Antipodean fruit grower statement

[nothingcomestonothing]

The antipodean fruit growers site is down. A statement from the owner reads in part:

What I fear more than losing my site, being sued, or dealing with police is living in a world where [redacted by me as would be against MN talk guidelines] while normal people are not allowed to even discuss it.

The mob has already planned subsequent targets. Should we stay down, they will then attack 'gender critical' communities - especially those ran by and for women. No place can exist online which criticizes [redacted], and nothing would excite them more than this power and domination struggle being inflicted on a female space instead.

Posted for info.

DH just sent me this link: www.theguardian.com/technology/2022/sep/07/techscape-kiwi-farms-cloudflare

No surprise at all to see many of the claims already debunked on here and elsewhere getting warmed over and re-served for consumption.

There is a big (9 year old) thread on Segal on r/games (can’t link because MN doesn’t like us to link to competitor chat sites, which is fair enough). Thread seems to be fairly intact…

www.destructoid.com/indie-developer-asking-for-donations-for-surgery-update/

Thank you NecessaryScene your post was really helpful. I hope Null was being rightly optimistic rather than sarcastic 🙂

That Null is a little rascal. How he does what he does is a complete mystery to me. Though I have learned a lot about opsec and internet stuffs by watching his streams. He is really fun to listen to.

Appalling taste in music though! Haha

Theres no proof near is dead

You lot supported that vile pit

Did we?

Apparently the new thing is lots of dumb trans people on Twitter who (wrongly) think KF is down talking about how awful it was and lying about how even they had a thread there, despite just being a poor innocent trans person. They're cataloguing a few of those claims on the general trans thread, but it's getting a bit boring. Sorry guys, you weren't and still aren't that interesting...

But it's yet another piece of victimisation they can claim. Part of the point of wanting KF down is to be able to lie about how you were persecuted by them even more easily.

How predictable. I suppose everyone believes them.

Too early for say Saville, but had the farmers been around then the dots would have been joined up much faster.

This is 100% true.

Interesting account from a 19 year old on Ovarit who was targeted on the site:

ovarit.com/o/Women/152994/take-two-my-thoughts-on-the-kiwi-farms-fiasco-technically-my-first-post-but-was

So now instead of just KF, they have the slightly more harder to access KF and the telegrams taking about it all and keffals has gone from being an obscure Minot footnote on the site to the whole of the internet knowing what keffals has done and what their proliclivities are. Is this whole dropkiwifarms thing some sort of reverse psychology marketing stunt 😚

That's really not the point. Sure, there are nice hippies on the left.

But some people talk about the left as if censorship is somehow really alien to it, and if you follow the thread back, that was the kind of post I was responding too.

All of the most serious Marxists movements have one way or another involved censorship, not as a sort of random mistake, but seen as an important and fully justifiable element of the revolution. When you have a movement that sees itself as ushering in a kind of Utopia, and history progressing in that direction in a kind of natural unfolding, it's very easy to justify that. And that is the Marxist understanding of history.

I thinks its the royal ‘you lot’

bit like the royal ‘we’ that forced teamers use

One of the main alternative to Reddit sites, where you could have 'said it,' has been down since last night. Don't know if it's a coincidence or related.

When you have a movement that sees itself as ushering in a kind of Utopia, and history progressing in that direction in a kind of natural unfolding, it's very easy to justify that. And that is the Marxist understanding of history.

And back again to righteousness, self justification fallacy, etc. Yep.

And while most people who see themselves as socialists today in a place like the UK aren't marxists, that is the view of history that has been embraced, in a very naive way, by political progressives.

Which is interesting in that most don't really believe in the marxist view of the historical dialectic leading to a particular end of history. But they do have this sense that we are progressing towards something and you need to be on the right side of history.

Combine that with a society where people under 40 increasingly are rejecting the concept of liberal democracy and don't see things like intellectual freedom as politically normative, and you have a very dangerous situation very prone to political authoritarianism.

www.pinknews.co.uk/2022/09/07/kiwi-farms-harassed-nine-year-old/

KF have allegedly doxxed a 9 year old trans child and falsely accused the child's mother of being a "groomer" and "paedophile".

I get the impression KF seem to think they are the "good guys", and any time they harass, stalk or dox someone they provide what they think is "justification". This includes making unfounded accusations.

IMO this just makes it more disturbing. They won't acknowledge what they have been doing is wrong, they keep telling themselves they are "doing good".

If someone really did have evidence or reasonable suspicion that someone was a groomer or pedo wouldn't the best thing to do be to make a report to the police or child protection services? I don't understand why anyone thinks going online and doxxing a mother and 9 year old child is a good idea.

"This reportedly included targeting US mother Debi Jackson and her trans child when they were just nine-years-old.

Posting on Twitter, trans activist Jackson explained: “My [nine-year-old] trans child was so proud and confident that they ended up on the cover of National Geographic Magazine. It was the ‘gender revolution!’ But within days, we were doxxed on Kiwi Farms.”

“The kind and gentle folks who call themselves Kiwi Farmers decided that I was a groomer paedophile and that Avery would only be ‘safe’ if they exposed our full names, addresses, cell phone numbers, places of work, etc. ‘to protect the children’ dontchaknow,” Jackson continued."

Seems relevant:

'a striking post-pandemic shift to authoritarianism among youth'

twitter.com/ProfAliceS/status/1567500778285277184?s=20&t=OgtLR3UAdKxHygTUSZg3SQ

Pointing at:

'The Kids Aren’t Alright: the 4 factors driving a dangerous detachment from democracy
Why young people are detaching from democracy and social norms – and what to do about it'

www.ukonward.com/reports/the-kids-arent-alright-democracy/

Kiwi Famers talk about the insane parents who declare their primary school age children as trans, not the children themselves, Marg.

pop over to the site and have a look. The threads you want are the one on Mermaids, the one on parents trans children (mostly American) and the one on Wendy, the mother of ‘Desmond is Amazing’

This includes making unfounded accusations. IMO this just makes it more disturbing. They won't acknowledge what they have been doing is wrong, they keep telling themselves they are "doing good".

tbh this sounds a lot like Pink News.

IMO this just makes it more disturbing. They won't acknowledge what they have been doing is wrong, they keep telling themselves they are "doing good".

You should read the Glenn Greenwald thread @NecessaryScene linked below. Particularly the clip of Sam Harris talking to @triggerpod. This belief that ends justify means are not limited to people you don't agree with.

Roll up, roll up for the downfall of Keffals.

This is not a good or trustworthy person. Pots and kettles, amirite?

Kiwi Famers talk about the insane parents who declare their primary school age children as trans, not the children themselves, Marg.

I'm up for people discussing gender issues, but doxxing/threats/harassment isn't ok. Just yesterday we all came to an agreement here that noone should be subject to any of this.

"pop over to the site and have a look."

I'm aware KF is back up, however it now appears barely functional. I've tried to have a look over the past couple of days but it either seems down completely or you need to refresh a page multiple times and then maybe it will slowly load.

This would be a sad existence for KF and seems to be as good as being taken down completely. I imagine lot of their userbase will quickly tire of this and leave.

There is no harrasment, nor threats, Marge, as you well know.

i can’t help you with making your tech work better (I believe this is a you problem, seeing as I had to explain to you how to find the site!)

I haven’t seen the doxing of a child on the farms and I don’t believe Josh would condone such a thing. As @Fizzynonsense has pointed out, Josh was very sympathetic re: removing information regarding Fizzy’s daughter.

your fibs are getting quite dull now. Please fact check yourself better moving forwards

'Fact check yourself before you wreck yourself', as Ice Cube says. I think.