Gutted that someone I thought might be GC isn't

[pandemuertos]

NC for this.

In my dept at work, we NEVER discuss any of this, but we do talk a lot about books. The other week a young woke colleague brought in a book by someone called Juno Dawson and said something like "it's like a trans Harry Potter, she's really having a go at JKR" in an approving tone. I didn't comment.

Now, another colleague, I've always had my suspicions might be GC, as she's a bit older, very sound of judgement imo and even though we never discuss it, I have always suspected/hoped. Then yesterday she said something on her fb like "I've just finished the Ink Black Heart, she might have some dodgy opinions but wow, the woman cAn write"

And I just feel gutted. I'm tempted to comment (about the book, which I have read, but also about how much I love JKR) but wonder if that will just cause a world of pain for me.

We had some AWFUL training a few months ago (I posted on here at the time but then got it deleted as I was worried it was outing) - but it was the usual stuff- sex assigned at birth, promoted mermaids, the woman even had a link to binders on her own webpage. I complained about it to my boss, and was taken seriously to be fair, but I was gobsmacked that no one else to my knowledge seemed to have an issue with it and just nodded along.

I was listening to an interview between Louise Perry and Julie Bindel the other day where Perry said it was clear, because of recent developments, that the GC side has "won" this "war" but it just doesn't feel that way for me.

I just feel gutted and depressed about it. Just wanting to vent really.

I see the change starting to happen fairly quickly here — well, as fast an institutions ever go. I'm particularly delighted by the recent launch of the Sexual Equality and Equity Network for the civil service which I know came as the result of one government organisation refusing to take on board the concerns of LGB people. I now hope we'll see that model spreading to LAs and universities, so that GC views are adequately representative. But even without that kind of network I see more and more people speaking up and reminding HR departments about their legal rights and women's rights in general.

The US is a hot mess that those of us here can do nothing about.

Thanks, great to see a respectful and informed debate.

If a fat person eats a cake, it's no one's problem but their own, if indeed they consider it a problem at all.

If a paedophile molests a child then there is an innocent victim. That's not a chance that we take. We assume the worst of every single person, asking them to disclose criminal records before they can take positions of responsibility, and we don't leave a complete stranger in charge of our kids. That's not because all complete strangers are perverts, it's because it only takes one to ruin your child's life.

As far as Perry's idea that it's been won, I think she might be right in the UK. But in the same way that in a drawn out war, it may be quite clear that the war is won a year or more before it ends, and the rebuilding will still take years after that.

As far as the Conservatives being more left, I don't know. I always feel that the thing to remember is that traditional British conservatism, and traditional British leftism, have quite a lot in common, including around protections of various social groups, especially if you don't include the more collectivist types of leftism. Liberalism, whether of the left or right, is quite different from both. In some ways I think current political issues are between liberals and others instead of between left and right.

And I should add - both the Conservatives and Labour have those wells of tradition to draw from, but at this moment Labour is not really in that place. Conservativism (small c) is in a time of change at the moment across the English speaking world at least.

I'd be really surprised if your views were outliers, Barny. Women here have been fighting to debate/discuss these issues for years.

Sweet Christ.

You are actually writing this stuff? And you expect people to be polite to you?

I think it's because some people confuse 'morally opportunist' with 'liberal'.

OP, I suspect your woman may not have meant much by her throwaway comment about JKR. Perhaps it was a way to test the waters? Or perhaps she's pro Scottish independence, or doesn't vote Labour?

It is absolutely hilarious to see the dissonance at play in people using ‘young people are so tolerant and the ‘old people are going to die off’ and that ‘young’ people are supposedly going to ensure a better life for all when it may be that those ‘young people’ are now realising that there are major issues and the growing number of young females voicing their concerns is key to that, but that if it was left to that age group those young females would be denounced, isolated and shunned from society.

Like those young girls in America who object to sharing their toilets and changing rooms with male students, funny how genderists such as Freespirit always ignore those young people could that be because they are mere females who are seeing up close and personal exactly how this TWAW mantra negatively impacts them and therefore they must be forcibly denounced and threatened for letting the genie out of the bottle and not being good little submissive sycophants and celebrating having their boundaries trampled, their feelings ignored, their safety, privacy and dignity trashed?

I hold in contempt anyone, like Freespirit who claims to be feminist who prioritises men above women and turns a blind eye to young women being stared at and violated whilst changing just because a male wants a free show. It's repugnant.

It's repugnant.

Course it is. And it's usually accompanied by the complaint that the person gets flamed on here.

Not being flamed for antifeminist sentiment on a feminist board, would be the odd thing.

I'm pretty familiar with people flinging outrageous insults while simultaneously raging at the unfairness of how they are being treated.

These people are not generally adults.

You could use some punctuation if you want people to take you opinions seriously.

*your

I can't understand why Freespirit is here arguing with us all, if, as is the case, she thinks we're all old and are gonna 'die off soon'. Why bother, Freespirit? Or do you visit old folks homes to harangue the occupants as a hobby?

The biggest negative impacts on young people’s lives today come from Brexit and the Tories (in the U.K.), the Republicans in the US, economic mismanagement across the globe, threats of war from Russia and the climate emergency.

Yet here we are, where the righteous youth of today don’t care to bother about all that, but instead see their greatest enemies in largely left wing middle aged feminist women who don’t happen to think that men can become women just by putting on a dress.

Great progressive activism of the future, eh?

I think they see us as an easy target postcardpuffin, I mean what could be easier than flinging abuse, rape threats and death threats at women? Their problem has arisen because that has not shut us up, we have not bowed down meekly.

I've personally been heartened to listen to my DDs and their teen and young women friends (all leftists) who are absolutely angered by Dylan Mulvaney. Teen girls know when they are being mocked and they don't like it. They have big things to worry about like getting a job, finding time for an education, worrying about pregnancy and if they might end up in a state that bans abortions. Young women don't want to put up shit anymore than we old dinosaurs do - they may not be as sophisticated or experienced in saying no...but until I fall over dead, I'm still here, fighting on their behalf. Call me names all you want, I'm not giving up on girls' rights.

Yeah.... don't think it is 'gonna die off soon'....

www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4678627-a-thank-you-to-you-all?reply=121572842

More like as young women get more experience in life and start to process those experiences, they begin to discover what most of the rest of the population has been saying. Especially feminists who have been saying that the needs for women have begun to be neglected and diluted because of another groups.

But... crack on with the mistaken belief that it is all 'very old people', and 'right wing' and 'gonna die off soon'.

bless don’t stop commenting that’s why the gender criticals think they are winning m they really are not. It’s why republicans didn’t do that well more youth are on the right side, lgb alliance pictures very old people it’s gonna die off soon.

Yeah, guess it was all the old people who voted here.

PS @Freespirit42 I hope there are no old people in your life that are aware of your casual ageism and total lack of care or respect for them.

And in the process they make the likelihood of right-wing governments far greater.

lgb alliance pictures very old people it’s gonna die off soon.

I belong to a county-wide group of women who've got together to tackle the worst manifestations of gender ideology in our LA and university, both of which are Stonewalled. We are introducing both to the reality of the Equality Act and may at some point have to stage legal challenges. There were more than 80 women at the last count on the What's App chat group and they include students in their 20s, a growing number of university and LA employees (many under 40) and a lot of ordinary women of all ages we've encountered at our street stalls and pop-ups.

The only people who sign letters from our group or go to meetings with HR heads, the vice chancellor and the deputy head of the council are older women, like me. I'm self-employed and pretty teflon: the TRAs can say what they want. Some of the others who represent the public face of our group are retired after careers working in the law, child safeguarding and HR. We're the ones who can afford to be identified.

The same goes for the LGBA. With so many organisations and even government departments characterising the LGBA as a hate group, most younger supporters are too scared to turn out to a public event and risk losing jobs. So the older lesbians and gay men, people who remember AIDS and Section 28 and lived their lives as second class citizens, get up at 5am and catch trains to central London in order to support not just the LGBA but all the young people who daren't attend.

@nomorequinoa You sound wonderful. I’m sure you’re doing a great job for all us women and our daughters.

We're trying!

I'm particularly in awe of those men and women in their 70s and 80s who are still turning out to support women's and LGB rights. Perhaps you have to have been a woman or LGB in the 50s and 60s to understand what there is to lose. Seeing them ridiculed here just confirms my worst suspicions about TRAs.

I agree with many other posters who have suggested that the OP's colleague may have added the JKR comment to deflect criticism and that their mutual reading of The Ink Black Heart offers an opportunity to start a conversation and explore further. I hope that we get an update if that does take place.