gender woo and voting

[dropthevipers]

Is party stance on gender woo a deal breaker for you? I am/have been a center left type my whole life, would never previously have even considered voting tory-but I cannot vote for parties that spout manifest bollocks. How about you? Or you friends?

@antifascist

People know what sex they are. They can act like grown ups and use the correct facilities, surely?

What's it feel like to be part of a movement where the members freely admit they can't tell what sex they are?

Exhausting I imagine.

It's just trolling in order to derail the actual conversation and to deter quiet readers. Postern like that hope that people who are wondering will just accept their reassurances that there is nothing to see, or that people will give up talking about things like authoritarianism on the left. If you look over all the posts made, you can see them really trying hard to steer away from that, or criticisms of id politics.

They are desperate to make it look like one issue unconnected to anything else and then present that issue as foolish. They don't want anyone to look any closer.

I would have thought the presence or absence of a guard on a train was far more pressing to more people than who sits in what cubicle.

These posts seem increasingly disingenuous to me, TooBig.

We all know that there are some people among the Conservatives who believe this. We all know that, like 95% of people, the Conservatives were late to wake up to this.

We can also all see that right now the Conservative party has largely woken up, and although they do allow their MPs some room on the issue, they are actually doing things. While the Labour Party are not saying the right things, are doubling down, make things difficult for dissenting MPs, and seem to still have every intention of going forward with further institutionalizing gender woo if they were to be elected.

You have posted again and again about the former facts, and not once have you addressed the latter when someone points it out. It's starting to look like an attempt to distract.

Just to alert anyone who may not have seen it, there is another thread about writing to your conservative MP, if you have one, or another body if you have not, about Penny Mordaunt lying about the Maternity Bill. If you don’t know in what way she was lying, as I didn’t before, the details are linked in the thread.

Antifascist, you have been on this board long enough to have seen the range of discussions. You must surely know that our concerns range from toilet provision, to rape counselling, to women's refuges, to women's sport, to women's prisons, to women's health provision, to crime statistics and crime reporting, to our ability to talk about ourselves and organise ourselves, and that's not even touching on our concerns for children.

It is totally incomprehensible to me that you haven't noticed any of those threads so I can only guess - and I imagine lurkers will be doing the same - that there are other reasons for presenting our concerns as 'toilet obsessions'.

May I suggest people just don’t respond to any invalid ‘baits’. These really are not the same as differering views, or questions, or objections based on the actual topic being discussed?

In the end it can seem easier just to leave the thread otherwise.

Eh? How did you make that leap?

These posts seem increasingly disingenuous to me, Too Big.

I think my posts are crystal clear @MangyInseam. What is disingenuous about them?

At the moment, Labour is irrelevant to me. They are in opposition and will be for 2(?) years. KS may not be around. God knows what state the country will be by then, or if a Labour party will even exist.

I am focusing on the threats we are under right now, from the Conservative government.

If someone cares about not getting self ID I’m really not sure who they would vote for.

Maybe if they’re banking on Starmer going and a complete clear out before the next election of many on the left who think the same - it seems unlikely though

I’m interested though as you have to vote for someone or not vote at all.

Who would that be to someone who cares about not getting self ID? (and despises Cons)

Starmer is staying now. His position was weaker before Johnson went but now he’s managed to bring down a PM his stock has risen. We need the next Tory leader to be gender critical or we can say goodbye to state recognition of the correct legal status of ‘human female’.

Yes I think you’re right Achilles he had detractors before including further to the left but now he can bat them off pretty easily

He won’t go so I guess those who don’t want Cons or self ID will have a tough choice soon-ish

I'll check the manifestos at the time, go hoking about, check my circumstances and I will definitely vote.😃 Who? I couldn't possibly know that yet.🤷‍♀️

It seems an important question though, posters have even asked me to tell them who to vote for, which is really disconcerting.🤯 Who are you planning to vote for at the next GE @MarshaBradyo?

I’m not asking for that reason, odd reaction

You seem equally annoyed with Self ID and Cons so wondered who you will vote for as not many left

I’ll see at the time but not Labour

Gender Critical feminists are responsible for sacking guards on trains?

I knew TRAs were getting desperate now we've shown all their arguments are false, but this really is the most bizarre claim yet. I expect we'll see signs at the next trans pride (they're usually only a few weeks apart) with "TERFS KILL GUARDS" on them. And possibly a new addition to the ever-more-crowded Pride flag, maybe a railway track across the middle.

I didn't mean you asked me to tell you who to vote for @MarshaBradyo. I am asking why that question is important to you. Sorry for any mix up.

Hang on, I've just thought: antifascist doesn't seem to bright - maybe they misread 'trains' for 'trans' and think we're all here defending our rights agains Trains Rights Activists.

Don't worry antifascist, I'm right behind you: Trains Right Are Human Rights.

aaarrrgghhh

*too

I'm in NI, all our parties hate the Tories.🤣🤣🤣

close, but still a way to go to match the outright idiocy lately when the ruling on women only elite swimming led to some fuckwit claiming this would result in an increase in Trans people drowning. as if.

how else are you going to decide whether someone is cis or trans?

Well most people are neither "cis" nor trans, but it's pretty easy to tell whether someone is male or female. If it weren't, the human species would have gone extinct long ago.

Alternatively, if you are a lovely, harmless trans woman who happens to be one of the vanishingly tiny number of trans people who "passes" as a member of the opposite sex, but you know you are biologically male, why would you try to enter a space for people who are biologically female?

What has the presence or absence of a guard got to do with trans people?

And train toilets are unisex anyway.

You've competely lost me here.

If you support the Conservative party you’re supporting getting rid of guards,

(and putting millions of women into extreme poverty) ,