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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Barack Obama heartbroken by wave of anti-trans bills

171 replies

plantanoakhun · 13/06/2021 17:20

www.google.com/amp/s/uk.news.yahoo.com/amphtml/barack-obama-heartbroken-wave-anti-153244006.html

Thoughts?

OP posts:
NecessaryScene · 13/06/2021 18:37

The GC position is that biological differences exist between the sexes and should not be ignored.

Quite. Sports classification is not an abstract philosophical issue of "identity". It's a practical matter of safety and fairness, and, yes, inclusion.

Sometimes inclusion is not possible - if someone decides to take testosterone, then they cannot be included in competitive sport due to the unfairness. They could still participate in non-competitive sport, obviously.

(And I don't think doped transmen versus men is acceptable either, sadly. Sure, they will never get to top level, but they're still potentially taking places at lower levels away from people who aren't doping. Including other women if it's an open event. And if it's not open, then permitting only some females to compete seems unfair - discrimination on grounds of gender identity).

NecessaryScene · 13/06/2021 18:39

The transmen (female) will be competing in women's category. The transwomen (male) will --- also be competing in the women's category. I wonder why that is??????

Because for transwomen to compete with men would invalidate their gender identity and to require that is blatant transphobia.

Whereas for transmen to compete with women...

Okay, I give up.

Hoppinggreen · 13/06/2021 18:41

He’s a man, he doesnt get to tell women who they should allow into our spaces

terryleather · 13/06/2021 18:46

Am I correct in thinking that Obama's election campaigns had big funding from the billionaire usual suspects...if so then this is hardly surprising...

TheFleegleHasLanded · 13/06/2021 18:53

Yeah Barack love, we’re ‘heartbroken’ at the fact that our rights and those of our daughters are being systematically dismantled, so gtf mate.

HermioneWeasley · 13/06/2021 18:54

Women are allowed to have boundaries even, and I can’t stress this enough, even if it does make men sad.

JuliaPomegranate · 13/06/2021 18:55

Obama and gender neutral restrooms –

www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-39047883

Ereshkigalangcleg · 13/06/2021 18:56

Oh well, I'm sure he'll get over it.

Quite!

Ereshkigalangcleg · 13/06/2021 18:57

Am I correct in thinking that Obama's election campaigns had big funding from the billionaire usual suspects...

Yes I'm pretty sure he did and IIRC that was why he sabotaged title 9 sex based rights just before he left office.

Gorse · 13/06/2021 18:57

Read this somewhere,
"JFK put a man on the moon,
Obama put a man in the ladies room".

NiceGerbil · 13/06/2021 19:24

I may be wrong but someone has pointed out it's originally a PN piece.

An NY USA people feel free to correct me!

My understanding is that.

USA do not have the same sort of global equalities laws that we have.

In some/ many (?) states employers can sack you if they find out you're gay/ lesbian, housing can be denied etc etc.

So the fight for equality/ anti discrimination laws for gay and lesbian people is ongoing.

The T has been bundled in with this.

Note that one of the quotes refers to LGBT+ not just T. (As an aside, aren't PN interested in the LGB any more? Given that above?).

They also have a very strong and very vocal and popular right/ religious contingent including in legislation etc who oppose LGBT+++ anyone who doesn't fit the het nuclear family 50s stereotype family set up. Also they oppose abortion, and are constantly working to remove rights etc. There's also the more extreme who are hardly low in number- the racists, the people armed to the teeth, the ones who stormed the white House etc.

So the demarkation is a massive gap not a small line. And there's ? sod all middle ground.

As such it's s totally different context etc.

In a fight like that, it's a bit all it nothing. Even more polarised than here.

I don't doubt that loads of democrats are all for self ID etc as so many politicians and etc of all sides are here.

So I wouldn't expect anything else. It would muddy the waters and lead to infighting and weaken the stance that women gay people etc matter.

If that's wonky I would be keen to hear what's not right- I don't know much about USA and it's huge- but that's my understanding and thoughts.

cheeseismydownfall · 13/06/2021 19:31

@snekkes

So... Verity should play on the men's team?
No, that would place the other men on the team in a very difficult situation.

If Verity is taking testosterone then Verity needs to find a team of other transmen
and compete against other transmen. If Verity finds that no such teams exist, I am sure that Verity would find many women would be allies in helping to establish one.

NiceGerbil · 13/06/2021 19:33

Why does Verity (sorry I skimmed why a name given to girls?) want to play on a female team?

I don't get it.

Andante57 · 13/06/2021 19:38

@toffeebutterpopcorn

He is the ex POTAS - who is going to cancel him from anything! He can say what he likes these days surely?
Wasn’t Trump cancelled from Facebook & Twitter?
toffeebutterpopcorn · 13/06/2021 19:40

That was Trump though... he is a Very Special Case...

QueenStromba · 13/06/2021 19:46

I don't really understand the Obama love - if he was white then he would have been deeply unpopular. He spent his whole two terms at war, ordered countless drone strikes and is one of only two Nobel peace prize winners to bomb another recipient.

NiceGerbil · 13/06/2021 19:48

Really? Most of the presidents seem to love going to war etc. He did the healthcare thing.

In the end it's not love or otherwise and as mainly UK people we're not well placed to get into the ins and outs, most of us. We didn't live day to day under his presidency.

When it comes to the trans rights thing- my view is as above.

terryleather · 13/06/2021 19:49

@Ereshkigalangcleg

Am I correct in thinking that Obama's election campaigns had big funding from the billionaire usual suspects...

Yes I'm pretty sure he did and IIRC that was why he sabotaged title 9 sex based rights just before he left office.

Yes...think you're right there Eresh. He can't go upsetting the paymasters even after all this time out of office.
MissLucyEyelesbarrow · 13/06/2021 19:49

Hmm, Barack, have you noticed that no transmen are winning men's competitions? Have you got any idea why that might be?

QueenStromba · 13/06/2021 20:00

@NiceGerbil

Really? Most of the presidents seem to love going to war etc. He did the healthcare thing.

In the end it's not love or otherwise and as mainly UK people we're not well placed to get into the ins and outs, most of us. We didn't live day to day under his presidency.

When it comes to the trans rights thing- my view is as above.

He's the only US president to have two full terms at war. He ordered ten times as many drone strikes as Bush.

Obamacare was a good idea but poorly executed and has made healthcare ruinously expensive for the middle classes - I know someone paying $40k a year now for insurance.

oranjecallista77 · 13/06/2021 20:00

The Obama's are open minded when it comes to LGBTQ+ matters, they even hired a transgender m2f nanny to care for their two daughters

CrazyNeighbour · 13/06/2021 20:02

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

NiceGerbil · 13/06/2021 20:03

Ok sure but like I say this isn't about his entire presidency which we in the UK are not going to have a full knowledge of.

It's about the report in the link in the OP.

CrazyNeighbour · 13/06/2021 20:03

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

PennineSpring · 13/06/2021 20:12

Apologies for continuing the detail but Verity is now the sport inclusion manager at Mermaids.