Britain's youngest trans child

[poshme]

Article in daily fail (sorry)

4 year old female twin says she is a boy (like her twin brother) and expresses interest in firefighters & police officers & doesn't like pigtails.

So the parents are transitioning their 4 year old and saying they have grown up conversations about gender with them.

Sigh.

Insisting that if you like cars and fire engines you must be a boy does not challenge the patriarchy. It very much enforces it.
Butterfly is a TV show. Not a parenting manuel.

Have you read any of the thread @MishyJDI ?

You seem to have got it all a bit arse over tit.

My niece is a firefighter (came top of her class). Does that make her male?

@MishyJDI

God all of you lot sitting in judgement on these parents and the child, without knowing the situation.

How about let them be parents, and let their child have the freedom to explore. Play with toys they want, dress how they want. Or be a child without such patriarchal boundaries being enforced.

I think its lovely. Children can be children and find their own way over time.

I do love gender diverse people - it is awesome as it messes around with the patriarchy and society structures which are just constructions. That breaks down boundaries moreso than GC conservatism enforcing out dated norms using fear based rhetoric. Bravo!

This is bizarre to me. I say a child is a boy or a girl based on their anatomy, their sex. You seem to be of the opinion that being a boy or a girl is based on their interests and clothing choices? I say harmful stereotypes are assuming someone's likes and interests based on their sex. You seem to think the harmful stereotype is to assume someone's sex based on their anatomy?

I feel embarrassed for people who turn up to criticise what they believe are GC views whilst proving they don't understand what those views are.

Being critical of sex based stereotypes/roles (gendered expectations) is not conservatism. Reinforcing sex based stereotypes/roles (gendered expectations is not progressive.

She is 4. She has all the time in the world to transition if that is what she EVENTUALLY really wants. Very probably this is just a phase. I also didn’t like dresses or cute girly stuff when I was a young child. Still I’m very happy to be a woman as an adult.
It’s utter madness to judge these things at such a young age.

@DickKerrLadies

I feel embarrassed for people who turn up to criticise what they believe are GC views whilst proving they don't understand what those views are.

It’s very common on Twitter too.

Sadly gender stereotypes seem to have become more important than ever, especially amongst teens. I saw a post on Twitter the other day from a pretty popular 'activist' about how they dislike dresses, gossip, and 'caring' roles. Apparently that makes them non-binary. I've also seen posts applauding the first fully non-binary football team at their school. Gone are the days where you can do anything and still be female/male.

“Non-binary football team”.

So it’s just mixed sex then?

I do love gender diverse people - it is awesome as it messes around with the patriarchy and society structures which are just constructions

Gender is the socially constructed bit. Sex is a material reality; a reality which need not define your expression or interests in life.

Irony Literary technique, originally used in Greek tragedy, by which the full significance of a character's words or actions is clear to the audience or reader although unknown to the character.

What you are prescribing is that people must conform to certain gendered expressions or 'preferences' otherwise they must be the opposite sex.

Sex and gender are not synonymous except in the minds of trans allies and activists

I would really be interested if @MishyJDI was able to come back and respond to the posts directed to her.

The only people sitting in judgement of this child are the parents.

Honestly, it's bloody painful explaining this.

@LostToucan

“Non-binary football team”.

So it’s just mixed sex then?

I don't think men are allowed. From what I've seen it seems to be comprised of all women who identify as non-binary or trans. Slight tangent, but Stonewall FC seems to be creating one too so I'm assuming it's the new trendy thing.

www.stonewallfc.com/our-teams

“MishyJDI

God all of you lot sitting in judgement on these parents and the child, without knowing the situation.

How about let them be parents, and let their child have the freedom to explore. Play with toys they want, dress how they want. Or be a child without such patriarchal boundaries being enforced.

I think its lovely. Children can be children and find their own way over time.

I do love gender diverse people - it is awesome as it messes around with the patriarchy and society structures which are just constructions. That breaks down boundaries moreso than GC conservatism enforcing out dated norms using fear based rhetoric. “

They are not being parents - they are being narcissists.

The child has not been given freedom to explore as the baby girl child she was- she was turned into a false boy. She has been given no way to “ find her own way over time”.

All girls and women are already gender diverse in the wider sense of the word. Making this girl baby into a boy is enforcing a gender stereotype. Her parents have even given her a stereotypical media-driven fashionable boy’s haircut.

The father ( the patriarch literally) is the spokesman in all this. He is so patriarchally biased he has made his girl into a boy.

How about let them be parents, and let their child have the freedom to explore. Play with toys they want, dress how they want. Or be a child without such patriarchal boundaries being enforced.

Good fucking grief. This is exactly what they're NOT doing.

H2O Ah, I get it. Bit exclusionary though, I though we were all for inclusiveness these days?

Her parents have even given her a stereotypical media-driven fashionable boy’s haircut.

There's nothing wrong with a girl having a 'boy's haircut', just as there's nothing wrong with a boy having long hair.

What's wrong with this is the parents reinforcing the idea that having a 'boy's haircut' and playing with 'boys' toys' turns a girl into a boy. At the age of 4, this child almost certainly thinks this is true. See this article:
medium.com/@katieja/young-children-reality-sex-and-gender-3421f4f165f1

So, based on the idea that girls have long hair and boys have short hair, James is also age-perfect in thinking that when appearance changes, sex changes too. Until the age of about 7 (yes, 7 — in some children it’s older) children think that when something changes its appearance, its underlying reality changes too. This doesn’t just apply to sex, it applies to pretty much everything.

The parents, being older than 7, should understand that people can't change sex, and shouldn't be teaching their children that they can.

*I think its lovely. Children can be children and find their own way over time.

I do love gender diverse people - it is awesome as it messes around with the patriarchy and society structures which are just constructions*

Those of us who grew up in the 70’s and 80’s all had short hair and wore dungarees. There was a big backlash against the 50’s housewife constraints and mothers who dressed their little girls in delicate dresses and long hair were seen as not moving with the times.

We were all “gender diverse”. Google Marilyn, Culture Club, Adam Ant, even Duran Duran. A man wasn’t a man without eyeliner and a few plaits.

The problem now is we’ve gone back to very rigid gender roles. There is no crossover. So no “gender diverse” doesn’t mean challenging stereotypes and boys playing with dolls while girls become firefighters.

It means anyone who has interests outside their own gender must be trans or non binary. Their sex must change if they don’t strictly adhere to societal gender ideas.

That is not gender diverse, or progressive.

If you want to wear dresses and makeup, whatever sex you were born, go for it. That’s progressive. Wearing a dress and insisting dresses are for girls, therefore you are a woman with a ladypenis, that is conforming to gender roles rigidly.

@MishyJDI

God all of you lot sitting in judgement on these parents and the child, without knowing the situation.

How about let them be parents, and let their child have the freedom to explore. Play with toys they want, dress how they want. Or be a child without such patriarchal boundaries being enforced.

I think its lovely. Children can be children and find their own way over time.

I do love gender diverse people - it is awesome as it messes around with the patriarchy and society structures which are just constructions. That breaks down boundaries moreso than GC conservatism enforcing out dated norms using fear based rhetoric. Bravo!

Ha ha ha what a load of tosh.

Were you around in the 80’s? I was a teen then and a lot of the posters on this thread we’re around then. The 80’s was the time of gender diversity and freedom. Not now. Now is the time of the patriarchy.

Exactly. My parents in to 70s and 80s:

“This is toffeebutterpopcorn-sister - she’ll have the blue truck and the robot duvet please.”
“Toffee-sister - was it the cowboys or space theme you wanted for your birthday party?”
“Look! They do dungarees with cars!”

How has this backwards, sexist way of thinking become something that some people see as progressive, it’s ridiculous.

THIS

When I take ds swimming, he's got a lovely baby blue body suit. It's got pink jellyfish and blue whales on it.
He invariably gets called a girl. This is either because he's super beautiful (I think so) or sexist stereotypes mean the instructor can't imagine a boy in pink.
I just let her get on with it. She calls him she. I figure he might benefit from sexism at times as people may treat him more gently.
Of course, if I contacted the mail I could steal that title for him. He does like rabbits and daisies after all.
Good thing we're not sexist idiots.

Also it was the norm to dress children in pass downs. If that meant wearing a big brother's clothes so be it.
I actually bought quite a few "boy" clothes for my DD when she was a toddler, reasoning they were practical and comfortable and if I had a boy in the future they would be suitable for him too.

People would sometimes call DS a girl. He had the more enormous eyes and huge curls - a very pretty baby and toddler. He survived...

Ooohhh how cute! What’s her name?
Bill (but real name but very much a ‘boy’ name)
Ahhhhook at those curls! Isn’t she lucky?
Yes he is
Awww darling - can I have one of your curls, wee girl?