Caitlyn Jenner OPPOSES trans girls competing in girls sport

[hm246]

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9533463/Caitlyn-Jenner-says-OPPOSES-trans-girls-competing-girls-sport.html

@LostToucan

People online are calling CJ a hypocrite because she plays golf with women. Perhaps there’s a more of an even playing field in these sports. It’s not reliant on strength as much perhaps? There are other skills involved.

But does she play off the ladies’ tees?

There is definitely a male advantage in golf - club head speed and driving distance for instance.

When I play golf it's with mixed groups. But it's mainly for fun, and the skill levels are all over the place anyway. Most of us objectively suck. So sex differences are pretty irrelevant. For many golf is competition against themselves anyway.

A world class athlete, who also happens to be a transwoman, backing fairness and equality for women and girls = Legend.

A dream come true for women everywhere.

When I play golf it's with mixed groups. But it's mainly for fun, and the skill levels are all over the place anyway. Most of us objectively suck. So sex differences are pretty irrelevant. For many golf is competition against themselves anyway.

I don't know how the handicap system works in golf but presumably that helps to make it a social sport for players of different ability?

I've read Caitlyn's autobiography. At the end, Caitlyn says that they isnt a woman. Caitlyn says that they is a man with gender dysmorphia.

There is a video somewhere on YouTube of 3 top female gymnasts watching male gymnasts “have a go” at the female only disciplines, the women were shocked that men could perform in minutes or after 1 or 2 goes skills which had taken the women a lifetime of training. Gymnastics definitely needs to separated by sex.

Yikes!

So these are normal gymnastic blokes trying out women's Olympic routines?

So these are normal gymnastic blokes trying out women's Olympic routines?

Yup seems so.

@TheSuezCanalTugBoat

I've read Caitlyn's autobiography. At the end, Caitlyn says that they isnt a woman. Caitlyn says that they is a man with gender dysmorphia.

I genuinely didn't know that. So confusing.

God that gymnastics video! Incredibly instructive - not so much the floor stuff which I know the men have a huge advantage at but the beam skills - the solidity of the landings, not even a hint of a readjustment

Well 14 year old boys can beat the Olympic champions at football and break Women's World High Jump records etc so probably not unexpected that they can do moves that even Olympic female gymnasts have difficulty doing.

I've read Caitlyn's autobiography. At the end, Caitlyn says that they isnt a woman. Caitlyn says that they is a man with gender dysmorphia.

Previously on this thread someone referred to Jenner being unconcerned with pronouns.

So are women pn FWR permitted to refer to a man in accurate language that he uses/accepts?

When I play golf it's with mixed groups. But it's mainly for fun, and the skill levels are all over the place anyway. Most of us objectively suck. So sex differences are pretty irrelevant. For many golf is competition against themselves anyway.

Yes, and that’s recreational golf which can be inclusive and for fun. I can’t drive as far as my DH or teen DS because I’m not as tall as them and don’t have the long levers to deliver the same club head speed (although I can still do a pretty good job and when I hit the ball it stays hit).

But at pro level there is a marked difference in both club head speed and average length of drive between men and women. Women on the LPGA average 250 yds on a drive, men on the PGA average 300 yds. And that’s a big difference when you’re playing for big money.

No advantage?

Transwoman winning American Colleges Championship

Should also be noted that women's hurdles are lower than men's to compensate for height difference.
Winner is over 6 ft.

People online are calling CJ a hypocrite because she plays golf with women.

I’ve only ever seen her playing with men but I guess that’s because the majority of people who play golf are men.

I’ve had a quick look on Twitter and there’s many people with opposing views. One said though that men and women are built different so the male body may have an unfair advantage over the female body (which I would agree) but they also said many people have advantages over other components so where does it stop? - some people have naturally bigger lungs/muscles, some are genetically taller, some races are built better to do certain sports, women with smaller breasts find it easier to run than those with big beasts, if you’re rich you can pay to go to specialist clubs and get better training than those who can’t - I agree with Caitlin Jenner but actually these are all good arguments as it is never possible to have full equality/fairness especially if we bring privilege into it.

Differences within sexes e.g. some women having longer legs than other women are not the same as differences between the sexes which attached shows very well

^I’ve had a quick look on Twitter and there’s many people with opposing views. One said though that men and women are built different so the male body may have an unfair advantage over the female body (which I would agree) but they also said many people have advantages over other components so where does it stop? - some people have naturally bigger lungs/muscles, some are genetically taller, some races are built better to do certain sports, women with smaller breasts find it easier to run than those with big beasts, if you’re rich you can pay to go to specialist clubs and get better training than those who can’t - I agree with Caitlin Jenner but actually these are all good arguments as it is never possible to have full equality/fairness especially if we bring privilege into it.^

The biggest difference of all is the one between the sexes and there is no way to mitigate it.
Mediocre male athletes can defeat elite women and male athletes in their forties and fifties can compete against and easily beat women in their twenties.

@334bu

Is that the same athlete that in 2016 ranked 200th in male college sport, in 2017 ranked 390th, took a year out in 2018 and then became women’s national champion in 2019?

Should also be noted that women's hurdles are lower than men's to compensate for height difference.
Winner is over 6 ft.

Some women (born female) are over 6ft too though.

People online are calling CJ a hypocrite because she plays golf with women

Any non contact sport which is played for leisure purposes, and in which the sexes wish to play together is not the issue. The issue is two-fold:

1. Competitive sports, certainly at championship/medal winning stage need to be single sex to ensure fair competition for women and girls.

2. Women and girls are not only at a disadvantage, but actively in physical danger in mixed sex contact sports.

The very same athlete who also feels that they have a disadvantage racing against women because at 6ft2 the wind resistance is greater

Some women (born female) are over 6ft too though

Yes, Venus Williams is over 6ft, but would be soundly beaten by any top, or even most middle ranking men of shorter stature ( tennis)

@toocold54

Should also be noted that women's hurdles are lower than men's to compensate for height difference. Winner is over 6 ft.

Some women (born female) are over 6ft too though.

And girls / women may well naturally gravitate towards sports where they have a physical advantage over same sex competitors.

British Rowing, for instance, deliberately appeals to women over 5’10” for their programme.

But that’s quite different to competing against male bodied competitors with all of the various physiological advantages they enjoy.

Jonny Wilkinson is a few inches short of 6 ft and I bet he can power through the wind better than a six foot woman.