Why r/GenderCritical was banned by Reddit

[MadBadDaddy]

Hi! TRA here! Thought I'd take a quick breather from all the crowing, high-fiving, etc. to throw a lifeline to any actual open-minded critical thinkers wondering why Reddit banned r/gendercritical. Basically, you have 2 options when it comes to what to believe:

1. It's a true conspiracy: silicon valley, hollywood & the media are in the thrall of the well-funded TransAgenda, the need for woke points, child-groomers, women-haters, MRAs, etc. etc.

1. r/GenderCritical was hateful - if you want evidence then go to r/GenderCynical which existed to harvest said hatefulness. Read their strictly enforced rules about hate speech, misogyny, anti-feminism, pile-ons, doxxing, etc. (NB: abbreviating "trans exclusionary radical feminist" is not considered hate speech on this subreddit) and then sort their posts by "top" and "all time" and judge for yourself.

The trans men, trans women and non-binary people of Reddit do not hate women and do not tolerate abuse. Have a better day. x

I see this thread is still getting Swiss cheesed. I wonder how many of those comments were reported by the OP and how many by the usual monitors.

Reddit GC was fine. It just wasn't male centric, which some male people find very upsetting.

It may well have been properly modded heist and kittens
I only lurked now and then so couldnt die on that hill, I'm much more familiar with MN and i know we manage it..

Re modding there were no transphobic slurs allowed, for example. No doxxing, no brigading. The only difference between here and there is that mansplaining males got short shrift, and the T*M acronym was used.

I think it's telling that males aren't going after sites were the above happen openly.

Where

@HeistSociety

Re modding there were no transphobic slurs allowed, for example. No doxxing, no brigading. The only difference between here and there is that mansplaining males got short shrift, and the T*M acronym was used.

I think it's telling that males aren't going after sites were the above happen openly.

That was my experience of reddit gender critical as well. I though it exceptionally well modded for a reddit board.

What is this thread. It’s reddit. Full of incels, redpillers, fetishists and rape fantasy subs. Of course a place for actual biological women to chat was shut down. It was targeted as a hate sub but only by those who see stating biology as hate speech. I was in there a lot and it was moderated very well. It was the fact that it existed AT ALL that was the problem. End of.

Yup.

This is us, these are our problems.

Shoukd be fair enough for any group to say.

Every time I looked at the GC reddit I saw women sharing their experiences and issues, looking for advice and support. Some of them were questioning their experiences to see what they had done wrong. In many cases all they had done wrong was trying to be kind, saying no or having boundaries.

OP you may have seen the language as upsetting to you, but it was liberating not to watch people twist themselves in knots and walk on eggshells to state simple facts.

I also visited some of the Trans boards on Reddit which were full of hate for women because the posters could never be women. After only doing this once it seemed best not to return. Those boards upset me but they were not meant for me.

Why should a Gender Critical site cater for people who deny sex exists?

I found GC Reddit pretty eye-opening. There were a lot of younger Americans on there who had experienced the actual consequences of trans ideology taken to its logical conclusion. It was a place for them to discuss their own experiences.

Agreed, the posters didn't have much truck with preferred pronouns or pussyfooting around feelings. They were blunt - but they were blunt with any male who came to the board. That doesn't make what they were saying transphobic.

Unfortunately, the experiences of the posters made uncomfortable reading for some people who want to close their eyes to the conflicts between women's rights and trans rights. Furthermore, loads of people were flocking to the board following the JKR outcry - it had something like 65,000 subscribers when it closed.

I felt attacked by r/GC, although I never complained directly, and I flatter myself I've got a pretty thick skin.

But there are so many things out there that can make one ‘feel attacked’. Sorry if I’m not expressing this very well. But there’s loads on Reddit, Twitter, everywhere, that’s hateful and abusive to women. If I don’t like it I don’t have to read it, and if I read it I have to choose how I deal with it.

I don’t think GC, objectively, was hateful. Maybe a thicker skin is the answer, OP. I don’t think shutting down speech one doesn’t like is the answer.

Being a woman involves having to be vigilant and careful, often reading about horrible rapes and murders committed against other women because they are women, knowing that if one talks too loudly or takes up too much space there are likely to be consequences ... so many things. It so underlines the fact that TW aren’t women that they don’t want the ordinary everyday unpleasantnesses that come with it.

Transgender people exist, independent of any ideology

I think the above statement gets to the nub of it. Denying it or accepting it leads to everything else. Arguing it, in my experience, gets you nothing but a headache.

Maybe the ROTW is too blindly accepting, but too much of the GC debate is in denial.

Apart from the defence of r/GC as a fair and well-regulated space, I don't dispute much about the other concerns described in the comments south of my last post.

MN mods are pros. I haven't reported anything. I haven't had to. MN is for civil discussion, r/GC wasn't.

Sex exists, independent of any ideology.

I can't see anyone here saying that transgender people don't exist, unless I've missed it.

Actually, MN is a place where women's speech is censored to some extent. I'm sure that does make it more comfortable for males.

GC did not censor women, and so it wasn't so comfortable for males.

However, OP, you've made your assertion. Righto. Now what? What do you bring to feminism? Myself, I'm interested in maternal feminism. I don't take myself off to trans forums to discuss it though.

As well as Spinster, Lipstick Alley’s feminism board is worth a look. US site for black women, so a different perspective. Lurking on the Meghan Markle threads was my guilty lockdown pleasure - not least the take on Price Harry talking about institutional racism.

Most is bright women talking articulately about the female experience, reassuringly similar to discussions here. But differences show up. TRAs often seem to have a very specific, European idea of female, which can imply that black women are less feminine/more masculine with all sorts of implications. Ditto posters have little patience with efforts to link a commonality of experience between being black and being trans. In a sense trans for black women can be a double whammy when white men assert their victim hood over black women.

The US is different, but it is really encouraging to hear female voices heard. Shutting them down seems to imply men are getting worried.

Transgender people exist, independent of any ideology
What is it about people being gender critical that makes you think it means transgender people don't exist?

Clearly they do exist, I come across many at work, there are trans actresses and TV presenters, trans journalists etc.

What being gender critical means is that you think women = adult human female, not that you think trans people don't or shouldn't exist.

I asked upthread but you didnt reply. Why have you made the step that feeling comfortable in a stereotypically female presentation means you are a woman? I can't get my head round that step.

@DickKerrLadies

Sex exists, independent of any ideology.

I can't see anyone here saying that transgender people don't exist, unless I've missed it.

You're right, and I see it affirmed on this thread and others. It gets muddy when it is not clear whether 'people' or 'ideologies' are being described, but even that doesn't always get a free pass.

As for r/GC? Not so much. "Trans people exist" wasn't completely absent, I'll admit, but I saw no challenge to any poster who said otherwise. A line that sticks in my head was a comment that said something like "we won't do x, because that would mean legitimising trans". It's not pleasant seeing what you are regarded as not so much a person as more a line in the sand.

As usual Ova is correct. It's quite funny to see how unnerving male humans find it not to be centered, if you have the right kind of sense of humor.

I just didn’t find gender critical to be a hateful sub. Now, I didn’t like Gender Cynical very much - it made me feel uncomfortable. It was pretty creepy to know there was a stalker sub who twisted every post and comment wildly out of context. And I know a few women got disgusting messages from gender cynical posters (the usual kind - “go kill yourself, TERF). Is gender cynical a hate sub? It’s certainly filled with people who are brimming with hate and contempt,and who seem to hate women speaking. But guess what ? I just didn’t read it. Op, you mentioned going on gender critical as a kind of self harm. If your feelings were hurt that was a result of your choice to go onto the sub. I would never dream of calling for gender cynical to be banned (although that sub did violate Reddit’s terms and conditions by being a stalker sub and set up just to monitor another community).

As for your statement about trans people existing independently... yeah no one denies that. Trans people exist. I simply disagree with trans people’s theory about transness. I have a different view about gender. So trans women exist - as trans women. On my view of gender they aren’t women.

The whole idea of a stalker sub is inherently creepy. They also came across as a bit desperate for attention in that dog that won't stop pawing at your leg sort of way. Just not an impressive group of people, overall, and prone to reaching so hard it's a wonder there were no dislocated shoulders.

I felt attacked by r/GC, although I never complained directly, and I flatter myself I've got a pretty thick skin.

oh now, that's hilarious. I'm not sure it compensates for the OP's other posts but it is at least a new one on me.

Extra funny in that GC was literally attacked, which is why it's gone now.

As usual Ova is correct. It's quite funny to see how unnerving male humans find it not to be centered, if you have the right kind of sense of humor.

Forgot to put my comment, completely agree with kittens' post.

It's not pleasant seeing what you are regarded as not so much a person as more a line in the sand.

There are a lot of things TRAs say which are not pleasant for women to see, as it demonstrates how many of them, like many males in general, don't actually see women as people. But of course, our feelings aren't in any way significant, are they OP?