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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

"My 15 yr old trans son is going through menopause - and I'm so proud of him"

398 replies

bettybeans · 18/04/2020 02:49

http://www.essentialkids.com.au/health/health-wellbeing/my-15yearold-transgender-son-is-going-through-menopause--and-im-so-proud-of-him-20200416-h1nfe0

Christ almighty. I have been trying very hard not to go in heavy on parents of trans kids who make decisions that I simply don't understand but this whole situation just brought out absolute fury. The way she speaks about this process just enrages and saddens me in a way I can't adequately articulate. It's quite simply terrifying. I feel like I'm reading about a baptism or something.

This kid didn't stand a chance and it's absolutely heartbreaking.

OP posts:
WelcomeToTheMountaintop · 18/04/2020 11:56

All I see is a parent listening to their child and understanding that some people feel they were born in the wrong body and want to live their life as man/woman. I can't understand the fury about this, am I missing something major?

If living as a boy just meant calling yourself Bob and wearing jeans, fill yer boots. Although evidence does seem to,suggest that wanting to transition is merely a symptom of something much deeper and more,complex. To transition, either medically socially is a sticking plaster over a gaping arterial wound and rarely solves the problem.

Our outrage is based on the fact that these poor kids are an unethical medical experiment. No one knows longer term outcomes, we don’t know what works. These drugs are off label. We only know that t hey have horrific side effects when used for what they ARE licensed for.

The process is being driven by political pressure groups who have no grasp of the science. (Or the ethics it would seem) And the drugs companies and surgeons are rubbing their hands. A physically healthy teenager CHOOSING a pathe where they will have to take these drugs for life. $$$

Oh, and we KNOW that the part of the brain that weighs up long term decision making doesn’t mature until the age of 25. so the one thing that we do know, medically in all of this. The teens pushed into making these decisions are almighty certainly not cognitively equipped to do so.

Not quite the sparkly rainbow of happiness.

More a lifetime of crippling side effects, whilst the underlying issue still remains.

Pertella · 18/04/2020 11:56

A kid that age cant get a tattoo, but they can 'choose' to permanently damage and disfigure their bodies through the use of drugs not licensed for that purpose.

And that's ok because..?

merrymouse · 18/04/2020 11:57

Article about use of horomone blockers in sport:

www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2020/mar/20/experience-i-took-hormone-blockers-to-become-an-ice-skating-champion

"In Russia, it is widely known that young ice skaters use hormone blockers to keep their bodies from changing. In most cases, taking the hormone blockers works – although there are always side-effects, such as problems with your nervous system and your heart, that no one really talks about."

But in the UK the BBC tells children that they are harmless.

www.transgendertrend.com/uk-cbbc-childrens-tv-i-am-leo/

OneEpisode · 18/04/2020 11:58

Carole, I’m a slow typer and my last post was written before I saw yours. But your question:
If that child was presenting with mental health problems and was' ambivalent about living' and it was nothing to do with being trans then what would the treatment be?
In the UK, there is very little available for families without private options. I’ve been in the CAMHS waiting room and seen a self-harming suicidal child be turned away as they didn’t have an appointment.
We need to do better for our children. I can see why parents accept the Mermaids magic solution.

Thescrewinthetuna · 18/04/2020 11:59

Horrendous. That poor child. Being experimented on with these drugs.

midgebabe · 18/04/2020 12:01

Yes you are missing something

There is a difference between "living as" and trying to medically and surgically change your body to be as close as possible physically

One is about being true to yourself. The other is really about not facing reality. A girl can not become a boy however much she wants to be, however much she feels something went wrong somwhere, however much she hates her body

Being true to your whole self, including the crappy body you were born in is th only way to be true to your whole self. Learning to accept who you are in its entirety is a way to happiness and self fulfilment

OneEpisode · 18/04/2020 12:02

I read an article today that “princessing” little girls, by the wider family and society but especially by their fathers, was a part of them not developing mentally robustly, and was correlated with health issues like anxiety. Our parents are supposed to fuck us all up, in different ways and extents..

CaroleFuckinBaskin · 18/04/2020 12:02

In the UK, there is very little available for families without private options. I’ve been in the CAMHS waiting room and seen a self-harming suicidal child be turned away as they didn’t have an appointment.
We need to do better for our children. I can see why parents accept the Mermaids magic solution.

Yes that is a really good point. 'Transition' being offered as the magical panacea for all their problems, especially somewhere where it is difficult to get mental health support for a child. Sad

WelcomeToTheMountaintop · 18/04/2020 12:06

There's no scientific proof it causes a drop in IQ as one pp said

First, do no harm.

There other therapies that we KNOW work well. CBT, talking therapies. Is it ethical, knowing we have something that will work, to instead to push them into a totally untried path.

Would YOU take a drug that ‘might’ drop your IQ by 10 points, if an alternative treatment exists?

R0wantrees · 18/04/2020 12:06

But if the child didn't get given this option and went on to self harm because they were disassociated with the body they were in wouldn't that be more awful?

Children who are expereincing any form of dissociation &/or self harming need appropriate support.
Why is this cohort of children treated differently to other children whose distress manifests with a different focus eg with regards eating disorders?

Feminist Current:
'Detransitioners are living proof that the practices surrounding “trans youth” need be questioned, yet their experiences are too often ignored.'

JANUARY 9, 2020 by LIV BRIDGE

(extract)
On November 30th, 2019, over 200 attendees packed inside a secret location in the centre of Manchester to attend the first-ever forum of its kind. The sold-out event, “Detransition: The Elephant in the Room,” signified the official launch of the The Detransition Advocacy Network (TDAN), and was organized by local independent feminist collective, Make More Noise, and Charlie Evans, a detransitioner and a co-founder of TDAN.

The event consisted of two panels: the first featured medical experts discussing their expertise and insight into gender reassignment services, and the second was made up of desisting young women who have been ostracized in this new age of blind gender ideology acceptance. (continues)

The medical establishment appears blind to the long-term impacts puberty blockers may have on children, which Bell says are often prescribed without warning parents or caregivers about the lack of research and experimental way in which these drugs are being used. Referencing research from her Dutch sources, Hutchinson said almost 100 per cent of children on puberty blockers progress to taking cross-sex hormones, while, in the past, before puberty blockers were introduced to kids, around 80 per cent of children would decide against pursuing transition.

“We are literally in the void of discovery here,” O’Malley said.

Bell even finds the terminology “puberty blockers” to be “targeted,” as it sugar-coats what he describes as “potent drugs” that are inevitably accompanied by additional consequential effects.

“The body isn’t like a video recorder that you can just put on pause,” he said.

Medical professionals feel stifled in their ability to to talk about these issues. (continues)

Nele, who identified as trans for two years, argued that people aren’t just “born transgender for a magical reason,” but that it is “put on you by society.” She claimed that the contemporary trans movement masquerades as progressive while “reinforcing gender stereotypes” — a position shared by Bell, who said accepting the concept of gender identity without criticism can legitimize “a form of caricatured gender stereotypes.” Bell feels the outcome of trans ideology is a “movement that actually acts against the support of lesbian and gay people.”

Many women [who had detransitioned/desisted] also explained that they had pre-existing body issues, some manifesting in life-threatening eating disorders, alongside gender dysphoria.

Despite almost dying from anorexia, “Satan Herself” said she never linked hating her female body to her eating disorder or gender dysphoria. She never connected the dots between her fear of living as a female and her fear of living at a normal weight, both of which caused her to be dismissive of her health.

“I often wonder how nobody realized that? No therapist I saw; no doctor I talked to about getting surgery; no one in my personal life,” she said to a tear-choked room. “I just wish someone would have been there to tell me not to get castrated at 21…

… Just what the hell are surgeons doing?” (continues)
www.feministcurrent.com/2020/01/09/detransitioners-are-living-proof-the-practices-surrounding-trans-kids-need-be-questioned/

SarahTancredi · 18/04/2020 12:06

Yes that is a really good point. Transition' being offered as the magical panacea for all their problems, especially somewhere where it is difficult to get mental health support for a child

It also apparently cures autism Hmm

There are no external Impartial bodies who train Gps etc they all receive the same training from the same groups who's entire existence relies on maintaining a steady stream of confused children.

Note they have never targeted old peoples home or geriatric wards.

They went for schools.

HermioneWeasley · 18/04/2020 12:06

@ThisIsMyStory1we don’t know if this child would be gay if left alone. We do know that before the affirmation only+ medical route, a disproportionate number of gender non conforming children were gay when they grew up and were allowed to develop normally. We do know that a huge proportion of the detransitioners from being trans men are lesbians - I haven’t heard of one that isn’t.

We also know that a lot parents transitioning their kids are driven by homophobia.

But please, continue to defend the sterilisation of children. It’s a great look

PaytoLie · 18/04/2020 12:10

The boy will have a sex life if he wants one

I don’t think you know how libido and just wanting sex actually works.

PaytoLie · 18/04/2020 12:15

But if the child didn't get given this option and went on to self harm because they were disassociated with the body they were in wouldn't that be more awful?

No it’s not more awful. I used to self harm, it can be helped with treatment for many. Would you suggest liposuction and weight loss pills for an anorexic because they might harm themselves? We don’t fix self harm but causing more harm at their request.

SarahTancredi · 18/04/2020 12:15

In trans men there are reports in fact buck angel wrote their story.

Orgasm causes extreme pain due atrophy of the reproductive system. Many have to go on to have hystorectomys in their twenties due to the results of the hormones...

One transman on YouTube has made a video diary. They remain having to take puberty blockers as their oestrogen levels remain high and they experience lot of bleeding. They are keen to avoid a hysterectomy but their hormones deemed as a puse button may have to continue even when the testosterone starts.

Theres no information regarding long term usage of puberty blockers theywbere always meant to he a short term thing and even then the effects are devatating

Binterested · 18/04/2020 12:16

Note they have never targeted old peoples home or geriatric wards

This is such a good point. I wonder where all the middle aged and older women are who suddenly come out as trans. Oh, that’s right. There are none.

Could it be that there’s something else going on here - something other than the ‘born in the wrong body’ concept that is prompting men, and some colluding women, to spread the idea of being trans to vulnerable teenagers ?

There is very skilful marketing behind all this.

Winesalot · 18/04/2020 12:22

All I see is a parent listening to their child and understanding that some people feel they were born in the wrong body and want to live their life as man/woman.

And as parents we should be listening to our children with open hearts and plenty of love. But not to agree to treatments that have not been proven to be safe for this use. And NOT to write an article about this treatment that treats it lightly and comes across as very superficial.

Particularly in light of the whole accept who you are flaws and all rhetoric the mother advocates.

SarahTancredi · 18/04/2020 12:22

Yes bin

All the older transitioners are make to female. Usually afterntheybhave families and careers etc

But the 4000 percent increase in girls transitioning as children beds investigating. But they are girls so it wont be looked into will it. Even in the trans world people still know who to ignore...funny that.

SarahTancredi · 18/04/2020 12:23

Sorry for typos MN is slow to load and misaligned again today makes typing and editing difficult

TammySwansonTwo · 18/04/2020 12:28

It absolutely breaks my heart. I remember how it felt to be on these drugs, when I was already in my mid 20s, and I’m so sad that a child is going through this. It’s just so sad.

nauticant · 18/04/2020 12:35

I think The boy will have a sex life means they'll be useable for sex purposes for someone else's sex life.

Aesopfable · 18/04/2020 12:36

There's no scientific proof it causes a drop in IQ as one pp said

Apart from a number of peer reviewed scientific studies...

SarahTancredi · 18/04/2020 12:39

I think The boy will have a sex life means they'll be useable for sex purposes for someone else's sex life

Sssh we Re not allowed to talk about what kind if person would be interested in someone who couldn't enjoy sex or who had an under developed body due to blockers whilst being over the age of consent ....

Aesopfable · 18/04/2020 12:41

My aunt has osteoporosis. She has lost at least six inches in height as her spine has crumbled and deformed. She can’t lift anything more than a few pounds in weight. If she falls she will break something and it won’t be easy to mend/repair at all, a significant fall would probably ultimately kill her, so she is very anxious all the time. She is in her 70s but the girls treated with these invidious drugs are likely to find these problems at a much younger age.

littlbrowndog · 18/04/2020 12:41

But imagine giving untested life changing drugs to a child

How the fuck did we get to this

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