Dads to be are 2nd class citizens on the labour ward because they don't get offered a cup of tea...

[FromDespairToHere]

Hope the link works: www.thedadsnet.com/forums/topic/2nd-class-citizens/?fbclid=IwAR2ah6KP7KIIY1RD5EebUKOBdolCcuI6w2kDndAiZoTBqc2WVWif-HFCeaY

How dare he not be the centre of attention while his wife is giving birth?

Thankfully most of the other men on the forum are quick enough to tell him he's a knob.

A vending machine near the maternity unit sounds entirely reasonable to me.

Maybe it's something dads groups could raise money for?

Maybe it's something dads groups could raise money for?

It doesn't cost money. The companies make the money from the sales. In the days when we could have them in school the company actually paid the school to have the vending machine there.

Great! Then dad's groups should campaign to get them installed. If anyone from TheDadsNet is lurking here, pick up the ball and run with it.

Sadly, these situations shine a light on some couples relationships.

Labouring women really shouldn’t be having to do wife work simultaneously, just To prevent their partners becoming dehydrated.

If you are mature enough to get a woman up the duff, you can take care of your own beverage needs.

Until the labouring woman approaches the second stage of Labour, her birth partner is able to leave to get food, drink and rest as appropriate.

Given the appalling state of maternity services, the lack of resources not to mention the appalling rates of women suffering from birth injuries it is surprising to find any woman on a feminist board so exercised about a lazy man's demands for a cup of tea!
He was quite rightly handed his arse on a plate on Dadsnet. Let's get the resources, safety and effective care for women and babies in place first. Then we can worry about the man who can't walk to the cafe or vending machine to get his own drink.

Nobody's objecting to a vending machine - we're objecting to dads demanding midwives make a tea for them, when they are not the patient. Midwives have enough to do looking after their actual patients.

"Remember the long, long threads about dads staying overnight on the maternity ward? Stories emerged from nurses/other mums about dads taking the bed, and the mum sitting in the chair "because he needs some sleep" (!) taking mum's food, demanding sex, leering at other breastfeeding mums.

Entitled dads like that can fuck right off."

^Is this behaviour becoming more common, or is social media and the anonymity of the internet just shedding more light on it? I can imagine most of my male relatives doing these sorts of things (especially the pestering for sex or leering at breastfeeding, eugh).

The older I get and the more I read online, the more think more men are like this, than aren't, and more women are putting up with selfish behavior from their partners, than will admit to it (I did it too, minimising and denying how bad my ex and relatives were for years, so I do get why women do it).

Erythronium - sometimes I think that way would be best - childbirth completely women-led and women centred, and leave the men outside with their cigars

Mouse, your situation is exceptional.
It is highly unusual for a labouring woman to be incapable of being left for five whole days (and presumably having absolutely no friends or family he could call and ask to meet him at the entrance with supplies).

LazyDuchess - possibly it's because dads are allowed to spend more time on the ward now, with the mums. In the past they were packed off home after visiting hours - now it's all day and sometimes overnight. I think the entitled behaviour becomes more obvious/prevalent, the longer the entitled man stays on the ward.

I think it goes back to what I was saying about rights v responsibilities.

The men who think it's their right to be in the maternity ward at all hours (let alone whinging about lack of tea) is a very different case to the men (and I reckon mouse's DH fits this group) who see it as their responsibility to be there to support the mother.

Until the labouring woman approaches the second stage of Labour, her birth partner is able to leave to get food, drink and rest as appropriate.

Really? Certainly not my experience. Apart from the painful contractions, that did bog all for days other than hurt, they also tried 3 times to break my waters which felt like I was being eviscerated with a garden fork (probably because I was only 1cm dilated and they shouldn't have been attempting it). I didn't want to be left.

I was an inpatient antenatally. On bed rest due to pre eclampsia. My sister came in in labour herself. Got to the end of visiting and her husband was sent home (because she was on ante natal ward). She was in pain, contracting frequently and upset. They refused to take her to labour ward, where her husband could have stayed with her, and suggested having a bath instead - only she wasn't allowed in on her own because she had had pain relief and they had no staff free to sit with her. So guess what they did? Got me, her sister off of bed rest and asked me to watch her in the bath in case she passed out. So, yeah, women in the 1st stage of labour clearly do need someone with them if hospital staff can't or won't do it. (she had the baby 3 hours later by emergency c section after they begrudgingly let her go to labour ward and then found the baby in distress).

If the staff need a person to be with a woman in early labour they either need to provide staff or accommodate the birth partner. They can't be co opting other patients instead.

Good point, Errol , and worth remembering that posts have appeared on this board from women dealing with abusive exes, trying to assert their 'right' to be present at the birth of their child when she does not want him as a birth partner.

The entitlement is shifting from birth partner to 'this is my birth too'.

Mouse, your situation is exceptional.

I don't think it is exceptional for women that have had complicated pregnancies and are induced following long stays in hospital.

For women who have gone into spontaneous labour at home and then gone into hospital only for delivery it probably seems impossible that others are in for a while and that induction can take a ling time especially if early.

I certainly don't think staff should be catering for birth partners but I do think that hospitals should think about provision for birthing partners who might be there for extended periods of time. Even if that provision is easily accessible vending machines. They have them in A and E for goodness sake and most people aren't there for days.

The entitlement is shifting from birth partner to 'this is my birth too'.

It really is - and having men on the wards for longer, and overnight, men demanding that they are entitled to stuff reserved for patients (and it won't just stop at a cup of tea) - is detrimental to the women.

Time & resources of the midwives will be taken up by them, women will lose any privacy on the ward, dads using the patient toilets & bathrooms - it'll be never-ending.

@LittleChristmasMouse all of that sounds dangerous and poor practice, which I hope you were able to complain about. It isn't normal.

I wonder how your husband did cope for 5 days without food or drink?

And a vending machine in a nearby corridor is a sensible suggestion. Which you could make to the hospital if you haven't already.

The staying on wards overnight is not going to work for many reasons and I think it has only been allowed to make up for the shortage of staff. The men were seen as a way to free up midwives to do other things but clearly a normal ward is not built to accommodate visitors staying overnight - there's a lack of privacy, it isn't comfortable sleeping in a chair and they will need to be fed and watered.

Maybe the wards should be properly staffed and new mums properly looked after so that hospitals don't have to press gang new dads.

People become super entitled when it comes to cups of tea for some reason. I'll be gowned and gloved, carrying random bits of medical equipment and still someone will come over waggling a mug and their eyebrows at me. I now hate making hot drinks with a passion.

@AssassinatedBeauty

We had taken food and drink with us (as we were told to do, just didn't expect to be there 5 days rather than 24 hours). We bought stuff from the trolley shop that went round and some of my colleagues brought in some for him.

We did complain, about that and a lot more. Sadly it really was usual for that hospital, long since closed down though the new one isn't much better from what we here. (been in special measures for a while now).

it'll be never-ending

Not to mention the creep towards parental rights over the child being seen to exist prior to birth. Which would have major implications for women, not just for fathers having 'rights' to be present and witness the birth of their child whether wanted or not (potentially serious risks if a woman is forced to accept someone present she is deeply distressed by), but setting a precedent that would inevitably be stretched to a woman's choices during pregnancy.

Michelle - too true. All I see these days is women's rights to privacy and bodily autonomy being rolled back.

If you weren't prepared to let your partner leave your side (even when you slept ) that's really on you. I can't really comment on the vending machine situation. Maybe they dont want to be the ones people argue with when their crisps don't fall properly. Maybe they thought as they had a cafe a man should be able to walk to the cafe. But at no point are they required to feed a non patient and if your dh died of dehydration that would not be on anyone but himself.

Also I don't really see why people can never discuss the topic without turning in to something that wasn't being discussed. The man wasnt in hospital for 5 days. He'd been there 12 hours without a cup of tea and was having a whine on his phone. Your very specific situation isnt really relevant.

Exactly, Guyliner. LittleChristmasMouse, your experience here is entirely irrelevant, unless it is used to show exactly why midwives should not be offering cups of tea to birth partners. There is already not enough support for the actual patients in hospital, let alone to expect that to be spread even thinner so that accompanying partners are given attention. A vending machine is a fine idea, but again totally irrelevant to the original complaint.

This is the tricky thing about labour and birth. It’s a major life event for both parents, but only the mother is the patient. My husband saw himself as my supporter and advocate. That was his job. It becomes easier to feel included in the process if you feel you have a role to play, and he and I established that well in advance of my being induced. He also managed to sustain himself on the snacks we’d brought and a couple of trips to the canteen.

The second time I gave birth it was an unplanned homebirth in our bathroom. That time he really did have a job to do, because he caught the baby.

Little I'm sorry as it sounds like you had a tough time .

Most women being induced, need as much rest as possible until labour is established. Partners are often encouraged to go home overnight to facilitate this.

Men who are birth partners do need care to support their partners, but there is no reason this shouldn't be self care most of the time.