Writing to restaurants and cafes with single-sex loos - anyone want to join me?

[williammorris]

We had a lovely meal in a local restaurant last week - four of us - so the bill was around £130 and on a day when it wasn't eat out to help out, and they were relatively quiet.

Went to the loo at the end - and the three cubicles were single-sex with the wash basins outside in quite a limited space. One of the cubicles was in a mess, with the toilet seat up.

I'm fed up with this. I have a decent disposable income and from now on, I'm boycotting all local restaurants and cafes that don't separate by sex, and I've written to this one to tell them that, spelling out why - e.g. women and teenage girls don't like dealing with sanpro with men in close proximity and the mess you inevitably get.

In future, I'll email to ask about their toilets before making a booking.

Does anyone want to join me in doing the same? I'm guessing it's often men who decide the layout without thinking about the impact, but if we start writing and asking, it may dawn on them they could lose business because of it.

Do you think you possibly have too much time on your hands?

FFS! Fat fingers. Ignore the added G in Kan!

My understanding is that unisex toilets with the sinks outside the cubicles is illegal. Mixed sex toilets have to have floor to ceiling walls and and doors with washing facilities inside the cubicle.

Do you think you possibly have too much time on your hands?

What a strange comment. What is your own opinion on concerns about spy cameras, safety, privacy and dignity?

Lol..... spy cameras? Seriously?!

@DialSquare

My understanding is that unisex toilets with the sinks outside the cubicles is illegal. Mixed sex toilets have to have floor to ceiling walls and and doors with washing facilities inside the cubicle.

Is this definitely right?

is = are illegal

The gaps under single sex toilet cubicle doors are partly for safety. If somebody collapses it can be seen. I often think that unisex floor to ceiling toilets are unsafe in this regard

And for getting out!

Ive climbed out of cubicles before and when we went away for a week many years ago dd got locked in every single loo we went to. It was on a coach tour thing and by the end of the week EVERYONE was joking about it

williammorris the shared sinks doesn’t seem ideal at all! It would be interesting to see if it was a repurposed ladies loo and why the change, extra storage needed , covid or whatever

And can people please stop with the ‘multi sex toilets in house’ argument please. Its honestly the stupidest argument ever, unless obviously you let complete and utter strangers who have not been invited into your house use said toilet at any time of the day. In which case I apologise...but its a very weird thing to do

the spy camera thing is well known

www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/women-spy-cameras-hidden-public-places-peeping-toms-a8689626.html

a small cafe or resturant that has one mixed sex toilet completely self contained including sink is one thing and pretty much the norm. That's very different to multiple toilets opening out onto the area with sinks being mixed sex which is not acceptable

with something like this I'd focus on the latter

I too very much agree with Kan. And OP.

The problem was the allocated space, lack of basins in the cubicle and cleanliness not that they were unisex. In establishments with 2 or 3 toilets, self contained cubicles make sense.

I feel the same way as you OP, and am also v suspicious of the points raised by @kantastic.

It is not clear whether the set-up you describe is fully enclosed cubicles like rooms, with no gaps in walls or doors, or whether it is more traditional cubicles. Either way is illegal, as for facilities to be unisex, they have to be fully enclosed, and must also have their own sink etc.

However, even if fully enclosed, with separate sinks, I STILL want single sex facilities, for these reasons:

• Risk of spycam placement, which is on the increase.

• Mess left by men (I don't care that some posters claim women are equally messy. In my experience, that is rarely the case).

• Risk of being pushed into one of these rooms and assaulted.

I much prefer one large, single-sex room with multiple cubicles, because it reduces waiting times, it feels safer to be with other women, and if someone collapsed in a cubicle, others could easily see that and access for help.

W9men generally prefer single sex . The fact that this choice is being increasingly removed is worrying, as are the comments of those who either don’t care or a vested interest . Why are so many people invested in refusing to see any problems at all? Let me see....

Does anyone have a link to the legislation for England and Wales which shows the set up in this restaurant is illegal please? If the restaurant comes back to me I can point them to that, thanks.

I'm with you op

I also agree that between excessive deletions , certain posters definitely being targeted even by hq staff theres a very definate agenda here.

Ironic how so so many posters on MN refuse to send their boys into the mens but have no concerns about unisex toilets for their dds . I doubt they are still going to the toilet with their 12 year old children.

No one in the feak world wants usnisex toilets. Certainly not ones where all thats changed is the sign on the door. Cos that's what most of the ones now seem to be. Like that theatre. Like Swanmore college, like all the schools kids go back to after the holidays. They aren't all these self enclosed units

Real world

If they have an alcohol or entertainment licence tighter rules apply, for example
www.north-norfolk.gov.uk/media/4063/toilet_provision_in_premises_open_to_the_public_policy.pdf

Search your local authority. Nationwide links are in here womansplaceuk.org/toilets/

I find it interesting that some here seem to be implying that those of us who support the OP are hypersensitive, delicate flowers who ought to calm down, toughen up and stop making a fuss about nothing.

Happy to take all the rights similar hysterical uppity women fought for arent they though daisie

But a spy cam could easily be placed in a female only toilet by someone determined enough to do so.

Honestly, the paranoia here is weird. You really think everyone is so obsessed with watching you take a piss?

Yes indeed Roswellconspiracy

And it reminds me of how some people’s feelings and needs matter very, very much and we should be kind to them and give them whatever they need to feel “safe” but other types of people, as I said they are just over sensitive and really ought to toughen up, stop being silly and worrying about things that will never happen anyway.

I don't frequent places that have unisex toilets and where the women's toilet is not somewhere safe. This is both about safety and hygiene.

I've only ever complained once. This was at an art gallery where the toilets were floor to ceiling etc. but with outside sinks and down the end of a corridor with no staff. They were NOT clean. There was a larger cubical with a baby change table - this was the only one that was clean so I used that (probably wrongly) - but I was in and out lickety-split and I complained in the visitor book and later on TA.

Mess left by men (I don't care that some posters claim women are equally messy. In my experience, that is rarely the case).

Agreed - in a spirit of inclusivity, I decided to use the ‘gender neutral urinals’ toilets at the Young Vic. Technically for females too so I thought sod this, my toilets aren’t free from males, so I will inflict myself on the men.

Easily the most grotesque toilet I have ever been in - even when I don’t count the men standing at the urinal, completely perturbed, trying to do their business - very discreetly.

Not sure if it counts as a win over the patriarchy or me normalising mixed sexed toilets. However - the men were very uncomfortable and I figure the more people against mixed sex toilets, the better.