What's it really like for girls when one of their classmates is trans? A short film.

[Shizuku]

That'd actually be less aggressive than that shown here as McDonald's do vegetarian and vegan meals now.

However, the vegan one is a very boring wrap so I am not a fan.

If you shared abattoir film it'd be about equivalent. If it was from the view of the farmer insisting all the pigs were super happy.

@WeRoarSometimes

OP The overwhelming number of messages here are concerned about safeguarding children. This is about how we protect children from present and future risk of harm. We're using the word children because the video you posted shows children. If you're not responding to any of the reasonable questions or messages about safeguarding, that in itself is a serious concern. This is a board about the rights of women. Many of us here are parents and many of us are rightly concerned about your video.

Excellent point. A video that positions girls as powerless to establish their boundaries is a huge concern. The message of helplessness in the face of another's power to determine boundaries for girls is a massive safeguarding concern.

@Sstrongtn sorry but to be trans you need to have gender dysphoria, it is a mental health condition the only one that’s treated with chopping off healthy body parts right enough, but it’s still a mental health condition. The only difference between gender dysphoria and my OCD is I have medical professionals telling me giving into my compulsions is bad and will make me worse, and those with gender dysphoria have medical professionals telling them giving in to their compulsions is good and will help them (despite there being rather a lot of evidence that it doesn’t, even actively harms them and leads to many years of confusion and upset before a detransition).

You: "What happens when there is a trans girl in the girl's changing room?"

Me: "This - everyone's fine."
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Interviewer: Do you look at the other girls in the changing room?
Transitioning male: Yes.

@Sstrongtn it's worse than waffle, it's very disingenuous
The whole premise is built off one paper that's a meta study, and draws the majority of it's conclusions that there may be a biological determinant to transsexualism from DSD people.

But it's not surprising when you realise that the Endocrine Society is an American trade body representing one of the major beneficiaries of the medicalisation of a projected 1% of the worlds population

@MoonCatcher

"Did anyone object in your school?" "No, I was friends with all the girls in my year and that just left the younger girls. If any of them didn't like it, they were younger, what could they do about it? [laughs]" So the opinion or concerns of anyone in a weaker position to the transperson doesn't matter?

I think that the OP has given us their definitive negative on that. No. The transgirl has to be centred when it comes to any issues between them and any more vulnerable person. (or maybe there is going to be a debate about which is the most vulnerable in this situation)

[quote ChancesWhatChances]@Sstrongtn sorry but to be trans you need to have gender dysphoria, it is a mental health condition the only one that’s treated with chopping off healthy body parts right enough, but it’s still a mental health condition. The only difference between gender dysphoria and my OCD is I have medical professionals telling me giving into my compulsions is bad and will make me worse, and those with gender dysphoria have medical professionals telling them giving in to their compulsions is good and will help them (despite there being rather a lot of evidence that it doesn’t, even actively harms them and leads to many years of confusion and upset before a detransition).[/quote]
I'm afraid Stonewall and various activists would disagree with you there - apparently there is no necessity to have gender dysphoria to regard yourself as trans.

I don't understand the logic of that but along with the 'girl brain in boy body' explanation that was widely propagated and used as a basis to determine whether a child may be trans by Mermaids etc but now disowned, I don't understand the logic of much relating to this topic.

The thing I will never get my head around, is that if, as claimed, sexual dimorphism is a social construct with no underlying biological root, why do TRA's constantly refer to that shoddy Endocrine Society position paper?
And why do they need to take hormones with a direct biological effect?
But I guess that's why "It's not a debate" is used

Irony being that a large proportion of mothers have had a boy brain in their female body, quite literally. We should be writing the books on this.

@CardinalLolzy

Irony being that a large proportion of mothers have had a boy brain in their female body, quite literally. We should be writing the books on this.

ooh, and due to the amazing phenomenon of chimerism (I learnt about it here), we may actually retain some of those cells in our bodies!

Coupled with the fact that our guts apparently have as many neurons as a cat's brain and can affect our thinking and behaviour and the bacteria in our guts (and presumably the rest of us) affects all of it there could be all sorts of exciting discoveries to be made!!

People are amazing.

People are amazing.

Yes, and Biology is fascinating. To think the nation that gave the world Darwin, Nightingale Dawkins, Jenner, Franklin, Stopes, Hodgkin etc is now confused by basic scientific reality.

I've been horsey all my life, but only recently discovered about the difference in male and female pelvises. Obviously I knew a woman's accommodates the birth canal, but didn't know female seatbones are wider and the coccyx is smaller. This has direct bearing on how men and women sit in the saddle (dressage has evolved from military riding, and men physically sit and hold themselves differently). Equally interesting is how this has no bearing on success; Equestrian events being the only Olympic sport where men and women compete on equal terms.

Equally interesting is how this has no bearing on success; Equestrian events being the only Olympic sport where men and women compete on equal terms

Genuinely curious. Horses to me are big things best ket away from.

Do neutered male and female horses differ in behaviour and temperament?

I assume they do in strength?

Yes, and Biology is fascinating. To think the nation that gave the world Darwin, Nightingale Dawkins, Jenner, Franklin, Stopes, Hodgkin etc is now confused by basic scientific reality.

Unfortunately we live in a world which also had a Lysenko. Imposing a political dogma on science can lead to appalling results. Such attempts will always ultimately fail, but at a terrible cost.

[quote ChancesWhatChances]@ForeverBubblegum third spaces have been repeatedly brought up as a solution to the trans problem, but trans women don’t want third spaces, they want female spaces. Have never come across a trans man that has rejected a third space though![/quote]
I have noticed that as well, but in the spirit of inclusivity and all working togetherness, I would love for the OP the explain exactly why they would not find it acceptable (because without a proper explanation some might that fall back on the assumption that their using this poor child to control/ manipulate women).

I would also be very interested in the op's alternative suggestions, afterall they (collectively trans rights movement) are the ones who are pushing for a change from the status quo (single sex spaces, as prescribed in law), so the onus really should be on them to come up with workable alternatives, especially if they reject the suggest compromise.

Still waiting for your answer op

And the flip side of gender dysphoria is gender euphoria. Some people transition because it makes them feel good, not because they were feeling bad to start with. The trade-off with women's rights starts to seem even more one-sided then.

Of course they want to have children by a surrogate

What are you hoping to achieve? Why did nobody ask the actual girls how they felt about being appropriated by a male?

@Truthlikeness

And the flip side of gender dysphoria is gender euphoria. Some people transition because it makes them feel good, not because they were feeling bad to start with. The trade-off with women's rights starts to seem even more one-sided then.

Trans women are women, so you're fine.

"and due to the amazing phenomenon of chimerism (I learnt about it here), we may actually retain some of those cells in our bodies! "

That's right - so many women have at least some XY chromosomes.

But we aren't fine, because it's just your personal belief that we don't share.

I can’t decide whether to mud wrestle with a pig or play chess with a pigeon today....

@continuallyconflating

The thing I will never get my head around, is that if, as claimed, sexual dimorphism is a social construct with no underlying biological root, why do TRA's constantly refer to that shoddy Endocrine Society position paper? And why do they need to take hormones with a direct biological effect? But I guess that's why "It's not a debate" is used

This is simply not true - ever since JKRs little tirade trans people have been saying over and over again that sex is real.

However, it is also complicated, and the way people divide the complexities into different groups is a social construct.

Here, don't take my word for it - here is Katy Montgomerie, a prominent trans activist writing an article in which the very first line is "sex is real":

katymontgomerie.medium.com/why-what-jk-rowling-said-is-transphobic-42081477afa1

You really need to get out of this echo-chamber.

[quote continuallyconflating]@Sstrongtn it's worse than waffle, it's very disingenuous
The whole premise is built off one paper that's a meta study, and draws the majority of it's conclusions that there may be a biological determinant to transsexualism from DSD people.

But it's not surprising when you realise that the Endocrine Society is an American trade body representing one of the major beneficiaries of the medicalisation of a projected 1% of the worlds population[/quote]
You: "Give me science."

Me: "Here you go."

You: "NOT THAT SCIENCE!!!"

It's honestly hilarious to watch the levels of science denial that goes on in these boards.

Thank you for taking the time to answer Chances I still hope the OP or someone who agrees with them may offer their opinion though.

I don’t think they have any answers though as you’ve covered it!

I have never felt uncomfortable getting changed with lesbians. I know they couldn't rape me.