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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Harry miller arrested

464 replies

chilling19 · 28/07/2022 22:16

twitter.com/i/broadcasts/1jMJgemEeybKL

OP posts:
IcakethereforeIam · 29/07/2022 20:26

@JemimaPuddlegoose I thought I recognised your name from other threads. I'm sorry you're upset and feel attacked but I am honestly confused about the allegations you make in your 20.01pm post. I don't remember reading anything like that. Did you have the posts taken down or were they on other threads?

VestofAbsurdity · 29/07/2022 20:42

As a matter of interest @JemimaPuddlegoose did you find the picture of the flags on regent Street reminiscent of anything? The Pride Swastika post was originally a response to that image and the underlyingTRA authoritarian behaviour and tactics, I can see why it was done, can you not?

Secondly, you made a serious allegation against Helen Joyce and despite being asked to substantiate it have not done so and several posters have provided evidence from her book that contradicts what you allege.

MangyInseam · 29/07/2022 20:53

No one screamed anything about your being Jewish. They objected to your total fabrication of the contents of a book.

Helleofabore · 29/07/2022 21:05

Maybe we can get some links to posts on FWR that that were overtly homophobic (claiming that teenagers can't be gay and that people are only gay if they've been groomed into it) too?

I don’t recognize these types of posts being made by regular FWR posters. Maybe they are made by visitors to the board?? Is that what you meant?

Terfydactyl · 29/07/2022 21:27

antelopevalley · 29/07/2022 15:20

I assume he was getting in the way of the police officers doing their job.

Oh the fucking irony.

Thelnebriati · 29/07/2022 21:54

This is possibly the most bonkers thread I've ever read on Mumsnet.

achillestoes · 29/07/2022 21:58

@JemimaPuddlegoose

I’m sorry you feel this way. I know you’ve posted here a long time. I have to say this honestly, though: the current model of looking at everything through the lens of identity is dangerous. I can’t see a single example of anyone here caring that you are Jewish. Honestly. But you appear to think it’s the most relevant thing. Why?

EmbarrassingHadrosaurus · 29/07/2022 21:59

Thelnebriati · 29/07/2022 21:54

This is possibly the most bonkers thread I've ever read on Mumsnet.

It's Friday so I shall allow myself to indulge in a challenge to that claim.

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/3386868-AIBU-to-be-livid-how-dolphins-are-portrayed-compared-to-how-they-are

Cailleach1 · 29/07/2022 22:06

I think the charges against Man A (chappie who was arrested at his house for re-posting the meme) have been dropped. Makes you think what those women who were living with the stress of charges for months on end. Women who were so bold as to call out an ideology that proclaims men to be women if they so wish. And, the prolonged stress visited on Marion Millar; who had the temerity to fasten a ribbon in public.

LordLoveADuck · 29/07/2022 22:14

NotBadConsidering · 29/07/2022 07:35

Dark day for Mumsnet?🤣🤣

You can’t simultaneously dismiss a (false) claim of hyperbole - that TRAs are being considered genocidal - and at the same time decide hyperbolically that such a (false) thing is a “dark day” for an entire site of millions of views.

The Pride Swastika flag is not to say TRAs are genocidal like Nazis (although plenty of them accused Helen Joyce of exactly that 🤨) it’s to say TRAs are authoritarian like Nazis. To which they responded by getting the police to go round and arrest someone they didn’t like 🤔.

If you’re going to object to the satirical flag at least be accurate.

"If you’re going to object to the satirical flag at least be accurate"

Bang on however those who have sacred cows are incapable of exposing their beliefs to satire. I am reminded of Ayatollah Khomeini's statement that "there is no humour in Islam". In his mind and the minds of other true believers, Islam can brook no irreverence whatsoever; an attitude on display on this thread though here regarding a different theology.

IcakethereforeIam · 29/07/2022 22:18

The lights are going off all over Mumsnet!

NotBadConsidering · 29/07/2022 22:21

EmmaH2022 · 29/07/2022 14:24

Mangy "I would say there is a cross-over between people who don't get satire and people who think your skin colour should determine your political views."

tough one. I find it's often the people who are most academic and who would say they love satire, who have me labelled by skin colour.

This is identifying but I have been wanting to tell the FWR board for a while so....

I had a bizarre conversation with a 20 something about Trigger's broom. I thought she was trolling me. It took a while to establish that she wasn't.

To sum up, She believes what Trigger believes about the broom, amd now sees figurative as literal. Yes, she is at uni.

Trigger’s Broom is a version of the thought experiment the Ship of Theseus.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ship_of_Theseus

To be fair to the 20 something, her position is a philosophical position that has been argued since 500BC.

That's why, to me, it’s the greatest joke in television of all time. It takes a concept of 2500 years of philosophical debate, applies it to a Peckham road sweeper, has a laugh at his expense, but maybe he’s smarter than all of them?🤣

LordLoveADuck · 29/07/2022 22:44

DarkDayForPearlClutchingVipers · 29/07/2022 11:29

I find serried ranks of any flag disturbing, frankly.

Even if a flag starts as a joyful celebratory flourish, which the rainbow flag certainly did way back when, the uniformity and repetitive pattern soon looks authoritarian and intimidating.

Never thought about that but I agree about there being something authoritarian about this type of flag, namely everyone assigned an identity and everything ordered and static.

DarkDayForPearlClutchingVipers · 29/07/2022 22:48

Re Ship of Theseus - I know it as 'my grandfather's axe'

EmbarrassingHadrosaurus · 29/07/2022 22:57

DarkDayForPearlClutchingVipers · 29/07/2022 22:48

Re Ship of Theseus - I know it as 'my grandfather's axe'

I've still got grandfather's spade.
Father replaced the handle and
I replaced the blade.

I wonder how many variations there are and if they differ by region.

VestofAbsurdity · 29/07/2022 23:00

Trigger’s Broom is a version of the thought experiment the Ship of Theseus.

It's amazing what you can learn on MN FWR S&G of an evening - this is not just education this is MN FWR S&G educationGrin

DarkDayForPearlClutchingVipers · 29/07/2022 23:02

'In pop music, all three founding members of girl-group Sugababes were replaced one-by-one during the first decade of the 21st century, raising the question: was the result still the Sugababes?'

Indeed, surely 'Round Round' is a nod to Nietzsche's theory of eternal return?

IcakethereforeIam · 29/07/2022 23:04

I think there's a car, called 'old no.1' and actual vehicle, not a thought experiment that's believed to have undergone this process. Very little, if anything of the original car left. Aren't there some rock bands that have done the same thing?

MangyInseam · 29/07/2022 23:12

EmbarrassingHadrosaurus · 29/07/2022 21:59

She's not wrong though.

MangyInseam · 29/07/2022 23:16

IcakethereforeIam · 29/07/2022 23:04

I think there's a car, called 'old no.1' and actual vehicle, not a thought experiment that's believed to have undergone this process. Very little, if anything of the original car left. Aren't there some rock bands that have done the same thing?

Lots of ships are like that too. There is a famous ship near where I live, almost none of it is actually the same ship any more.

It's similar with our housing regs. In some places you can't do new build, but you can renovate an old place. The rule is you need to retain one corner post for it to still be "the same" house.

DarkDayForPearlClutchingVipers · 29/07/2022 23:18

Dolphins are indeed bastards. Nevermind their cheeky grins.

LordLoveADuck · 29/07/2022 23:31

DarkDayForPearlClutchingVipers · 29/07/2022 11:55

I loved the Helen Joyce book so much until the part where she started ranting that Jewish billionaires are behind the trans agenda.

Which part of the book was this, please?

This has been debunked. WomenAreHuman covered this smear campaign. Here's a tweet the article quotes that sums up the issue

"Thinking about the accusations of antisemitism against Helen Joyce. She mentions two Jewish billionaires. She doesn't accuse them of shadowy machinations or obvious tropes. Doesn't mention their ethnicity.

If that's antisemitic, is it at all possible to criticise George Soros?"

www.womenarehuman.com/trans-activists-smear-author-of-trans-when-ideology-meets-reality/

antelopevalley · 29/07/2022 23:45

LordLoveADuck · 29/07/2022 23:31

This has been debunked. WomenAreHuman covered this smear campaign. Here's a tweet the article quotes that sums up the issue

"Thinking about the accusations of antisemitism against Helen Joyce. She mentions two Jewish billionaires. She doesn't accuse them of shadowy machinations or obvious tropes. Doesn't mention their ethnicity.

If that's antisemitic, is it at all possible to criticise George Soros?"

www.womenarehuman.com/trans-activists-smear-author-of-trans-when-ideology-meets-reality/

According to Joyce, ‘a few wealthy people’ (p 227), apparently ‘rich, white American males’ (p 228) have ‘shaped the global (trans) agenda’ (p 227). She then goes on to name three rich Jewish people.

LordLoveADuck · 29/07/2022 23:45

@DarkDayforMN thanks for the book recommendation.I look forward to reading it

LordLoveADuck · 29/07/2022 23:48

EmbarrassingHadrosaurus · 29/07/2022 13:58

When Genevieve Gluck was discussing her investigations with Glinner, she had some interesting speculations as to why there is a concerted effort to disdain and attack the viewpoint of lesbians and feminists. Gluck argues that previous attempts (1970s to 1990s) to normalise various paraphilia and to remove the age of consent by forced teaming these campaigns with gay rights etc. were successfully halted by actions from women, feminists, and particularly lesbians who spoke up about their concerns, especially around safeguarding.

There seems to be a recrudescence of concerted action to normalise these ambitions again. Gluck comments on the strategy of the pre-emptive attack on feminists and lesbian by ostracising them and "slandering them as TERFs from the start:" I should think that Feminazis and similar slurs would be part of that strategy.

It's certainly been very successful in scaring a fair number of people away from even looking into what is happening.

wrt to the Denton playbook (see below), lobbying groups have been very careful to work in the shadows which allowed them to succeed with the #NoDebate strategy for a long time. Denton also gifted these groups the time to capture enough organisations and governmental bodies to give an authoritarian weight to the deprecation of concerns and the continuing refusal to engage in discussion.

3 part deep dive into Denton:

Part 1 grahamlinehan.substack.com/p/the-dentons-document

Part 2 grahamlinehan.substack.com/p/the-dentons-document-78d

Part 3 grahamlinehan.substack.com/p/the-dentons-document-part-3

Mumsnet discussions here:

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3756354-RollOnFriday-law-firm-writes-report-called-Only-adults-Good-practices-in-legal-gender-recognition-for-youth?pg=1

Discussion on Dentons

www.rollonfriday.com/news-content/dentons-campaigns-kids-switch-gender-without-parental-approval

James Kirkup in The Spectator

www.google.com/amp/s/www.spectator.co.uk/article/the-document-that-reveals-the-remarkable-tactics-of-trans-lobbyists/amp

Much thanks EH for posting those links