? I think most would be selective about who they told.”

I suggest that if you don’t understand about how deception and consent works that is your own issue. If people have not specified that they are interested in trans people on a dating app, when there is those particular choices available, the issue is with the person ignoring the boundaries.

This is a dating app. Not a ‘find a friend’ app. Why should anyone find it acceptable to have someone ignore the available boundaries? FFS! It would be transphobic to have to state ‘no trans people’ but the OP was clearly looking for a ‘male’ people and had not ticked the ‘trans person’ boxes and you are here defending someone who ignored the OPs requirements deliberately.

“Surely whatever you can be GC and recognise why someone wouldn't want to risk getting responses like some on here with multiple people they had no connection with.”

and

”didn't try and dupe you into meeting them without disclosing”

This is that coerciveness again.

What response would any person who completely ignored boundaries and lied expect? Why tell a group of people they can lie, just for a short time to test the person out, as long as you tell the truth before you meet? How long is that ok for?

No! Please stop telling people their boundaries are hateful. And that people should not express their angry at being deceived.

And definitely stop telling people, hey at least you found out in [insert time this group is allowed to lie for] time so you should be happy to have found out before you [insert milestone of your choice here].

The coercion, for clarity, is you telling people to accept dishonesty for any amount of time to accommodate another person’s wishes. That someone who wanted to have a relationship with a male should even give x time to a deliberately dishonest female.

That is you, lowering other people’s boundaries right there.

”they were just trying to avoid receiving messages that would be hurtful to them”

To be very blunt, what this person on the dating app has done could also be described as predatory.

The behaviour you are excusing is where someone deliberately ignores a boundary to hope the other person feels too committed, too polite, too ‘whatever’, to say no to a relationship they knew from the start that the person wasn’t open to.

And you are making excuses for it, while telling women off for discussing it.

People who are telling trans people that this behaviour is acceptable, or are minimising it, need to stop.

This is not acceptable. It never was. Coming onto a thread and posting :

“Surely whatever you can be GC and recognise why someone wouldn't want to risk getting responses like some on here with multiple people they had no connection with.”

as an excuse for deceiving people, is aiding that deceptive behaviour.

There is no excuse for a trans person to ignore someone else’s boundaries. Yet some people seem very keen in creating a class of people with special entitlements. And some people have allowed themselves to fully support it, even tell others to accept it too, under the guise of tolerance and kindness.

To do this, doesn’t benefit anyone in the end, except a predator who will take advantage of the newly created group of people who society has told shouldn’t expect their boundaries to be respected in the name of kindness and tolerance.

Just to update, I messaged back saying that they must have their settings wrong as I hadn't selected trans when signing up, and that I was no longer interested. They responded by telling me they were due to have surgery so if I'd reconsider they'd still be up for meeting. I haven't responded to that one as don't want to be plastered all over local sites being called a bigot (I know this happens) and this thread is already very outing so going to leave it there.

I'm going to put in a word for the theoretical pansexual, here. Again, its not the 'gender identity' that's an issue, it's the lack of honesty.

It's much the same as describing yourself as 'over 6 ft' and turning up in person as your full 5'2". Even if you're wearing Cuban heels, even if you spend the whole date sitting down, even if your date doesn't actually mind how tall or short their prospective partner is, the lie is what becomes the defining issue. In my view.

Imagine risking replies like some of the ones suggested on here every time you disclosed it?

Nope. It was because she didn't disclose it. It's because of a lie, not the truth. It's because of dishonesty, not honesty.

Stop gaslighting.

Thanks for the update OP. Probably wise to leave it as you said. I feel sad that any female feels that that series of operations will be helpful. They are brutal operations with very low success.

Their reaction shows that this person really is believing the mantras. Either in desperation to calm their own doubts or for other reasons.

And if they believe those mantras, what other very loose variations of perception are they willing to accept as material fact.

Mind you OP. The person on your app seems to be following the same ‘dating’ guide as NixieRose.

It is very concerning.

Poor sod believing that this brutal surgery will make a difference to whether straight women want to date. I don't understand why people would do this to themselves, they sound so used to rejection.

I wonder if putting you're a trans man gets you a load of not at all transitioned "TW" creeps which they then have no grounds for rejecting because of their own professed ideology.

Whereas if we were all open and honest about these things, "TM, interested in dating W" would be okay to say. Niche, but on a big dating site you will find people. I know at least one woman that would be really interested, "pansexual" in any sense. You won't find her by randomly searching for straight women though.

Yes they should.

My 21 year old ds recently had the same situation.

He was talking to a ‘girl’ on a dating site for 6 weeks and on the phone. They hasn’t met up yet due to work/uni.

They set a date and the day before she told him that she was transsexual.

Ds came to me to ask me what to say. He didn’t want to meet. He has no interest in men. He’s also a police officer, which this person knew, so has to word things carefully. I advised him to ask one of his superiors at work before he did anything, which he did.

They advised ds to say nothing and just block the person. He did, but they found him again after making another profile and subjected ds to a torrent of abuse saying they were going to report him to his work. Ds never relied to anything but they were saying he was transphobic for blocking him after he sent the text telling him he was transsexual.

Thank goodness that ds has already spoken to his bosses. They advised him to keep all screenshots, block again and remove himself from the app and that he did absolutely nothing wrong.

The whole thing has just made me feel fucking terrible for ds.

What an awful ideal and that is exactly why I am scared this person might have done similar to me. Looks like my concerns were justified as this clearly does happen. So sorry that happened to your son, and well done for having the foresight to encourage him to speak to work. Good move mum!

’The surgery’ is in three parts, over several years!

Well done on the reply. Hopefully you’ll
match with someone who has a better understanding of consent next time.

Sorry. I posted completely the wrong screenshots - those are from an FOI re the new service at Chelsea and Westminster do NHS funded "masculinising genital surgery". No doubt where the OP's trans man is headed.

Apologies.
I don't know what is ring with my phone. It won't access all m photo library.

The twitter link worked. That is very concerning on a number of levels.