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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Rosie Jones is no longer a lesbian

183 replies

RosalindsAFuckingNightmare · 21/10/2022 21:35

Anyone watching Friday Night Live? She’s just announced she is “gay”. Is this a deliberate move away from lesbians who are increasingly being targeted for being gc?

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Helleofabore · 22/10/2022 14:54

I thought Jordan's thing was a parody

I thought that Jordan’s stuff is all about parody. That Jordan’s stuff in the past was about them being male and yes, parodying the narcissism.

RufusthefIoraImissingreindeer · 22/10/2022 15:05

Smilelesstalkmore · 22/10/2022 12:51

So you will come on here, call people bigots with absolutely nothing to back it up, and then 'bow out' when challenged.

Got it.

Name calling is always out of order

Justme56 · 22/10/2022 15:09

Is Jordan something to do with Educate and Celebrate who work in schools?

Melroses · 22/10/2022 15:11

Justme56 · 22/10/2022 15:09

Is Jordan something to do with Educate and Celebrate who work in schools?

Yes, a patron, alongside Tatchell.

TheBiologyStupid · 22/10/2022 15:24

Glinner has posted about the show now: grahamlinehan.substack.com/p/channel-4-you-cant-make-fun-of-women

FrancescaContini · 22/10/2022 15:34

eleanorwish · 21/10/2022 22:58

There's nothing says 'I'm a woman' like playing the piano with your cock

Quite

Siddalee · 22/10/2022 15:47

This Facebook comment gives me hope that people do get it.
I’ve blanked out the commentators name as he might not realise just how contentious what he’s saying might be seen to be. I’d hate to expose him to a pile on by highlighting his name on here.

Rosie Jones is no longer a lesbian
RainbowZebraWarrior · 22/10/2022 17:36

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

cesspoolclowncar · 22/10/2022 17:47

MaChienEstUnDick · 22/10/2022 14:53

It's a Tale of Two Cocks, innit? Jordan Gray was nominated for an Edinburgh Comedy award at the fringe (the old Perrier award); Jerry Sadowitz got cancelled...

One said the magic T word. Everyone is bound by Stonewall Law to cheer and clap.

Perhaps Jerry would have fared better had he put on a frock.

SpidersAreShitheads · 22/10/2022 20:58

Randomcommentary · 22/10/2022 10:18

billy connelly danced naked on stage for comic relief some years ago. I only recall ‘Mary whitehouse’ types getting offending.

This was no different, apart from the fact that Jordan is trans.

@Randomcommentary - it's a fair point, but I'd counter with the question: when did Billy Connolly get his cock out? I think you're referring to when he streaked naked? If so, that was in 2001 - more than two decades ago. The world has changed so much since then - and certainly comedy has! - that 2001 may as well have been another century. What was acceptable back then is often met with outrage now. Countless examples of this if you want me to list them.

A more recent example is Jerry Sadowitz - who I'm not especially a fan of either - who was roundly criticised for getting his cock out at one of his shows. Granted, there were other issues with his content which people took offence to, but the appearance of his cock was one of the major issues. It was reported and mentioned widely, with nothing but absolute disgust for the appearance of the penis. Not on TV, at his stand-up show - people buying tickets to see him would have known what to expect. Less so watching a Channel 4 comedy show with a collection of different (and potentially unknown) performers.

Believe it or not, I don't get offended by nudity. I'm incredibly relaxed about it and I also have a vulgar sense of humour. What fucks me off is disparity and underlying viciousness and I think both of those are relevant here.

I don't think Jordan Gray is any different from any other bloke who gets their cock out. Which a fair proportion like to do on a regular basis. Yet if Jordan Gray does it, we're all supposed to clap in admiration....because why? It's just another bloke getting his dick out. The fact that it's a bloke who is trans identifying shouldn't make it different.

And if getting a penis out is hilarious and just high japes - where's the line? John Barrowman has been utterly slated everywhere for getting his nob out to raise a few laughs in filming.

Either it's OK and anyone can whack their genitals out if they think it's funny - regardless of how others will receive it and whether it's appropriate - or it's not. It's the different standards which aren't acceptable.

And as to the content of his song - I admit to being prickly over something that in the past I might have found funny. The reason being is that I think there's real intent in what Jordan was singing about. I can laugh at myself and I can laugh at jokes about women - providing there's no genuine misogyny underlying the humour. Same for jokes about my race/religion/sexual persuasion. All totally fine to joke about providing there's no underlying meaning. It's why comedians like Roy Chubby Brown and Jim Davidson aren't funny - because they absolutely meant every word they said. There has been many, many instances of trans women on Twitter insisting that they're better than biological women. They're not allies, they genuinely see themselves as modern women and biological women as somehow inferior. Where have I heard that before? Oh yeah, that would be men believing that women are inferior to them. Here we fucking go again. It's the same shit, just dressed up. And that's why I don't find the song "I'm better than you" particularly funny because I suspect Jordan actually believes that.

I really really fucking wish we could be on the same page as trans women because believe it or not, I'm left wing and would love to be inclusive. I desperately want to be supportive and I don't give a toss how someone wants to dress and live their life. But claiming to be actual women, taking our protected spaces and eroding our voices while doing nothing to be an actual ally of women is just all such bullshit. I'm friends with a few TW online who are incredible allies, and I am so appreciative of their voices. Sadly the TRA brigade drown them out - and also ostracise them.

RainbowZebraWarrior · 22/10/2022 21:05

It used to be known as Flashing. It's still legally termed as Indecent Exposure. It certainly would be if it was in the street, or at a football match.

Live4weekend · 22/10/2022 21:26

TRAs got really really upset with Ricky Gervais a few months ago when be basically repeated things that have been said by TW / TRAs.

Now they think Jordan Gray is wonderful when what he has done (in my opinion is so much worse)

I don't actually find Gervais that funny. 20 years ago I may have found Gray funny. But that was before the TWAW shit and before people with a Penis were invading our boundaries in such a visible and aggressive way.

MaydinEssex · 22/10/2022 21:42

What does THAW and GC stand for?

TheBiologyStupid · 22/10/2022 21:55

TWAW= Transwomen are women
GC= Gender critical

You might need to start here if this is all new: www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/3145470-Break-it-down-for-me

Ereshkigalangcleg · 22/10/2022 22:06

TRAs got really really upset with Ricky Gervais a few months ago when be basically repeated things that have been said by TW / TRAs

I got 12 hours in Twitter jail for repeating it!

stillvicarinatutu · 22/10/2022 22:06

Rubidium · 21/10/2022 22:58

Jordan Gray, transwoman, gets her tits and knob out on Channel 4 and all is stunning and brave.

Jerry Sadowitz (allegedly) gets his knob out in a small theatre in Edinburgh in front of a paying audience (who are probably well aware of the likelihood of Sadowitz’s knob making an appearance) and he gets the rest of his shows cancelled.

🤔

This . !

stillvicarinatutu · 22/10/2022 22:11

I love Ricky gervais . He just comes out and says what everyone else is thinking and he doesn't give a shit !

Incidentally- if a man is getting his cock out to play piano with - doesn't that just prove he is a man and he has a penis ?

Bloke in a dress ?
Didn't see it . Don't want to after this .

puffyisgood · 22/10/2022 22:23

I thought the song was possibly funny if you accepted it as tongue in cheek, and the flashing almost certainly was funny, coming out of the blue as it did. But, I mean, the risk of stating the blindingly obvious, the sum total of the routine really made it very, very clear that the performer was a man. The entire shtick was a purely male conceit, as, even, was the sorry little 'shtick' he started waving round at the end.

QueenHippolyta · 22/10/2022 22:24

Please explain to this clueless lesbian why men enjoy getting their cock out; what's the point? I really don't get it.

ReunitedThorns · 22/10/2022 22:52

@SpidersAreShitheads Well if John Barrowman was straight he would never be in work again, yet instead we get him with his sudden full-on Scottish accent (I know he was born there but) on Lorraine Kelly saying how badly his mental health had been affected and she was just seduced by the accent.

With Barrowman, it wasn't sexual, it was an act of bullying, to tell the crew that he could even wip his penis out on stage and not be sacked.

ReunitedThorns · 22/10/2022 22:57

I watched the clip, wasn't offended, but disappointed at the outrage that he has sought. Tomorrow the Mail on Sunday will be all over it and he'll get lots of publicity. It's just too easy.

He just seems rather amateurish, a forgettable act in a gay bar, not worthy of TV. But in the age of box ticking comedy he'll quickly be on Mock the Week, Live at the Apollo et al and enjoy all the rave reviews, not because he's any good, but because of the virtue signalling.

As always there's no such thing as bad publicity.

Rainbowshit · 23/10/2022 00:26

It's just dull though isn't it? Male gets his cock out coz he thinks it's funny. 🥱

Helleofabore · 23/10/2022 07:25

Someone did a transcript of the song.

twitter.com/lisamacrichards/status/1583831471433093120?s=46&t=7vecyS69FHk9eJoFwSMDWQ

inigomontoyahwillcox · 23/10/2022 07:40

I think (hope) that the amount of times the phrase "her penis" is currently being published will peak plenty of people, or at least get them actually thinking about the blind repetition of TWAW.

SpidersAreShitheads · 23/10/2022 08:41

ReunitedThorns · 22/10/2022 22:52

@SpidersAreShitheads Well if John Barrowman was straight he would never be in work again, yet instead we get him with his sudden full-on Scottish accent (I know he was born there but) on Lorraine Kelly saying how badly his mental health had been affected and she was just seduced by the accent.

With Barrowman, it wasn't sexual, it was an act of bullying, to tell the crew that he could even wip his penis out on stage and not be sacked.

But that's exactly my point - John Barrowman whacks out his willy and it's seen as bad and an act of bullying, cue much public whipping. Jordan Gray gets their dick out on TV in front of an audience who weren't expecting it, and hadn't bought tickets for a shock artist they knew often flashed their nob around - and everyone is applauding. There's just no consistency. Either men can wave their dicks around when they fancy and it's no big deal - or they can't. It's can't be OK for some and not for others. Twitter users were insisting that it didn't matter whether the audience wanted to see Jordan's nob or not - Jordan wanted to get it out and apparently that's Jordan's right to do so. But it wasn't John Barrowman's right to do so?!

The sight of a naked dick isn't likely to get me offended, but the disparity really fucks me off. Men claiming to be women certainly do still like to get their cocks out on a regular basis. I don't know any women who have such a fondness for flashing their vag.