Eddy Izzard uses ladies loo in Sheffield.

[Xoxoxoxoxoxox]

Jean Hatchett article on Eddy Izzard attending a Labour Sheffield fundraiser, uses women's toilets, run up to his election as a candidate, uses women's toilets while there.

thecritic.co.uk/eddie-izzard-uses-the-ladies-loo-in-sheffield/

@LifeIsaRollerCoaster1 They'd have to have 4, men women, disabled and anyone else that isnt any of the above. This should go for toilet facilities, changing rooms and sports categories. It's the only way forward.

I don't want men in women's spaces, taking women's trophies or anything else. You can wear a dress and put makeup on if it makes you feel pretty I don't care, but I don't want a man in a dress in women's only spaces or taking a woman's place whether its Eddie Izzard or anyone else.

I agree. And thank you for reading my post properly and responding in a reasonable manner.

Exactly this.

And I'm angry. I loved Izzard for defying gender roles and expectations. Now it turns out that wearing dresses and makeup really does make you a woman.

Fuck you, Eddie. You were shit as Long John Silver too. An iconic role that will never go to an actual woman unless it's deliberately so avant garde that it misses the point of the story anyway.

I did read your post thanks.

My point in response is that this is not our problem to solve. Worrying about them being 'open to being abused, humiliated and exploited by the 'macho' men they will encounter' is again not women's problem. We also have to deal with that stuff, which is why we have women's spaces in the first place.

These are the photos that you are referencing btw.

For the photographer to be a pervert it would have to be one hell of a niche fetish.
Perhaps you can explain to us how these images indicate perversion?

A person must surely have a very specific mindset to look at these and imagine some sort of sexual motivation?
I realise that there are men that get kicks from some very banal things (popping balloons, doing the vacuuming, knitting in public etc) but I just can’t see how anyone would be getting off on taking these particular images?

Please do enlighten us?

I have no idea why he couldn't just use the men's - unless it's about making a point...

Exactly the same as happened when drag queen Kitty appeared on Masterchef this year. EVERY guest complimented her top, makeup, etc. NONE complimented the women. WTF???

All I was saying is I'm reading a lot of anger or outrage on the subject but no-one suggesting what the solution might be so I suggested a possible solution.

Lots of people have suggested the same solution, many times and it is aggressively rejected. No one is jumping down your throat but you have presented your point as if it's novel and women having been having the same discussion for years, it always boils down to what are we going to do to solve it. The answer is nothing, not my problem. If TW think they are in danger in men's loos (there is little evidence to support the claim but plenty of evidence that letting males access women's spaces on the basis of "self ID" puts us in danger) then I will campaign with them for third spaces, if they're not happy with that then they can sort it out themselves.

I dont agree with your position at all but the response you got was typical unfortunately in this section, Ive mentioned it before that there is often aggression and hostility if you dare feel that there should be some accommodation for these men. Its sad you felt you had to preface your post with 'before you jump down my throat'.

Personally I have mixed views. Its for individuals to present how they want but there really are only 2 sets of toilets needed, male and female because thats all there are. All need to be disabled accessible so there isnt a need for another space as it were.
Male violence needs addressing in society so thats where the focus should be rather than allowing male violence to infiltrate my toilet space!

BUT, what is the answer here?

Males use the male facilities, females use the female facilities.

What sort of problem does Eddie expect to have using the male facilities, exactly?

It would get him less press attention, for starters...

Why the anger?

Just to get an obvious thing out of the way - yes, we know that most sexual and other violent attacks against women happen in the home/with someone she knows. However, that doesn't mean we don't carry on doing what we can to make other places safe.

Next obvious point: Not All Men Are Like That (NAMALT). We know this too. However, a significant number of men and boys are like that. Almost all convicted sexual offenders are male. Most violent crime is committed by males. These are patterns of behaviour that are far less common from women and girls. That's why one basic safeguarding measure is to segregate the sexes so that women, girls and young children have safe spaces and services.

In the very recent past, it was understood and accepted by just about everybody that no men went into the Ladies' Toilets or changing rooms. Little boys could go in there with a female relative. Now any male can go in there and nobody will challenge him. This is a green light for predators. Why wouldn't they take advantage of it? In the past, predatory men have worked for years to qualify in various professions and then risked losing it all by abusing vulnerable people their jobs brought them into contact with. These vile beasts are dishonest to the core and supreme manipulators. Of course they're going to go into the Women's toilets!

And finally: locking a flimsy cubicle door is no protection at all from the pests that use their phones to film.

Bully for you. You don't speak for me and my rights are not your rights to give away.

Eddie Izzard is a transvestite, not transgender.

May have been mentioned elsewhere, but surely making the men's amenities mixed sex, whilst keeping the women's single sex would be the most inclusive?

More TMs pass than TWs, so they could use the mixed sex without worry. All those women who "don't mind sharing toilets/changing rooms" could use the mixed sex area, so that they can ensure that TWs will feel validated when they use it too. This would then leave the single sex women's, providing a safe haven for any female that needs it, be it for religious or any other reason.

As an added bonus EI, Pip Bunce and any other gender fluid types, would be able to use the mixed facility regardless of their gender "mode". They could even flip genders mid-wee, and would be safe in the knowledge that it wouldn't cause discomfort to anyone else.

Might even help keep the queues down in the women's too, win/win n all that.

I don't expect that Eddie Izzard is a sex offender, or has any kind of criminal tendencies. I still don't want him in the women's toilets. They are women's toilets for a reason, after all, which is privacy as well as safety. Not to mention cleanliness and men's habit of pissing all over the seat.

It’s odd you think your ‘feminism’ is nothing more that pearl clutching. The rest of us actually want to make the world better for women.

Using ‘girl’ as an insult is misogynistic. But you already know that.

Is no one else scared about the pervert taking photos of people using public loos?

For those who don't know the venue (and why would you?) the photos are taken right from the middle of the main room, which is presumably where people were sitting to view the stage. Eddie - and everyone else going in and out of the door - would have been in full view of the audience. No sneaking about or perving necessary.

@Farmageddon

did read your post thanks.

My point in response is that this is not our problem to solve. Worrying about them being 'open to being abused, humiliated and exploited by the 'macho' men they will encounter' is again not women's problem. We also have to deal with that stuff, which is why we have women's spaces in the first place.

Again, did I say it was our problem to solve? I was asking people's opinions on what they think the solution would be, not asking all women to go out and implement it, did I? Tell me where I said that?

It's call a conversation, a fair and open exchange of opinions and views. Lower your anger levels and try take part in a reasonable conversation or butt out

This is one piece of logic I’ve never understood.

if transwomen aren’t comfortable using the male toilets because of male violence why should women allow males into their toilets?

if transwomen want to use female toilets because it validates their self identity, who decided this was more important that women want?

@bellac11 I dont agree with your position at all but the response you got was typical unfortunatel

I was agreeing with everyone's views but simply asked what people thought the alternative, in an ideal world, would be? What's to disagree with?

The solution is obvious - mixed sex and women (female only )toilets. Transmen, transwomen and other men can all use the facilities with the urinals and some cubicles, we can have the siongle sex spaces we have a right to (and deserve).

Well the extra toilet thing if I read your post correctly, theres only two sexes, so only two needed.

And that somehow as others have said the implication that we have to amend or compromise to make men safe which makes us unsafe

I have had a huge turnaround from years ago on this matter. I was very strongly that you can be born in a different body and I havent quite made my mind up on it yet although I dont feel as 'certain' as I did about that. I also thought that its ok to share toilets and unisex them, but the more Ive read the more it worries me and the arguments dont stack up.

A friend from a few years back was connected to him via her partner and they socialised a bit. She disliked him, saying just the same thing as you.

@FOJN I wasn't presenting it as a novel idea in the grand scheme of the longstanding situation. I was referring specifically to this thread, I was reading nowhere what people thought the solution was. I was simply trying to join in the conversation.
I think you'll find that people are jumping down my throat. People are just not capable of having an adult, mutually respectful conversation on MN.