“He makes the hair on the back of my neck stand up” - warning signs you have observed

[AnyOldPrion]

Thanks to the Relationships board, I now have a better understanding of the red flags that can occur early in a relationship that indicate risk.

But it crossed my mind earlier that sometimes there are men (and possibly women) who set off instincts that make us feel unsafe.

Please don’t mention any names, or specific people, but what signs have you noticed that might consciously or subconsciously have triggered that response?

I’m personally not good at this, but I will try to start with a couple of things. These are things that happen when I’m in the same space as someone, but sometimes I have that reaction to photographs or recordings and I’m not sure why. I’d love to be able to understand what it is I’m picking up on.

Standing a little too close and/or moving towards me when I have moved away.

Being watched/stared at/eyes wandering.

Not backing off when asked.

Thanks in advance to anyone more observant.

Most men care about the safety of some women, it's what they do or are willing to allow to be done to the other ones that's the problem.

Yes, what others have said rings true to me too.

When a guy assaulted me in the street, I knew from the first second I saw him that he was a predator. In fact, as soon as I caught sight of him I walked very fast - I was on my way to catch public transport so had reason to be moving quickly anyway, but I went as fast as I could without running. Normally, I enjoyed the walk. I went fast enough to cut him off at a level crossing. I thought that would be deterrent enough, I was wrong. What was it that signalled predator to me? Situationally he didn't fit, I walked that way often and had never seen him. He popped out from nowhere. He was focussed and dogged.

Dh is actually really good at reading people and putting boundaries in. He has a family member who gives him the creeps. Many others write it off as socially unaware/asd type of thing, but - though that may be a factor - it doesn't make him not-dangerous. He's made really inappropriate comments to young female children (in the vein of 'why won't you be nice to me, it's not like I'm going to rape you!') and always tries to position himself next to the younger women. He nearly followed me home once when he happened to see me on the street.
After dh and I were married and had a daughter, he didn't know where we lived. Until another family member took it upon herself to being him around as a surprise. My dh lost his shit, absolutely furious!

One thing that I tend to be able to spot is the arrogant, condescending shit-talker. My mum seemed to attract these like flies. One said he was just like Jesus and, very soon after marrying my mum, met his soul mate in a bar
It's that fakeness that someone else said, they are trying to dupe/manipulate you. These guys like the feel of power over someone they deem weaker, and they invariably turn out to be shitbags.

Can I just say that this kind of thread is exactly what FWR is for. I will be extremely displeased if any comments vanish.

Most men care about the safety of some women, it's what they do or are willing to allow to be done to the other ones that's the problem.

This. If you want to see this in action, it's illuminating to argue with them about it in newspaper comment threads.

The saying inappropriate things that make your skin crawl as people have mentioned is I think frequently used by a predator when they (he) have sized up someone as a potential victim (perhaps by your walk, like Bundy)

If they are going to prey on you they need you to be receptive up until the point they attack you, and also compliant and predictable. They need to get you into a situation where they are in control. I believe they deliberately say these type of things because they know you will feel uncomfortable and either that's enough for them for a cheap thrill, or they want to know how far they can push you before you resist, and how likely you are to say something or end the encounter when you are uncomfortable. It often goes along with forced teaming or other ingratiating behaviour so you doubt yourself and ignore your discomfort.

When men say things like that, that's boundary testing. They're looking to see how you react, and if you try to control your own discomfort and go into awkward laughing and trying to be nice mode then they interpret that as meaning they can probably get away with escalating. What they seem to be looking for is a response where it's clear that the potential victim is uncomfortable but it's also clear that she's second guessing herself and doesn't feel able to push back or extricate herself from the situation.

Yes, exactly this. Sorry I missed your post but that's exactly what I was talking about with mine.

The more people who say it the better! This is one thing that you really can learn to spot, which is what the OP was asking for.

Would someone mind explaining forced teaming?

Barracker your post gave me chills.

q

"Forced teaming is a tactic used by manipulators to make them appear to have as much as possible in common with their intended victims to gain their confidence."

"Repeatedly using “we” or other words and phrases indicating affinity or close association when interacting with intended victims is a strong indicator of forced teaming, particularly when contrasting terms such as “they” and terms of derision such “outsiders” are used to characterize those who might recognize and oppose manipulation."
opencda.com/?p=16873

Disturbing yet illuminating thread. I have to say for me the one I get the most when dealing with creeps is the standing too close thing. The few sociopaths I've dealt with in life have all made me feel very clastrophobic.

I got attacked by a taxi driver the other day and I got him to stop several blocks before my house because I knew something was wrong (that's when he got out of the taxi and came after me). But what? I think it was the way he was moving his head, kind of tense and distracted? He was driving a bit erratically, but that's not uncommon. There was a woman at a bus stop, and he stared at her, only for a moment, but kinda mean? It's weird how I knew.

According to a friend who's a consultant psychiatrist, glasses with yellow tinted lenses are a warning sign that all is not right.

I'm actually going to get a pair with a yellow tint, the reason is they block out bluelight. I have an eye condition that means night driving has become increasingly hard, and someone recommended blue light blocking lenses.

I'll make sure I don't wear them near any psychiatrists.

This is one thing that you really can learn to spot, which is what the OP was asking for.

Thanks Kitten, and everyone else. I thought from the early responses that this was going to end up turning sour, but I’m really glad I started it now.

I can read “The Gift of Fear” online. Sorry, I can’t remember who shared that, but thanks so much.

And to the person who criticised the wonderful women of the relationships board, do stop judging women who have experienced abuse, recognise it, and have learned to quantify it. For those of us who serially attract abusive men, it’s an incredibly useful resource.

Interesting to read here that those who were abused in childhood can be better at noticing/reading micro expressions. It took me a long time as an adult to learn those things as I had a wonderful, protected childhood that sadly left me very open to abuse. Though oddly, only in relationships, not one-off attacks.

I wonder what it was Ted Bundy saw.

Ted Bundy was a liar, as most sexual predators are.
He, like other predators, was opportunistic and tried his trickery on whatever women came in his way. He had no special talent to identify marks. He was one of the charming sociopaths who had perfected the "nice guy" facade.

@bd67th no, not air lats.
Just palms that face completely backwards, when walking or standing naturally.

@AnyOldPrion

"I had a wonderful, protected childhood that sadly left me very open to abuse. Though oddly, only in relationships, not one-off attacks."

Same , 100%.

Wow, this thread is illuminating. I can't say I've ever had anyone test my boundaries or use any of the other tactics on me.
I think perhaps I give off an air of "fuck off" and never have random men approach me.
It must be awful to feel that fear all the time.

Deydodo............imo you've completely missed the point of this thread. The op was asking if others could share experiences of time when their intuition gave a warning and what were the signs, if any. I don't live in fear all the time, I'm just very aware of the absolute truth that not everyone is as genuine as they seem. It's great that you are so invincible and good luck with your air of "fuck off"

Also to deydodo........
"Wow"
Just fucking wow to you too.

Yep @deydododatdodontdeydo I don’t live in fear at all . But once you’ve been a victim you kind of wake up to micro signs.
It’s so good for you that you have that fuck off air.
Because now you can guarantee you’ll never be raped, or be a victim of a random assault, or intimate partner violence, or stalking, or harassment.

Tectonicplates His parents both seem lovely.

I've read the Gift of Fear. Very good. I'm trying to teach my puppy-like DD 'not' to be nice and polite, in all circumstances as I was brought up. there have been a couple of circumstances where men have made her feel uncomfortable. I was with her, they were dads at an activity, and just trying to be over friendly but in a bit of an eye rolling way, sort of David Brent ish. We discussed and I made it clear to her that if ever she feels uncomfortable, she can just say, turn around and leave , be rude etc , no one is allowed in her personal space and so on. I was brought up to be too nice. Strange man sits next to me on a tube and starts chatting - when I was younger I'd feel to rude not to reply or to move. I've had similar just recently and just upped and moved.

I think this is the point at which I observe that behavioral patterns can often be observed in posters and suggest people check the middle part of the Boris Johnson thread.

Re Gara's post, I will forever thank my mother for consistently telling me as a child/teenager that if a man is imposing on my space he is the one who is being rude and I do not owe it to him to be gracious in response. God knows girls will still get the never offend or upset or even mildly inconvenience a man stuff from society no matter how well you try to insulate them, but hearing a version that makes the girl the center of her own story rather than an eternal extra in some bloke's quest for fulfillment from family can help a lot.