Woman harassed in women's bathroom by a gender critical woman who thinks she is trans, she is upset by the experience.

[MargaritaPie]

twitter.com/KatyMontgomerie/status/1586295024672808961

Which bathroom should these guys use then?

Anyway, in regards to the OP, disgusting behavior. It's not okay, and I find it sad/funny/predicatible that people on here by won't believe it. I know a lot of trans people, as well as very masculine women and have been there when they have recieved tuts and stares. Not that much of a leap.

I've also been the recipient of harassment and abuse when the girls at school found out I was bisexual and believed I was 'staring' at them changing. I'd never want anyone to feel the way i did. Regarding me as a threat despite the fact i was just trying to live my life.

It's also true that TW and TM have been using the bathroom they're most comfortable with for yonks. My actually-genuinely-middle aged family friend is a TW and as a condition of getting a GRC, had to 'live as a woman'. That includes using appropriate bathrooms.

How about we just leave people the hell alone when they're trying to pee? If they stare, make comments, etc then find the appropriate security or phone the police. Harassment has always been illegal and that won't change.

No, Caster Semenya is intersex, a rare but natural condition: a person born with “a reproductive or sexual anatomy that doesn't seem to fit the typical definitions of female or male.”

A man born without a penis is not a woman. Women are not faulty men.

Point taken - intersex does still lean to one side or the other. But in Caster's case she had it all played out on a world stage under the most glaring of publicity while she was a teenager, very different to men today deciding to self ID as women for what sometimes appear frivolous reasons.

I wish her, and anyone like her, well.

My actually-genuinely-middle aged family friend is a TW and as a condition of getting a GRC, had to 'live as a woman'. That includes using appropriate bathrooms.

This is a ridiculously sexist approach taken by the medical professionals involved in "gender". The act of "transition" is walking though the door of opposite sex facilities. A man becomes a woman by stepping over that threshold. It's silly and outrageous.

The man is not "living as a woman", he's living as a man that has no respect for women's boundaries.

how did your male friend live like a woman? Which woman did he live like? Or did he just adopt regressive sexist stereotypes?

Ladybrrd transmen using the bathroom has been discussed many times on here.
They can use the bathroom of their choosing as using the male facilities will cause no threat or
harm to the men in there given that female to male assaults are small in number and as females they can use female facilities. If they choose female facilities while presenting as men then they should expect to be challenged.

It's a joke Discovereads, based on one of op's previous disingenuous posts.

@Ladybrrrd They should use the bathroom that matches their biological sex. It's really that simple.

It's not okay, and I find it sad/funny/predicatible that people on here by won't believe it.

It's because the video is so staged and sounds like a TRA monologue, and the details don't match up. That's why some of us don't believe it. It's not that we don't believe a butch-looking woman may receive stares or be challenged, but this video does not add up. At all.

And enough with the "It's also true that TW and TM have been using the bathroom they're most comfortable with for yonks." myth. That's simply not true for most of them until recently. And yes, 99.99999949999% of the time we can tell. And, nor is the "It's also true that TW and TM have been using the bathroom they're most comfortable with for yonks." trope an excuse or justification. It doesn't make it right.

as a condition of getting a GRC, had to 'live as a woman'. That includes using appropriate bathrooms.

No, it doesn't. There is no stipulation that in order to get a GRC, they HAVE to use the bathroom they identify with. None at all. That's a lie. They can choose to, but it is not a 'stipulation' or an enforceable order.

How about we just leave people the hell alone when they're trying to pee?

How about we stop minimising this as being just about 'wanting to pee? How about we stop supporting removing safeguards for women and pretending men are women and women should have no basic human rights to their safe spaces? How about we stop being handmaidens and shitting all over the graves of our foresister feminists who fought SO HARD for these spaces and safeguardings? How about that?

Harassment has always been illegal and that won't change.

As the police fail to act on the vast number of reports of harassment/stalking/voyeurism etc female single SEX spaces are more important than ever, not less so.

Transmen are generally teeny tiny with ‘transmen’ voices (the genetic code for male heigh is on the male chromosome) so photos don’t really show the whole picture.

Besides, GC people are totally cool
with additional third spaces for people who don’t want to use their sex spaces for whatever reason.

how did your male friend live like a woman? Which woman did he live like? Or did he just adopt regressive sexist stereotypes?

I don't disagree that there are a number of stereotypes involved, though the main thing for her was that her body causing her distress. In order to get approved for surgery and recognition of herself as who she is, she did have to conform to them.

Now that she's had surgery and been living as a woman for many years, its difficult to tell. Though anyone harassing her for peeing would get short shrift from me!

Anyway could someone tell me which bathroom the chaps I posted above should use?

Caster Semenya is a man who was born with 'ambiguous genitalia' due to a DSD. But in actual fact they knew that CS was male in the village where she lived and she was bought up as a boy. There are pictures of CS at secondary school wearing the boys uniform (in a country and a time where girls could not have done so).

Unfortunately CS was a victim of some very dodgy practices at the time to find males with DSDs and put them into female athletics as their male puberty advantages meant huge success and big money for the scouts and coaches that had found them, as well as the very poor villages that benefitted from their success. See also India with a disproportionate amount of now known to be DSD males in women's events. You can see the temptation as a route out of poverty and I don't judge athletes from this background as much as I judge, say, Lia Thomas. And no excuse now the facts are known (hence the genetic tests).

Anyway could someone tell me which bathroom the chaps I posted above should use?

I did.

I did

So you'd be okay walking in to the bathroom and finding those two? You wouldn't feel uncomfortable?

So reinforcing the negative, sexist stereotypes and disregarding womens boundaries. How is that living as a woman.
as I have stated before, buck angel, a very famous transman will use the mens or third spaces as he knows he is maybe going to cause distress to women. So why can TW not show the sane courtesy? Why is validating their delusions more important than mitigating any distress they cause? Why not encourage your friend to use third spaces or the mens as women have stated they want their spaces to be single sex? What gives you the right to disregard those womens boundaries?

Yes.

Nope. Because if single sex bathrooms were reinforced, I could have confidence they were female and therefore not a threat.

That's silly. If men weren't potentially in women's spaces things like this are much less likely to happen.

It's the trans activists who get tied up in how men and women should look. People should be allowed to present and dress exactly as they want. I fully support a very broad spectrum of appearance and lifestyles. There can be "butch" women and "effeminate" men and we could all happily co exist in spaces designed for our sex. It seems that we are going backwards and not forwards with our acceptance of difference. Gender stereotypes rule and that's a retrograde move.

There are always going to be cases where people get it wrong and this video seems to fit into that category. It proves nothing.

Yes

But i thought that the sight of a male person caused lots of women distress. Isn't that the whole point? So I'm a little confused how you are okay with a person who looks like a man in a women's bathroom...?

Meh, you lot are very confusing. Im off for brunch.

The fact Semenya is male was confirmed when Semenya was a teenager.

Semenya then spent 10 years competing against women despite knowing themselves to be male and took medals, prize money and sponsorship from women.

I wish no wellness at all to Semenya, I wish only sympathy to those women who were robbed of opportunities because of Semenya’s self interest.

So you'd be okay walking in to the bathroom and finding those two? You wouldn't feel uncomfortable

I would probably question them, politely I may add if it wasn't obvious to me that they are transmen.
Why don't you understand it is not females in the female toilets that is the issue. It is males in the female toilets.

Posters like Ladybrrrd really think they've got the ultimate 'gotcha' by posting those pics, it's very very pitiful.

I would probably question them, politely I may add if it wasn't obvious to me that they are transmen.

There's no way to politely question someone who's minding their business in a toilet, so let's put that to bed.

But transmen aren’t male? So that’s the first flaw in your argument.

Do you know any transmen in real life?

Loads of us have female kids who identify as transmen. They aren’t scary.

How about we just leave people the hell alone when they're trying to pee?

If it’s really just about trans women peeing and nothing else, what’s stopping them just using the men’s toilets?

Do you routinely ask men to ‘leave people the hell alone’ whilst trying to pee instead of insisting they need to be placed with women?