Carly-May Kavanagh

[NitroNine]

There are rumours circulating on Twitter that Carly-May Kavanagh (the one who screams at babies: Daily Mail) has, despite her “apology” been suspended from the Labour Party. Presumably such a suspension would have an impact on her job as Lloyd Russell-Moyle‘s head of policy?

Apparently if she is suspended it [probably] won’t be made public. Given the reason for her [potential] suspension; if Labour actually do take action, you’d think they’d want to reassure people that they expect their members to uphold certain standards. I mean, “not screaming abuse at infants” is less upholding a standard than it is failing to trip over pebbles of basic decency…

Clearly one cannot put too much weight into Random Person Says Unevidenced Thing. However, it would be a foolish rumour to start without cause, so I thought it was worth starting a thread here to see if there are developments to follow.

Should Kavanagh face consequences for her behaviour it will be a watershed moment: Labour acknowledging women have rights all their own, including the rights to assemble & to speak on issues of concern to them, such as their need for single sex provisions.

Should Kavanagh face consequences for her behaviour it will be a watershed moment: Labour acknowledging women have rights all their own, including the rights to assemble & to speak on issues of concern to them, such as their need for single sex provisions.

If Kavanagh faces consequences for her behaviour it will be an acknowledgement that Kavanagh's behaviour was deranged and appalling.

Am I right in thinking Lloyd Russell-Moyle is a nasty piece of work too? Is he the one who said he wouldn't support a constituent who voted Tory.

Am I right in thinking Lloyd Russell-Moyle is a nasty piece of work too? Is he the one who said he wouldn't support a constituent who voted Tory.

He also accused JKR of using her sexual assault in bad faith to discriminate against people.

JKR was much classier than I would have been when he was forced to apologise
www.theguardian.com/books/2020/jun/28/labour-mp-lloyd-russell-moyle-apologises-to-jk-rowling-for-sexual-assault-remark

He quit the Labour front bench afterwards citing a campaign by the right wing media that left his position untenable because of the amount of harassment that his staff was getting as a result of his remarks
news.sky.com/story/lloyd-russell-moyle-quits-labour-front-bench-after-jk-rowling-abuse-comments-12030180

He also said that schools should teach kids how to asphyxiwank safely.

He also said that schools should teach kids how to asphyxiwank safely.

how in the fuck is he still an MP? That’s horrific even by current standards.

As a Brighton resident I can't help feeling sorry for CMK. There was always going to be a social media video of an angry TRA after that event and she just happened to be the sacrificial lamb.

She's now lost her job. She will get zero support, sympathy or thanks from the TRA community. She will have truly believed she was dealing with a group of fascists at the weekend so she must now be feeling very lonely and confused.

Those who know my history will know I used to be a trans activist myself so I can empathise with her anger and frustration. From her point of view it will have felt on a par with the BNP holding a rally in central Brighton. She will only have heard or read that the SFW group are fascist Nazis. She won't have been exposed to the other side's views.

She will have seen the event as deliberately provocative and lets admit it, Posie Parker doesn't shy away from provocation.

A video of an idiotic TRA yelling at a baby and calling it a fascist is exactly the outcome PP would have hoped for and Carly May Kavanagh has played right into her hands.

She's a complete idiot but I hope she's okay.

She won't have been exposed to the other side's views

They seem pretty widely available to me! How did you end up changing your own views, SapphosRock (I don’t know your history).

You’re a much kinder and more generous person than I am. Obviously I hope Carly May is ok too, but a woman in her position working in politics must have enough intelligence and education to know about research and fact checking.
If I was going to a counter protest I would find out the position of those I was counter protesting against by reading their statements/arguments/social media/claims… and come up with points to refute them. Any TRA trying to dispute GC points would get stuck pretty quick. Although maybe that’s why Carly May just shouted at a baby and called people standing for women’s rights fascists

I think it's a bit of a stretch to call CMK a sacrificial lamb, @SapphosRock . She presumably went to the event of her own volition and has never even bothered to consider what we, her opposition, are saying.

No. She behaved appalingly and thank god the LP has a shred of decency left and is dealing with her. So far she's only suspended from the party, she may be allowed back. I hope not, but then I'd boot her boss out too. And quite a few others.

It was Russell Lloyd Moyle who stood up in that committee and talked of the death (by erotic autoasphyxiation) of a 15 year old family member to justify his belief in schools teaching how to choke yourself 'safely'. There is no way to do that safely.

Brighton appears to be off its rocker.

From her point of view it will have felt on a par with the BNP holding a rally in central Brighton. She will only have heard or read that the SFW group are fascist Nazis. She won't have been exposed to the other side's views.

But she has only heard one side because she has chosen to only hear one side. This isn't Russia or North Korea. Nothing has prevented her from reading or hearing what the other side's views are. It's only her own determination to remain in her own side's bigoted bubble which has left her ignorant.

There were a number of reasons, one of them being I came across too many 'lesbians' that had the paraphilia we're not allowed to mention.

There was always going to be a social media video of an angry TRA after that event and she just happened to be the sacrificial lamb.

You are far more generous than me, Sapphos. She, in my view, isn't someone who just happened to scream at a baby. She has agency, she made her own decision to behave the way she did.
She also has form, this isn't a one off.

Someone that intrenched in a single position who refuses to listen to other views has no place in politics.

That said, I also hope she is OK and has some support.

If she’d been yelling and waving a placard at the ‘opposition’ and doing stuff that people do when emotions are high and you feel strongly enough then fair enough …she would undoubtedly have been ignored

she didnt do that…what she did do had obviously dreadful optics and what on earth made her think that was in any way, shape or form the right thing to do

im not sure im correct at this part but didn’t she also swap places to hurl abuse from ‘the other side’ ?

(if im wrong I’ll apologise but it will be along the mealy mouthed shit apology she gave…and again, the right thing to do was apologise for her actions to her mates if she wanted to AND unreservedly to the family. That apology might have made a, albeit slight, difference)

in the absence of any doubt even if a baby had the misfortune to be born to fully fledged BNP members…you shouldn’t be abusive and aggressive around it

The baby won't remember. The internet will.

This will haunt her for a while and she's made herself unemployable.

Yes she brought it on herself but I still feel sorry for her.

Yes she brought it on herself but I still feel sorry for her

and that’s obviously very lovely of you 💐

I think her being sacked won’t change her views…it will entrench them even further

Last post then I’ll finish my coffee

i feel sorry for everyone…honestly…its pathetic

my inability to hold an unsympathetic thought can be seen on here at times and the phrase ‘to be fair’ is never very far from my lips

for some reason today, for her…i have nothing

maybe tomorrow

Oh my actual god

obviously im not pleased…im just not sad

Oh Rufus, let's hope that coffee warms your cold, dead heart

I don't think she deserves anything more than embarrassment. It was only stupid shouting.

It would be a travesty if she was the only one who ended up facing consequences, rather than those actually throwing stuff or worse. Shouting at fascist babies is ridiculous, but not dangerous. I hope the men arrested are dealt with properly.

Probs not

its only a dolche gusto coffee and that never comes out very hot

it will have felt on a par with the BNP holding a rally in central Brighton.

I’ve often wondered over the years if TRAs genuinely think that women’s rights campaigners are on par with fascists. In reality I think it’s just another way to attempt to smear them and to prevent well meaning liberal types from actually listening to what women are saying. If someone is successfully labelled fascist or alt right or far right people will often dismiss them without even listening to them.

CMK was not scared of this man and his baby. She would not have been shouting at a BNP member with her face that close to theirs without risking a head butt. I think she knew full well that that man and his child pose no actual risk to her or anyone else in Brighton. The same cannot be said of the BNP.

Those who know my history will know I used to be a trans activist myself so I can empathise with her anger and frustration.

Do you still have TRA friends, @SapphosRock

If so, what do they think?

I do worry that she will further entrench herself. I do also have some sympathy as it always hard to admit you have very publicly, and on an international stage, made such an massive error in judgment and had a lapse in behaviour. That is also why so many of those protestors cover their faces and wear their hoodies.

Underneath, they know they far too aggressive. What they are doing is not ‘peaceful’ protesting. Unless the meaning of ‘peaceful’ has also been changed. Simply making noise, yelling into a space but not directly at people, wave banners, not name calling etc, sure do that. But that is not what is happening.

However, in saying that. This person is in a role setting or recommending policy. Let us not lose sight of the role this person has/had or who they works/worked for. (Have they been terminated from the role? Has it been confirmed?)

'@SapphosRock

I don't have that much sympathy. I think its pretty basic to actually research what the 'other side' are saying before having strong opinions on a subject, let alone go along to a protest, let alone personally get in people's faces and verbally abuse them.

I remember being in a group where people were similarly defending a white woman who was in that famous photo of a group of white Americans screaming abuse at black children going to a formerly white only school. The group were arguing that she was just doing what everyone thought then and can't be responsible for her protest actions (which was how the white women had recently defended herself too). But that's not true is it? It was controversial even then. There was another side she could have listened to.

And today there's even less excuse, now we have the internet. Carly May could have just spent an hour or two on Fair Play for Women, or Woman's Place UK, or read Kathleen Stock. She may have not agreed with what we say, but she would have seen that its certainly not a fascist view.

And perhaps she could have looked around her and seen that on her side were men in black and masks screaming abuse at women, throwing things at women, and asked herself, ' Are WE the bad guys?'

It would be a travesty if she was the only one who ended up facing consequences, rather than those actually throwing stuff or worse. Shouting at fascist babies is ridiculous, but not dangerous. I hope the men arrested are dealt with properly.

It's often the way, isn't it. I've seen this happen a lot, where men get away with worse behaviour but a woman (who has done something undoubtedly bad) is the one who is punished more.

I don't think that the fact she has 'allegedly' been suspended from the LP means that the LP has changed it's views on women's rights.

I think it's the behaviour that is untenable. Shouting in the face of a man and a baby. In a public role it is important that you do not bring the reputation of the organisation you work for into disrepute and I expect that's the allegation she faces.

I kind of feel sorry for her but I agree with others that this won't change her views, it will entrench them. She's not interested in hearing the other side she's absolutely certain that she is right.