Page 21 | How is it "gender critical" to impose rigid binary social categories based on sex?

CuriousPanda · 2021-07-13T20:07:04+00:00

For most of history, the whole point of feminism was to ^oppse^ sex-based segregation and restrictions that were imposed by patriarchal society. So I don't see how supporting strict gender categories, and simply calling them "sex-based" instead, in any way leans itself to "gender abolition". One might get impression that "gender" is simply being used to mean trans people existing, and "gender abolition" simply means restricting trans people from being able to transition and use different gender labels. And basically nothing else. With "sex-based rules and restrictions" being basically just gender roles but trans-proofed.

merrymouse · 14/07/2021 22:15

The deciding factor is being a bigot against a minority group, not your sex or gender.

This is going to blow your mind: majorities can be oppressed. Minorities are often oppressors.

Wildgarlicpesto · 14/07/2021 22:17

MNers are the polite ones here. With our twee court cases.

Exactly.
Try Kiwi Farms @CuriousPanda

There's lots of posters there for you to not respect.

NiceGerbil · 14/07/2021 22:17

OP

You don't understand that a man who grabs women by the pussy is naturally going to go with woman = female?

And on this basis anyone else who thinks sex matters is just like him on everything?

He wants to get what he expected when he grabs a pussy. He likes to think himself an 'alpha' male. He is very hierarchical in his thinking. Women are lesser and for sexually assaulting. Any male who wants to identify as a woman is lesser as well.

You say that women with concerns are keen on enforced sex role stereotypes.

Do you also go into sites for men like trump- misogynists, or certain (many) religious groups and tell them off as well?

I'm guessing that you don't but that may be unfair. If you have, which groups? And wear reaction did you get?

ChewtonRoad · 14/07/2021 22:17

Humans can change their biological sex.
No we can't. There's no genetic driver for humans to change sex (as a woke acquaintance claims) as binary reproduction works just fine in humans: one woman (female) and one man (male).

Slightly OT, but acknowledgement is due for a level of unhinged batshittery that the OP has maintained throughout this thread. The determination to get just about everything wrong is quite remarkable.

RedDogsBeg · 14/07/2021 22:18

The only side Trump is on is Trumps.

Having no respect for women and trying to remove their rights in favour of and to curry favour with men is misogynistic to the very core, sexist and inherently dangerous to women and girls and I have nothing but loathing for anyone, whatever their sex, who does that.

midgemagneto · 14/07/2021 22:18

No we don't see trans women
As perverts

We just see then as men

Doyoumind · 14/07/2021 22:19

Just because right wingers don't back trans rights doesn't make them the same as rad fems. Their reasons are not the same. This was pointed out to you on another thread. You know it's a shit argument that doesn't cut it. It makes you sound completely clueless.

Wildgarlicpesto · 14/07/2021 22:20

You both just see trans women as degenerate perverts to keep out of women's spaces

This is a sweeping generalisation which is against the moderation rules. You could be deleted for that. You have got away with quite a lot of sweeping generalised here.

TalkingtoLangClegintheDark · 14/07/2021 22:20

I have to wonder, CuriousPanda, if you recognise the long history and ongoing phenomenon of oppression of female people by male people at all. It seems to me that you are in complete denial of that history, that phenomenon. Denying oppression is the trademark of the oppressor, or the oppressor’s helper. So it seems to me that you’re unequivocally on the side of the oppressors here. A male supremacist, in other words.

So would you like to address this point, Panda? Do you or don’t you recognise the millennia-long, shame filled history of biologically male people as a class oppressing biologically female people as a class, as a specific phenomenon? One that is far from over or resolved?

I would really appreciate a simple yes or no to this.

midgemagneto · 14/07/2021 22:21

Bigot

We are not intolerant to different views

Why should we accept your view rather than you accept ours ?

TalkingtoLangClegintheDark · 14/07/2021 22:21

@Wildgarlicpesto

MNers are the polite ones here. With our twee court cases.

Exactly.
Try Kiwi Farms @CuriousPanda

There's lots of posters there for you to not respect.

AssassinatedBeauty · 14/07/2021 22:21

@CuriousPanda I have no idea what you think you're achieving by throwing around utterly baseless allegations. It just makes you look a bit irrational.

Original poster

CuriousPanda · 14/07/2021 22:21

@merrymouse

You don't get to compare people to Trump for disagreeing with you when your side is literally backed by Trump himself.

Again, you are confused.

Perhaps this diagram can help you.

Trump doesn’t really believe in anything, but he pays lip service to Conservative religious beliefs. However, The religious right believe in narrow gender roles, like you. The only difference is that they don’t believe sex can be changed.

Another thing they share with gender ideologists is the belief that gay people just need to find the right person of the opposite sex.

I do not believe in narrow gender roles? I believe women and men, both cis and trans, ought to be free to live, dress, and identify however they want. And that this does not dictate or invalidate their gender identity.

Whereas plenty of you frequently use "masculine" interests as a gotcha against trans women.

OP posts:

NiceGerbil · 14/07/2021 22:22

Who is Candice?

Why are we talking about America on a UK site (all the bloody time)?

What is your point?

Women, sorry. People with vaginas are individuals. People. We have a very large range of views opinions etc. You know. Same as men do.

How you expect anyone to think oh yes trump and also a random person from fuck knows where said or did that. Shit! I must be evil. I will change my whole worldview, ignore all the facts, and do a total 180. And spend the rest of my life consumed by guilt...

Original poster

CuriousPanda · 14/07/2021 22:22

@Wildgarlicpesto

MNers are the polite ones here. With our twee court cases.

Exactly.
Try Kiwi Farms @CuriousPanda

There's lots of posters there for you to not respect.

You sure to enjoy aligning yourselves with awful people.

OP posts:

Original poster

CuriousPanda · 14/07/2021 22:22

*do

OP posts:

Zeev · 14/07/2021 22:23

Humans can change their biological sex.

In before a trans activist appears and claims "no one says that humans can change their biological sex, that's just a t*rf straw man argument"

Whatabouttery · 14/07/2021 22:23

@CuriousPanda

I believe women and men, both cis and trans, ought to be free to live, dress, and identify however they want

Ok, let's start with I don't want to be identified as c*s

Ereshkigalangcleg · 14/07/2021 22:24

You sure to enjoy aligning yourselves with awful people.

Not sure reading people's posts constitutes "aligning" with them. I mean, you're here, reading ours, aren't you?

Original poster

CuriousPanda · 14/07/2021 22:24

@NiceGerbil

Who is Candice?

Why are we talking about America on a UK site (all the bloody time)?

What is your point?

Women, sorry. People with vaginas are individuals. People. We have a very large range of views opinions etc. You know. Same as men do.

How you expect anyone to think oh yes trump and also a random person from fuck knows where said or did that. Shit! I must be evil. I will change my whole worldview, ignore all the facts, and do a total 180. And spend the rest of my life consumed by guilt...

You're the ones who started tossing around Trump comparisons. It's a pattern with you guys, really marks you as some of the most dishonest people around. You say something ridiculously stupid, I counter it, and then you pretend I started the subject.

OP posts:

dyslek · 14/07/2021 22:24

To quote someone alot wittier than me;

'That post was so incredibly dense that its warped the fabric of space time'

I cant bring myself to believe you are that, well hard of understanding. Surely you are faking, surely.

Wildgarlicpesto · 14/07/2021 22:25

Give it a rest. No-one needs gotchas. Your biology has already done that for you.

Ereshkigalangcleg · 14/07/2021 22:25

both cis and trans

What about the many people who don't identify as either?

TalkingtoLangClegintheDark · 14/07/2021 22:25

@TalkingtoLangClegintheDark

I have to wonder, CuriousPanda, if you recognise the long history and ongoing phenomenon of oppression of female people by male people at all. It seems to me that you are in complete denial of that history, that phenomenon. Denying oppression is the trademark of the oppressor, or the oppressor’s helper. So it seems to me that you’re unequivocally on the side of the oppressors here. A male supremacist, in other words.

So would you like to address this point, Panda? Do you or don’t you recognise the millennia-long, shame filled history of biologically male people as a class oppressing biologically female people as a class, as a specific phenomenon? One that is far from over or resolved?

I would really appreciate a simple yes or no to this.

Would still like an answer to this.

Blibbyblobby · 14/07/2021 22:25

@CuriousPanda

Whereas plenty of you frequently use "masculine" interests as a gotcha against trans women.

I have literally never seen that claimed on the MN feminism boards. Can you please provide a link?