Kier shows his colours

[averylongtimeago]

From Facebook, I guess he has picked a side.
51% of the population just don't count.

[Duckwit]

I have not challenged or complained about anyones terminology on here. I personally do not like the term transwomen. We don't describe any other type of human like that. But I have not objected to its use on here. What I do object to is an attempt to force me to use it.

I presume the word you prefer is 'woman'. Well we don't do that with other types of humans in that way either. We don't use words with clearly defined meanings to describe humans who are objectively and categorically not that thing according to the clearly defined meaning.

[Whatwouldscullydo]

And no woman should be forced to be searched by a biological male

I wonder what happens in the case if that gender fluid police officer...

[jj1968]

If you mean "cis" that is still in the world of gender identity though so it does not meet the need. Sure if you believe in gender identity then you can identify as either trans or cis. If you don't believe in gender identity you identify as neither.

If I do use the term cis outside of these boards I use it to simply mean does not identify as transgender/non binary and nothing else.

[Quaagars]

Like vagina owner, bleeder, ovary-havers, gestational carriers, 'fish'

Is this just an online thing as who the hell goes around calling women bleeders and fish or whatever in RL?
Don't know what planet MN is on sometimes, as the word woman is still very much in use.

[Whatwouldscullydo]

If only it was still in use..

[midgebabe]

If you keep to biology you could say women and none cis men if you prefer
Somehow I bet that won't keep you happy

[OldCrone]

I personally do not like the term transwomen. We don't describe any other type of human like that

We could just use the word that goes with their sex. But apparently some of them object to that.

[jj1968]

@Whatwouldscullydo

If only it was still in use..

Still seems pretty widely used to me.

[CuriousaboutSamphire]

jj I asked for clarification, you made a point about it, I wondered what you meant.

Nothing to do with not posting with good intent.

[OldCrone]

I don't know about Ireland but only intimate searches in the UK require someone of the same sex, the vast majority of searches can be carried out by anyone although they should aim to facilitate a request to be searched by someone of the same sex if possible.

And the problem arises when someone's legal sex is the opposite of their physical, biological sex. But you know that.

[CuriousaboutSamphire]

Quaagers you won't get that passed either. You know full well where in real life such terms are used... including the NHS!

[HecatesCats]

It is a commonly used tactic to imply that the women are getting their knickers in a twist over nothing. "Nothing to see here, move along." Nah, we know where it's happening as Curious points out.

[RedDogsBeg]

Don't know what planet MN is on sometimes, as the word woman is still very much in use

You missed all the stuff put out by charities and the NHS dealing with cervical cancer using the description of people with a cervix then? The word woman was not mentioned at all.

Or the menstrual charities and sanitary product providers that refer to people who menstruate with no mention of women and girls.

Or the breast feeding and childbirth organisations that use chest feeders, birthing persons, pregnant person, etc., etc.

Or how about the recent debacle with SANDS, the stillbirth and neonatal death charity?

The word woman is slipping out of use within the very areas and organisations that are dealing with issues only women experience.

[yourhairiswinterfire]

@Quaagars

Like vagina owner, bleeder, ovary-havers, gestational carriers, 'fish'

Is this just an online thing as who the hell goes around calling women bleeders and fish or whatever in RL?
Don't know what planet MN is on sometimes, as the word woman is still very much in use.

Erm, health organisations are doing it. It is real life. Or is it ok for someone to be derogatory towards me as long as it's only online? Right.

ActionAid who help victims of FGM, child brides etc even denied biological women were a thing. Really really. For realz.

[Mummyoflittledragon]

@Quaagars

Like vagina owner, bleeder, ovary-havers, gestational carriers, 'fish'

Is this just an online thing as who the hell goes around calling women bleeders and fish or whatever in RL?
Don't know what planet MN is on sometimes, as the word woman is still very much in use.

Gestators. Menstruators. Uterus havers. Vagina havers. Now officially used terms for female bodied people.

Once again you show how little you know about this topic

[RedDogsBeg]

If I do use the term cis outside of these boards I use it to simply mean does not identify as transgender/non binary and nothing else

How can you identify as those things, you either are or you are not surely?

I'm guessing, and do correct me if I'm wrong jj, that you want the term woman to be used for you and me but if you want to distinguish between you and me you want to add the prefix 'cis' to the word woman to describe me?

[HecatesCats]

Erm, Fishy has been brought into the mainstream by RuPaul's drag race, but you know that Quaagars because you were on the drag thread.

[jj1968]

@RedDogsBeg

If I do use the term cis outside of these boards I use it to simply mean does not identify as transgender/non binary and nothing else

How can you identify as those things, you either are or you are not surely?

I'm guessing, and do correct me if I'm wrong jj, that you want the term woman to be used for you and me but if you want to distinguish between you and me you want to add the prefix 'cis' to the word woman to describe me?

I don't really care what you call me, and no, I'm gender fluid, and whilst I have long lasting gender dysphoria I don't expect you to refer to me as a woman.

I do think it's useful to have a word which means specifically does not identify as transgender, meaning this is not a transgender person, when making comparisons with people who are transgender and happily identify that way. I don't routinely refer to women on here (or anywhere else) as non trans women (or cis) but only when it is important for clarity to make a distinction.

[yourhairiswinterfire]

Another thing that's really getting on my fucking wick. We're told we're being silly because we don't like the terms bleeders, breeders, vulva owners, individuals with a cervix because it's only online.

So playing by those rules, transwomen would be absolutely fine for the NHS to address them in a Tweet or a leaflet as ballbag havers or sperm dribblers, would they? No problem with that at all?

[OldCrone]

If I do use the term cis outside of these boards I use it to simply mean does not identify as transgender/non binary and nothing else

But what about people who don't identify as trans/non binary but don't identify as 'cis' either?

I don't have a gender identity. I am not 'cis'.

[jj1968]

@yourhairiswinterfire

Another thing that's really getting on my fucking wick. We're told we're being silly because we don't like the terms bleeders, breeders, vulva owners, individuals with a cervix because it's only online.

So playing by those rules, transwomen would be absolutely fine for the NHS to address them in a Tweet or a leaflet as ballbag havers or sperm dribblers, would they? No problem with that at all?

I really think you should take this up with trans men because it's got nothing to do with trans women.

[HecatesCats]

@Butterer

I remember "fish" being in a glossary of lesbian terminology in the mid to late nineties- the write up said it describes a "passive" as opposed to "active" lesbian (stud, apparently).
The only other context I've seen it to describe a person, outside of the "slippery customer" one, is in drag lingo, or to describe a stereotypical vagina-ey smell of women.

I don't want to take this thread off on yet another tangent, but there's discussion of the term here:


Drag everywhere www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/4082908-drag-everywhere

[Datun]

I don't really care what you call me, and no, I'm gender fluid,

Ah, so sometimes identifies as a man, and sometimes a woman. But rarely, I suspect as fish or clackerbag.

[Datun]

... clackerbag owner. .