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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Edinburgh Fringe comic spat on and shunned by colleagues as a 'transphobe' for show about women

518 replies

JanieAllen · 17/08/2022 13:33

www.scottishdailyexpress.co.uk/news/politics/edinburgh-fringe-comic-spat-shunned-27762754

OP posts:
Thread gallery
18
PeriodBro · 25/08/2022 09:14

I never would have imagined that there would be a culture war where the battlelines were supposedly attending comedy shows and not laughing.

No wonder satire is dead.

ScreamingMeMe · 25/08/2022 09:17

Just another porn-soaked...person.

Artichokeleaves · 25/08/2022 09:21

PeriodBro · 25/08/2022 09:14

I never would have imagined that there would be a culture war where the battlelines were supposedly attending comedy shows and not laughing.

No wonder satire is dead.

I'm not willing to agree it's a 'war' of any sort. You cannot have even a basic reasonable discussion with unarmed opponents. This is just sort of a lot of people standing with their mouths open watching an unholy mess spilling everywhere.

I'm afraid my drawn conclusion at this point is to never buy tickets for a stage show by a TQ+ performer, because if you enter the room with them and become part of their drama who knows what they'll perceive and accuse you of. Which will then be released to the press and probably the police.

#lifeisjusttooshortforallthis

Helleofabore · 25/08/2022 09:21

ScreamingMeMe · 25/08/2022 09:04

Edinburgh Fringe 'hate crime' row as show from trans comic accused of 'bombing'

After audience members failed to laugh during a show called Peak Trans, supporters claimed it had become the victim of a 'hate crime'

www.google.com/amp/s/www.scottishdailyexpress.co.uk/news/scottish-news/edinburgh-fringe-hate-crime-row-27824825.amp

Ouch.

It will be hard to hide from that article.

LaughingPriest · 25/08/2022 09:33

Is "hate crime row" the new term for "front row"? (That's how I was reading "row" Grin )

Ereshkigalangcleg · 25/08/2022 10:31

Half the audience laughed and half didn’t laugh, and all of them were arrested for it.

Grin
FunnyTalks · 25/08/2022 10:39

Spitting at someone is "social justice" and not laughing at a comedian is a "transphobic hate crime". Riiiight

IcakethereforeIam · 25/08/2022 10:47

@ScreamingMeMe I'd forgotten that photo, ick!

Jen should have attended some of the LGBA talks and stayed away from their cake.

Ereshkigalangcleg · 25/08/2022 10:51

Is this what you think is "transphobic", Dadjoke? And women are adult human females, it's just reality, it isn't a "schtick".

A quote below from Elaine Miller's article, here provided with distaste by a man who has no idea about the female experience, like so many of the men who want to put us in our place:

If you don’t recognise yourself as a “cervix haver” you are unlikely to attend your smear test. Cervix is an uncommon word describing a hidden body part so unless “woman” is used to invite women to screening those with learning disabilities, dyslexia, English as a second language or lower education attainment are excluded. Some of them might then die of cervical cancer. I don’t think that is ok.

A recent international paper examined cases where gendered language caused harm or confusion, and it makes for grim reading. It is hard to understand why adding barriers to healthcare for those already marginalised is championed as inclusion.

I was so cross about all this that my birth injury became my muse. My episiotomy scar is a zig zag shape and I read somewhere that lightning bolt scars can be powerful…so, if need be, I will gather crowd of women, march to Holyrood and whip out our scarred pudendas and bellies, prolapses and piles, mastitis infested breasts and our fierce capacity to love and demonstrate that we earned the word “mother” and we won’t give it up without debate.

Witch” is a word which once had so much power it made 4000 women disappear. Conversely, the least powerful word at any time, in any language, is a woman’s “no”.
If women’s consistent, insistent and persistent “no” upsets you, I gently suggest that you focus your efforts on improving the behaviour of males so that women require fewer protections rather than bullying women and calling it activism.

Wise words, Elaine. Thank you.

Sazzasez · 25/08/2022 11:02

People caping for Ives for “diversity” should note there are quite a lot of trans performers at the Fringe this year, and some of them seem to be quite funny.

Jordan Gray seems quite amusing & hasn’t needed to get his mates to buy tickets for others.

viques · 25/08/2022 11:57

FunnyTalks · 25/08/2022 10:39

Spitting at someone is "social justice" and not laughing at a comedian is a "transphobic hate crime". Riiiight

Who knew that folding your arms and not laughing was such a powerful weapon.

As a tactic it is going to revolutionise:

international relationships -“ The Ukrainian troops have put down their weapons and folded their arms, it appears the Russian troops are confused and embarassed by this defiantly aggressive move. And yes, it appears that the order has been given, the Russian tanks are reversing and leaving” .

political debate - “ In response to the virulent opposition attack on the Chancellors proposal to further cut income tax for the wealthiest 5% of the country the government front row folded their arms and curled their lips”

family rows - “ Not taking out the recycling and emptying the dishwasher is not funny Araminta, and as you can see by our body language both your father and I are deeply disappointed in your failure to comply with our very reasonable expectations.”

EmbarrassingHadrosaurus · 25/08/2022 12:27

Spitting at someone is "social justice" and not laughing at a comedian is a "transphobic hate crime". Riiiight

Who knew that the male adage that women have no sense of humour would eventually see calls to criminalise us for this offence.

It's certainly a Catch 22 take on, "Women are afraid men will kill them. Men are afraid women will laugh at them". Either way lies the possibility of assault and/or criminalisation.

GertrudeKerfuffle · 25/08/2022 12:59

Well done for persisting @WanOvaryKenobi

I do wonder if the management at the Gilded Balloon are shitting themselves at the idea of trying to fire that employee. No doubt it would bring down a whole load of grief for them from TRAs and a possible employment tribunal - which you would think would be without merit, but it would cause them a lot of headaches, not to mention threats and so on.

I don't think it was a good idea for anyone to be stickering Jen Ives's posters. It seems rather a personal attack rather than an ideological stance in that context and it's better to rise above, in my opinion. Let her comedy routine speak for itself. Let her dig her own hole deeper.

WanOvaryKenobi · 25/08/2022 13:15

Ricky Gervais is liking Tweets that mention the story.

twitter.com/Scottish_Fella/status/1562755904164233218

Shall we ask him what he thinks?

GertrudeKerfuffle · 25/08/2022 14:55

Ereshkigalangcleg · 25/08/2022 10:51

Is this what you think is "transphobic", Dadjoke? And women are adult human females, it's just reality, it isn't a "schtick".

A quote below from Elaine Miller's article, here provided with distaste by a man who has no idea about the female experience, like so many of the men who want to put us in our place:

If you don’t recognise yourself as a “cervix haver” you are unlikely to attend your smear test. Cervix is an uncommon word describing a hidden body part so unless “woman” is used to invite women to screening those with learning disabilities, dyslexia, English as a second language or lower education attainment are excluded. Some of them might then die of cervical cancer. I don’t think that is ok.

A recent international paper examined cases where gendered language caused harm or confusion, and it makes for grim reading. It is hard to understand why adding barriers to healthcare for those already marginalised is championed as inclusion.

I was so cross about all this that my birth injury became my muse. My episiotomy scar is a zig zag shape and I read somewhere that lightning bolt scars can be powerful…so, if need be, I will gather crowd of women, march to Holyrood and whip out our scarred pudendas and bellies, prolapses and piles, mastitis infested breasts and our fierce capacity to love and demonstrate that we earned the word “mother” and we won’t give it up without debate.

Witch” is a word which once had so much power it made 4000 women disappear. Conversely, the least powerful word at any time, in any language, is a woman’s “no”.
If women’s consistent, insistent and persistent “no” upsets you, I gently suggest that you focus your efforts on improving the behaviour of males so that women require fewer protections rather than bullying women and calling it activism.

Wise words, Elaine. Thank you.

Yes, this.

The use of the word 'schtick' is telling. Dadjoke doesn't think women have valid opinions.

Artichokeleaves · 25/08/2022 15:29

doesn't think women have valid opinions.

In fact this is the theme of conflict across almost every thread on this board.

Male people and male focused/prioritising supporters who don't believe women have valid opinions about anything - specifically their spaces, their sexuality, their language, their bodies, their children, and that women should just do what they're told by males for males

and females who think this belongs in the realm of togas, pyramid construction and the very early days of Keith Richards, and do not plan to co operate or serve.

At the heart of the sex/gender/TQ+ politics 'discussion' is a bloody great chunk of plain old misogyny. It's never really about the T, because it's never about the female T people. It's always about XY people and their belief in inborn superiority and entitlement over XX people.

GertrudeKerfuffle · 25/08/2022 21:28

Plus ça change @Artichokeleaves

Ereshkigalangcleg · 25/08/2022 22:19

I think a lot of people thought that from the beginning.

Sazzasez · 26/08/2022 00:13

Meanwhile a trans comedian is up for a Fringe comedy award. Jordan Gray. Theres a clip online & it’s not bad. People were laughing.

How odd that the evil transphobic master plot to pay £12 per seat to not laugh only targeted the unfunny trans comedians!

TheLassWiADelicateAir · 26/08/2022 00:49

Sazzasez · 26/08/2022 00:13

Meanwhile a trans comedian is up for a Fringe comedy award. Jordan Gray. Theres a clip online & it’s not bad. People were laughing.

How odd that the evil transphobic master plot to pay £12 per seat to not laugh only targeted the unfunny trans comedians!

Jordan Gray has 6 short videos on YouTube. I laughed out loud several times.

LK1972 · 26/08/2022 01:09

@TheLassWiADelicateAir Thanks, Jordan's quite funny!

IcakethereforeIam · 26/08/2022 01:19

Didn't make me laugh but very engaging. Thanks for the link.

Datun · 26/08/2022 09:13

DadJoke · 24/08/2022 02:30

No one has a problem with shows about vulvas and vaginas - the headline is wrong.

The issue is that she is gender critical / transphobic.

I notice you’ve kept quiet about Jen Ives, also at Edinburgh who received transphobic abuse, and bunch of transphobes booked out the front row and sat in silence with their arms crossed.

I know this nonsense has already been addressed, but also, it's simply not true. Of course the Issue is about vulvas and vaginas.

Transactivists can't actually eliminate vulvas and vaginas, but they absolutely try and eliminate the fact that they only belong to women.

So when a woman who is not only gloriously pro-women, but is uniquely placed to talk about female anatomy, dares to go public, she has to be stopped.

Because Elaine isn't just talking about female biology. She is unequivocally and determinedly connecting it to the only people who have it, women.

All the talk of pelvic floor exercises, menopause symptoms, both familiar and taboo, would be like a foreign language to most men. Something that is and always will be beyond their experience. Because, of course, it is not at all the sort of slant on female anatomy that has them glued to the screen on porn hub

It highlights the fact that women's biology is simply not something that can be detached from women, in order that the word woman can mean something else.

And it must really rankle that she's bloody funny too. All this esoteric stuff about women's unique biology, that's also making them laugh out loud?

Unforgivable.

TheClogLady · 26/08/2022 10:09

The visual gag of Jordan scanning phallic vegetables is great!