Female staff shun MOD's pongy new mixed sex loos

[WomanBornNotWorn]

MOD have spent thousands of public money on new mixed loos no women want - doesn't give the men's opinion.

www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/female-staff-shun-mods-new-21177430.amp?__twitter_impression=true&fbclid=IwAR1HEHi40z6tqD8-F87KFZJ1j7BKAGUxpvqhCckqarRjUc_lgG5z5fRhpk8

Sorry, not sure what you mean!

‘As I said earlier: to do so is about offering people born male a wider personal choice of spaces at the cost of depriving all female people of privacy and dignity of any spaces apart from males, and excluding some some female people from having access to any spaces at all. To give male people more choice of which spaces they prefer. Weigh that up.’

Sorry, not sure what you mean!

Hampstead Heath Ponds is a good example of what Michelleoftheresistance means.

There are 3 ponds and used to be designated
Men
Women
Mixed

Now the ponds are
Men (and excludes transmen as ManFriday found out)
Women including transwomen (so mixed unless you believe TWAW)
Mixed

So in reality
men have their own pond, and can chose to use the mixed pond or ID as transwomen and use the womens’ pond (access all areas)

women do not have a pond that is exclusively for women to use, and for some women this is exclusionary because they cannot use mixed sex facilities (access to no areas)

Thanks! That makes it a bit clearer but how did transmen get excluded from the men’s one?

Men’s pool - men
Women’s pool - women and transwomen
Mixed pool - women, men, transmen and transwomen

Why can’t some women use mixed sex one - is that out of choice? I understand that men are allowed a men only facility and that women aren’t. I don’t believe TWAW (unless they have fully transitioned in which case I still don’t think they are female but for the purpose of toilets/changing facilities/prisons I am happy for them to be in a woman’s space as I think they would but unsafe in a men’s one and not a threat to women in a woman’s space).

The scenario I was talking about was the one in which transgender people are not welcome in either men or women’s facilities.

It seems to me that women, men, gender neutral facilities seems to be the only way forward but because of costs it will be seen to be easier to make all facilities gender neutral. Which I hate! So we lose what we want for a teeny weeny part of the population. I think that teeny weeny part of the population does need somewhere but we live in a world where cost trumps women’s rights.

Having said all that it must be agony for those who suffer from gender dyspmorphia but this wave of ‘identifiying as the opposite gender’ is crazy. I have teenagers. They know one boy who identifies as female (but hasn’t come out to anyone apart from his friends about it) and one girl who identifies as a boy who is open about it. I’ve managed to get to my forties without knowing anyone who is transgender - and I work in a business where I meet different people all the time. So how much of it is a bandwagon? My teens also know a lot of openly gay teens. Are more people gay or more people not afraid to say they are gay? Is it the same with transgender people?

It’s a confusing time for everyone but I do agree, female only spaces must be protected.

That makes it a bit clearer but how did transmen get excluded from the men’s one?

Because despite the women's pond being open to any male who said they identified as a woman, including pervy, hairy-chested men in trunks and penis with not even a hair-do of a "transition" (where women were told there was nothing they could do), when ManFriday transmen went to the men's pond the men in there kicked up a big fuss, called the police and had them all thrown out.

Wow!

So did women do the same (complain to the police) about transwomen?

I have never heard about this before, what a disgrace .

So did women do the same (complain to the police) about transwomen?

Hahahaha.

Have you seen how women who are pro-single sex spaces are treated in the media and in their workplaces?

Are there transwomen using the women’s pond? I had the impression that that wasn’t much of an issue at the moment.

Why can’t some women use mixed sex one - is that out of choice?

Why is that even a question women have to answer? It’s none of your business, with respect. We have - or, let’s be realistic, had - single sex spaces which were hard fought for. We don’t have to justify why we still need them.

I mean, I'd guess not many people in general are using the pond in the middle of winter. Let's see what happens when it warms up.

Are there transwomen using the women’s pond?

The management of the ponds have confirmed that transwomen are welcome to use the women's pond. That’s official.

For certain sections of society who need single sex spaces, the fact they are open to born males, who could turn up at any point and be permitted to swim there, is enough to prevent them wanting to use them.

Ah okay. I agree with you completely but had the idea that the women’s pond might be holding out. God this makes me angry

Women protested and tried to keep it all woman. Men said no.

And then women turned up at the men's pond in protest. Cue much consternation.

@FamilyOfAliens - I was asking why because GirlDownUnder had said this...

‘ women do not have a pond that is exclusively for women to use, and for some women this is exclusionary because they cannot use mixed sex facilities (access to no areas)’

What about that post don’t you understand, beverley?

Is it that you can’t think of any reason why a woman wouldn’t want to share a space with men that was previously just for women?

Single-sex facilities are absolutely necessary for privacy, dignity and safety, but c’mon, women’s loos are pretty disgusting as well. Leaving pads/tampons festering in a heaped up bin; hovering over the seats (or leaving scraps of toilet tissue on the rim); blood drippings on the toilet. It has its own peculiar smell (but yes, the men’s loo does stink of acrid piss).

We shouldn’t argue that women’s toilets are needed because men’s are disgusting (they are both disgusting in differing ways). It’s because we need them for our own dignity and safety!!!

Leaving pads/tampons festering in a heaped up bin; hovering over the seats (or leaving scraps of toilet tissue on the rim); blood drippings on the toilet.

I never see this tbf.

Women do not have a pond that is exclusively for women to use, and for all women this is discriminatory because men get to choose privacy but women have it denied them.

That said, the Man Friday actions (when women went swimming in the men's pond to demonstrate against the invasion of males into the women's pond) took place before the change in the regulations which opened up the women's pond to men. Their demonstration was intended to show how inappropriate it would be to define the ponds by gender identity. I wonder whether they would be evicted now that - in theory! - everyone can use any pond, as long as they claim to be in the right pond for their gender identity.

I wonder whether they would be evicted now that - in theory! - everyone can use any pond, as long as they claim to be in the right pond for their gender identity.

They would be thrown out in exactly the same way. Men do not get steamrollered on this like women do.

I never see this tbf.

Agreed - so I assumed the correspondent was talking about their home lavatory!

Wasn't the Hampstead Heath ponds the decision of Edward Lord? Whose partner claimed that the only difference between men and women was the size of their clitoris/penis - a big one meaning you were male, and a small one meaning you were female?

And who issued a consultation about the City of London facilities in general, but threw away all the replies he didn't agree with?

I never see this tbf.

Indeed. And in any case, if sanitary disposal provision is inadequate, it's hardly the fault of the user.

I hardly ever see women’s toilets in the state described by the pp.

I've never seen women's toilets in the state described by a PP either. Not even at music festivals.