“He makes the hair on the back of my neck stand up” - warning signs you have observed

[AnyOldPrion]

Thanks to the Relationships board, I now have a better understanding of the red flags that can occur early in a relationship that indicate risk.

But it crossed my mind earlier that sometimes there are men (and possibly women) who set off instincts that make us feel unsafe.

Please don’t mention any names, or specific people, but what signs have you noticed that might consciously or subconsciously have triggered that response?

I’m personally not good at this, but I will try to start with a couple of things. These are things that happen when I’m in the same space as someone, but sometimes I have that reaction to photographs or recordings and I’m not sure why. I’d love to be able to understand what it is I’m picking up on.

Standing a little too close and/or moving towards me when I have moved away.

Being watched/stared at/eyes wandering.

Not backing off when asked.

Thanks in advance to anyone more observant.

I saw the title and came on to recommend the Gift of Fear but see it's already been suggested. It really is excellent and well worth reading.

Meeting someone in person can actually make you convinced by someone who you would never trust on paper. This Malcolm Gladwell programme from a few weeks back is well worth the listen - about spotting liars and how personality overrides our instincts

www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/p07mnn0f

There's a man at work that really creeps me out and I have absolutely no solid reason why. I haven't heard anything bad about him (or good). He's just a guy at work. No one seems to have an opinion one way or the other about him. I always catch him looking (although it feels like staring) at me and he watches me walk past. When I look up from my desk in his general direction he mostly seems to be looking at me. It's really unnerving.

I feel guilty saying it but I really wouldn't want to be caught in a dark alley alone with him though he's never given me any cause for concern. Shudder.

One that I remember from it is people who ride roughshod over your expressed wishes, no matter how politely. Could be insisting on carrying your shopping, or on paying the bill, or giving you a lift. All things that can be perfectly nice favours for a friend, but become deeply creepy after you've told them not to.

When they ask you if they can tell you something and you say no, then they tell you anyway.

I've just mentioned to my DH about this guy at work as I haven't mentioned him to anyone and I said isn't that weird that I feel like that. DH then reminded me of a guy I had known from around here for years that ended up working beside DH. Something has always felt off about. I was always uncomfortable around him although he was perfectly pleasant to me and I to him (female socialisation!). Turns out he was sacked from a previous employer for sexual harassment to young girls he managed. He got sacked from DH's place of work for similar. Not before shagging a few employees. After he left the women got talking and it turns out he used the same chat with them all in his texts Not envy.

DH never got that feeling from him and thought he was "alright" I couldn't stand him.

Actually that's a very good point about pornography. I do believe most men either look at porn or at least have done so at some point. But most men also know that you don't talk about it in polite company, and certainly not at work. There's a time and a place for everything. It's the ones who talk about porn in public as if it's nothing, who signify a problem.

Thanks to the Relationships board, I now have a better understanding of the red flags that can occur early in a relationship that indicate risk.

According to most of those boards men are the devil incarnate I wouldn't base your knowledge on what you read in there

I have to say that the one person I have been the most uncomfortable around in last few years and from whom I got the sense they were sociopathic/psychotic was actually a woman

I don’t trust people who are too nice or ‘too good to be true’.

I grew up with a very self centred mother, I used to watch her like a hawk to try and work out what her mood was. Violent, cruel, verbally abusive. She wore different faces for different people. As a child I was constantly watching her as I tried to keep myself safe. I still watch people now, more than listen to them.
The only way I can describe why some people make the hairs stand up is that they're faulty, there is something not right about them, they're fake. It's all an act. It's almost as though there's a force field around them. And the Klaxon in my head is endlessly repeating.
Maybe I'm just strange though.

Certainly the ones who argue that everyone watches porn so therefore it is a perfectly acceptable topic for chat among coworkers and strangers is telling you everything you need to know.

Gavin de Becker has made TheGift of Fear available online;
tinyurl.com/GiftoFear

I'm trained to read animal facial expressions and body language to predict behaviour, and most of the unsettling vibes you get from people are from you observing their predatory interest.
It can be more subtle than a bold direct stare, you can pick up micro expressions - fleeting emotions that pass very fast.

I don't know if this is quite what you mean, but there is a bit of research into whether people (especially women) can identify 'dark triad' traits from faces.

www.researchgate.net/publication/232381817_Facing_a_psychopath_Detecting_the_Dark_Triad_from_emotionally-neutral_faces_using_prototypes_from_the_Personality_Faceaurus

@Aberhonddu

Please read the books by Paul Ekman starting with Telling Lies

He talks about micro expressions and what they reveal and he says that people who grew up in abusive environments (I also did) are best placed to be natural experts in spotting certain types of people through a keen awareness of micro expressions

The lead pastor at my church. Everyone seems to love him but he gives me the creeps. Theres something off about him, hes smarmy and I avoid him at all costs.

@100PercentThatBitch
Thank you for that, I'll have a read, I've never heard of micro expressions. It does make sense that if you've grown up with abuse then you're good at recognising it.
theInebriati
I've said quite often that when humans began to speak and use language they lost a lot of their other senses. My dogs can read me like a book, I do spend a lot of time with them though and I know them pretty well too.

There's only one adult who has given me that feeling in recent years. He has a key role at an orchestra I went to for a while (I am not very good so don't have any other choice of orchestra/music group). He always stood far too close, was constantly trying to touch me on the arm, shoulder, etc and definitely wanted to be on hugging terms with me (I don't hug many people, definitely not aquaintences). It was almost comical how he would stand too close, I'd step back, he'd take another step towards me to be too close again. He had hearing problems (strange to still be so involved with music) and blamed that for needing to be so close, but that doesn't explain why he kept trying to touch me when he knew I didn't like it. I stopped going to that orchestra, and so did all the other women under 50 (he didn't do the same things to older women or men)

I am a teacher and there have been a few children (teenage) I've been concerned about. As in "I'd never want to be alone in a dark alley with them". Not really the massively badly behaved kids, but more the sneaky quietly sneering kids tbh. Over 15 years there have been 6 kids I've taught that I've felt very uneasy about but been unable to put my finger on why (obviously I've been professional and not shown how I feel to those kids, or others). All 6 have been boys, and all 6 are now in prison for either violence or sexual offences. 3 have been convicted of multiple counts of rape. I am indeed glad that I was never expected to be alone with those kids.

I think Creepster has nailed it with this one -

When they ask you if they can tell you something and you say no, then they tell you anyway.

It's a complete lack of respect to ignore your wishes. If the subject area is upsetting to you and you have told you don't want to hear then they are often deliberately telling you to enjoy your reaction.

This seems to be a common trait in several abusive people I have known.

I started a new job this year, it involves working with very poor and often very vulnerable people. A few days into the job I had to interview a man, he had his new born grandchild in his arms and was putting on a display of OTT happy families. My blood ran cold I was freezing and had to leave the room as I became very aware I was possibly going to faint or throw up. I just felt like I needed to run. Long story short, my colleague took over the interview but I had to go on and do a thorough background check on him. Yes, convicted rapist of two teenage girls (some other charges not brought to court), possession and distribution of indecent materials and carrying a weapon. He had served a sentence, not that long tbh, and he was there - in front of me happy as Larry and holding a small baby who he was potentially living with. In a room surrounded by other vulnerable people and of course kids. That was my first encounter of a man like this and unfortunately not my last. I've never had such a physical reaction to a person before or since.

gloriousred with your current colleague, you say “ he's never given me any cause for concern“, but he HAS, eg you describe at least one good reason for your concern, the way and frequency that he looks at you. Your H has also reminded you that you were right about the past colleague of your H’s.

On Fridays I work a longer day and DH picks up the kids. One evening it was later than usual and their were fewer people around (about 6pm). I was in one part of the building and walked over a walkway to the buildings where the lifts were. There was a man waiting as well, maybe mid-thirties, tall, fair-hairs,,fairly pleasant looking who smiled at me in a friendly way. It’s weird because all I could think was, “I’m not getting in a lift with him!” and fled and made it to the carpark by another, circuitous route.

I have no idea whether he was a perfectly nice man and I overreacted for no reason or whether it was a valid, instinctive, response but it was very strange.

Hmm not sure about this - look at that slightly odd teacher who got pinned for the poor girl in Bristol’s murder because he had funny hair and was abit eccentric. My godmother had a dog walking friend turned out to be Dennis Nielsen. She found him to be a pleasant chap.

I don’t think people here are making assumptions based on people’s appearances or hobby choices. (Like the terribly sad Christopher Jeffries case) I think here we’re talking about something different, physical responses that override normal judgement.

I have had this twice in recent times and both I can still feel how uncomfortable it made me. One was at a firestation open day, I was with my children and a man on his own was staring at my children, i can't explain it but it was almost like he was stalking his prey, he may have well as licked his lips - utterly gross and we left immediately. I just shuddered remembering this.

The other instance was on holiday and a really friendly older gentleman spoke to me and the children, it was the way he touched my hand and spoke to the children - made me feel so uncomfortable, thankfully we left that day.

People invading my body space, I hate that.