What have people done when asked pronouns? (but are not trans ideologists)

[newbookonshelf]

I've never been asked my pronouns but I wonder what I would say if I was. I WFH so never come up. I think I may say 'none' , 'you pick' , or maybe 'the' or simply 'what do you mean?'

So I'm just wondering how people do respond to this if they are not gender/trans ideologists. I'm looking for examples and what happened when you said it.

woketastic! Haa I've not heard that phrase but it sounds like a tangfastic.

Should we make a fuss if a male she/her wants to use the women's toilets? What about if a male she/her wants to swim against us is competitions? What about if a she/her who has raped women gets put in women's prison?

At what point does making a fuss become appropriate?

Because for me it's appropriate to make a fuss at the very top of that slope. At the point when pronouns are asked in business meetings. That's when I start making a fuss.

www.bbc.co.uk/worldservice/learningenglish/language/theenglishwespeak/2011/01/110125_tews_3_tastic_page.shtml

I embrace language change when it adds to the richness of the language. Not so much when people want to take perfectly good woods and change their meaning to something they can't even define.

I'm still waiting for the answer as to how we know what our pronouns are if they are not sex based but instead depend on the meaning of the words women and man

Increasingly feeling i simply cannot be arsed doing this for the benefit of other professionals in the NHS - I don't give a shit if HR give me a badge or not. Would probably happily do it in 1:1 with a real patient or person who i thought would appreciate me meeting them halfway.

As a husband and supporter of a feminist wife and two feminist daughters I’ve decided as I’m in my late 50’s to play the misogynistic Joker card.

so “what gender am I” sorry I don’t understand gender. What do you mean?

then I can have hours of fun. Recent exchange condensed (but real words used)

wow so you are telling me to blokes can become women and have children.

long silence… well actually no no, only certain females can have babies.

no idea what you have just said. Can women have babies?
answer - only certain women

me; cool do we call then women then

This could all be solved if we go back to the good old days- my name is Mrs Aveline. My name is Mr So-and-so. Miss. Ms? No pronoun addition required!

Yes, I often read letters from foreign born doctors, he/she seem to be used at random, sometimes patients change sex several times in the same letter.

Luckily none of my patients care about this flagrant 'misgendering'.

Most people don't care about being misgendered or even mis-sexed in written or verbal communication. I certainly don't and I have had the experience of being misgendered repeatedly in my daily life as I interact with people all around the world in my job.

I don't think it's that mentally healthy to encourage people to think being 'misgendered' or having the wrong pronouns used about you is offensive. It's not. If you can't cope with that then adult life is going to be tough.

You also can't force other people to see you as a sex you're not (or indeed anything else not based in reality- I'd love to have red hair but I can't force people to say I do when I don't). That's where the idea of 'misgendering' as offensive comes from.

Imagine the amount of time that'll be wasted by much needed foreign doctors and nurses if 'misgendering' becomes a crime. Do people want medical care or correct pronoun usage?

"I don't think it's that mentally healthy to encourage people to think being 'misgendered' or having the wrong pronouns used about you is offensive. It's not. If you can't cope with that then adult life is going to be tough."

I agree but we all know that the real issue for certain people is that others are actually using the correct pronouns for their sex rather than the incorrect pronouns. Whether by accident or not, it's a reminder that they will never change sex.

@H34th Agree. France is just beginning to get pelted with this which will be odd since like many European languages it is highly sexed (!) - and don't get me onto Basque. But then you have Estonian which is totally unsexed.

That falls into my third paragraph then. I'll call the person in question by their correct pronoun which corresponds to their sex. They don't get to police my speech.

But am I a mr or Mrs if mr is for men and Mrs for women we are still needing a working definition of men and women

Please add ? After the 7th word for readability

I’ve just said ‘no I’m not doing that’.

The question was about pronouns- saying I’m Mrs Aveline gives your name and preference in one and doesn’t have to feel ‘weird’ for anyone because it’s been around forever. This thread isn’t about defining men and women.

But it is

What are your preferred pronouns?
Answer : chose them to be compatible with wether you see yourself as a man or a woman

What's a man or a woman?
Why should I be mr or he or she or Mrs ?

If it's sex based that's easy - although some people struggle , sex seems to be universally and externally independently observable

But if you need to say , that implies it's not sex based

So forgive me for asking wtf it is then please ?

I ask you to pick tell me if you are flaigtu or pisny ?

Names are used more often than pronouns for sure and is a great way to not misgender someone. But sometimes pronouns are used and if we don't know them, because the person chose not to share or we haven't asked yet, then they/them is the default.

The default pronouns that the vast majority of people actually use to refer to people are 'he' or 'she', based on what sex the person is (which is perfectly evident in virtually all cases). They/them is mostly only used when you are referring to an unspecified person (and therefore not somebody of a specified sex).

If they do not tell you... you use sex-based pronouns, like the majority of the world have been using since (English) language was 'invented'!

how on earth did people communicate pre ca. 2005?!

Seeing as pronouns in emails are rife in my organisation I think it’s only a matter of time before I’m asked in a meeting. I plan to look a little puzzled then say something like “Well I’m female so she/her will do thanks”. Or just ignore the question completely.

I don’t subscribe to gender woo, but something that always puzzles me is this:
You are in a seminar or a business meeting, and the chairperson asks for everyone’s pronouns.
Let’s say the thirty trendy people present answer with a different one each, from xi and fae to wrong sex he/she.
How the fuck is anybody in the meeting supposed to remember which nonsensical pronoun is wanted by which member? And who cares?

Well I was a bit awkward when the midwife asked and just said I'm a woman. She said happy to use she/her? And I just said yes. I wish I'd said something like I don't care what you call me when I'm not there. Or use the obvious ones but in fairness I guess that's what she did. If it was in a work situation I think I would be evasive, I certainly won't be adding to email signature or anything silly like that

not been asked in a work situation - on a (health?) form recently I just put a cross through ‘gender’ - and wrote ‘sex’ female.

No thank you is the correct response I believe…

I'm a born female. I don't have a womany sense of self in the same way that I understand cis- and trans- women do.

What pronouns can I use to indicate my natal sex, which is important to my identity, without falsely claiming alignment to a mental gender I do not in honesty feel?

TIA

I wonder whether transwomen and transmen like declaring their pronouns? I always think, surely if you go to all the trouble of presenting yourself as the opposite sex in dress, voice and mannerisms, taken hormones and maybe even had surgery, you'd hope people would automatically use the pronouns you prefer. I think declaring pronouns has been introduced by those who are not actually trans but want to signal their adherence to gender ideology and by non binary people for whom the only identifying feature of being non binary is telling everyone how special they are and giving them an excuse to bang on about how marginalized they are if anyone (shock, horror) misgenders them.