Why r/GenderCritical was banned by Reddit

[MadBadDaddy]

Hi! TRA here! Thought I'd take a quick breather from all the crowing, high-fiving, etc. to throw a lifeline to any actual open-minded critical thinkers wondering why Reddit banned r/gendercritical. Basically, you have 2 options when it comes to what to believe:

1. It's a true conspiracy: silicon valley, hollywood & the media are in the thrall of the well-funded TransAgenda, the need for woke points, child-groomers, women-haters, MRAs, etc. etc.

1. r/GenderCritical was hateful - if you want evidence then go to r/GenderCynical which existed to harvest said hatefulness. Read their strictly enforced rules about hate speech, misogyny, anti-feminism, pile-ons, doxxing, etc. (NB: abbreviating "trans exclusionary radical feminist" is not considered hate speech on this subreddit) and then sort their posts by "top" and "all time" and judge for yourself.

The trans men, trans women and non-binary people of Reddit do not hate women and do not tolerate abuse. Have a better day. x

I interact with men & women, gay & straight, cis & trans and it's just...normal? I mean, as normal as it can be if you are trans, but I don't feel like my existence is a slap in anyone's face

This is probably because you're a man, tbh

As a woman, I can identify with just going out and interacting..... normally with other people regardless of whether man, woman, trans, don't think it's anything to do with being a man.
I certainly don't feel like my existence is a slap in the face for people, but appreciate some may feel like that.

No, no, nobody so obvious! Sadiq Khan, though....

Sadiq Khan a lobbyist for trans people?! Eh?

You mean you hadn't noticed? Tsk.

If we're so organised who are our spokespersons? Our lobbyists? Paris Lees? Kaitlyn Jenner?

Are you really so unaware of who is politicking in your name?

Stephen Whittle - decades of lobbying, involved in original GRA and the establishment of the Yogyakarta Principles and Press for Change

Christine Burns - Press for Change & Helen Belcher - Trans Media Watch both these organisations are why male crime is now reported in the media as female crime including rape.

Burns has also been heavily involved with healthcare so there will be a connection to NHS guidelines there that are not in the best interests of women.

Heather Peto - Labour Party member and candidate, involved in the move to make All Women Shortlists de-facto mixed sex.

Freddy McConnell - currently taking a case to the Supreme Court to be recognised as the father on their child's birth certificate. This has serious implications for all kinds of women because it would pave the way for TW to co opt legal status of mother from the women that birthed their children. It also has strong implications for surrogacy legislation and their is some evidence that Freddy is in part being funded by the pro surrogacy lobby.

This is just a handful off the top of my head. There are a lot more. They may be lower profile and less glamorous than the Jenners of the world but they are doing a hell of a lot of damage to women.

I go to the supermarket, I go to the pub (pre-covid, obvs.), I interact with men & women, gay & straight, cis & trans and it's just...normal? I mean, as normal as it can be if you are trans, but I don't feel like my existence is a slap in anyone's face.

And that's exactly how it should be. I'm not offended by your existence. I don't know many people who are. That's why I talk about the ideology rather than people. And I am well aware that not all trans people subscribe to everything said or done in their name.

MadBadDaddy, I'd still really like an answer to my question from last night.

You said:

'You're right, no-ones ever asked me suck anything online. I have mixed feelings on that.'

I asked if that was a joke. And if so, whether you could see how utterly inappropriate it was. Can you explain what you meant?

I think it's entirely possible that some high profile people lobby very effectively for what they see as necessary advances to trans rights AND that the vast majority of trans people are just going about their lives not feeling particularly connected to those efforts or those lobbyists. Both things can be true.

Ask the average woman in the street 'who do you think is lobbying on behalf of women's rights' and she'd say 'eh?'

I really think we have to stop seeing all trans people as some sort of secret cabal who hold meetings to discuss tactics.

I really think we have to stop seeing all trans people as some sort of secret cabal who hold meetings to discuss tactics.

Not sure if this was aimed at me but I'm perfectly aware many trans people will have no interest in politics. The OP has indicted they don't have a lot of political interest although they do describe themselves as a TRA.

However I do object to individuals within the trans community working towards shutting down women's spaces and women's orgs whilst claiming ignorance of the political aims of the trans lobby.

If you don't know the full breadth of what women are concerned about including the politics behind it how can you claim that women's concerns are unfounded to the point they must be shut down?

Ask the average woman in the street 'who do you think is lobbying on behalf of women's rights' and she'd say 'eh?'
Very true

I really think we have to stop seeing all trans people as some sort of secret cabal who hold meetings to discuss tactics.
and agree

Saying that there aren't groups of TRAs meeting to strategise clearly isn't true.

That essentially describes Stonewall, Mermaids and the like. They are quite explicit about that.

And it obviously goes further. All the no platforming, attempts to stop women meeting, shutting down of Allison Bailey's crowdfunder, Sarah Phillimore's medium page, the endless Twitter bans etc. It goes on and on.

None of happened with the odd phone call or two.

The problem for women is that all of the strategising is about shutting women up, not positively advancing the rights of trans people.

I'm reluctant to answer on behalf of the OP @OvaHere but I read 'TRA here!' as a defensive 'I know this is what you're going to say about me so I'll get in there first' rather than a literal self-description. Just like I tend to say I'm old or overweight in case someone else is thinking it. Upvoting or downvoting on Reddit (which I think is all the OP has spoken about doing) is hardly the wildest reaches of political activism.

And, honestly, I think we could do with more trans voices on this board; I think the OP has been thoughtful and responsive; and I'm tired of fighting trans people when I think we should be sticking it to violent men. The OP is the only trans voice on this thread (that we know of) and I don't think they should be expected to answer for the actions of all trans people and all trans-rights advocates everywhere, ever. I think there's a really interesting read-across to anti-semitism here - expecting Jewish people to answer for the actions of Israel every time they open their mouths. It's not, fundamentally, fair.

"If we're so organised who are our spokespersons? Our lobbyists? Paris Lees? Kaitlyn Jenner?"

You don't need them on social media, dogma is created by those bullying the others the most. Then you just need a few more known people to say something and ta da, suddenly it is out there.

It is what Russia does, they pay people to come up with random shit, get the next little local news to pick it up and by the time it reaches the official state news it magically has a history of sources.

MadBadDaddy admittedly trolls this board and gloats openly about women losing one of the few spaces they had on the internet to discuss sex-based oppression. I struggle to see him as 'one of the good ones', or his presence as any way a benefit to this board.

@sausagebap

MadBadDaddy admittedly trolls this board and gloats openly about women losing one of the few spaces they had on the internet to discuss sex-based oppression. I struggle to see him as 'one of the good ones', or his presence as any way a benefit to this board.

Could not agree more, was the first thought I had after reading OP, confirmed it by scrolling through the thread just a little.

Not sure why people are falling for it.

And, honestly, I think we could do with more trans voices on this board

We'll have to disagree on that. I've been on this board long enough to have seen numerous trans allies/partial allies/curious about debate types come and go.

Practically all end up expending the time and energy of women going around in circles whilst they seek to undermine us by saying one thing here then posting screenshots etc... in other groups or targeting individual women by DM.

Others have claimed allyship whilst contributing to official legislation that further damages sex based rights of women and girls in a complete 180 from what they might post here.

You might find that cynical but really it's just realism at this point having been down this road many times before.

I'm not sure where anti-semitism fits into this discussion PacificState.

If only women had spent more time browsing, say, r/strugglefucking to learn how to be less hateful.
I believe it's still up.

In the end, the world gets to see that 65000 women talking civilly about the importance of biological sex got censored, whilst subs on rape, bestiality, paedophilia and white supremacy remained.

And I don't think the reaction of the majority was "jolly good, crack on chaps". It was oh crikey, possibly this isn't the right side of history after all.

The more you shut down women, the more people join us. You can't put this genie back in the bottle now.

Oh and by the way.
Sex is real, and it matters.

It wasn’t hateful. If only hateful subs were banned then why is r/struggle fucking still there. FYI they were known as r/menrapingwomen before the change of name..

I really think we have to stop seeing all trans people as some sort of secret cabal who hold meetings to discuss tactics

But I don’t think that, I don’t think many people on FWR think that either

You might be on your own with the whole ‘we’ thing there

*Sorry this is absolute nonsense. Trans politics have been highly organised and have lobbied governments and organisations with extreme precision.

Obviously this isn't all trans people but it doesn't need to be.*

Yep, seems that way. And the cause has been taken up by the left-wing as well as gay rights advocates, which of course pushes it even further. Even if it's only, say, 0.1% of trans people that get involved politically, the cause has still become influential. We all still have to parrot things that many are convinced to be nonsense, or be guilty of wrongthink. You had a Labour Party leadership candidate threatening to expel people for the "wrong" opinion here...

@MadBadDaddy

I would be very interested in what you mean by “feeling like a woman” from a very early age?

I was raised by a single dad and always dressed in trousers and tops (no school uniform). I spent my breaks reading or playing chess with boys. I worked in a male dominated job. I love comfortable shoes, I almost never wear make-up and my idea of styling my hair is to brush it.

For me, I physically felt “like a woman” after my body was ravaged by three pregnancies.

Where I mentally connect the most with other women, my “feeling of womanhood” is in putting my children’s needs over my own and in being responsible for elderly relatives. I want to protect single sex spaces as I want to protect girls like my daughters from predators, protect the dignity of elderly women like my grandmothers and generally protect vulnerable women.

My understanding of trans women’s need of access to female spaces is that you so badly need the validation of your own womanhood that you ignore the risk to vulnerable women (from predators piggybacking on self ID). Basically you are putting your need of validation above the needs of others. Otherwise, why not a third space (which I would wholeheartedly support)?

I base “woman” on biology. However, you base it on feeling and say that we are both women. In what way do you think we have anything in common?

Totally agree with you CoffeeTeaChocolate.

Very interesting point there coffeeteachocolate.
About putting the needs of kids and the elderly above our own. That's it exactly isnt it? Feminism means dropping mens needs to parity with our own and they hate it!