WTAF is wrong with West Yorkshire Police?

[Bluestitch]

Don't know if anybody has posted this already, lovely bit of victim blaming there. I'm not even surprised anymore.

mobile.twitter.com/Jessicae13Eaton/status/1105821309701894145

I live in West Yorkshire. I’ve had a number of friends and one family member in her 50s who have had their drinks spiked. Unfortunately they were all female. I’m not sure if it’s a particular problem in this city at the moment that the police are trying to address but I do think their poster could have been thought through better. I think it’s difficult for the police to get these warnings out to people without appearing sexist. Who spikes drinks men or women mainly? Who gets their drinks spiked? Men or women? What’s the data?

So why isn't it saying kids were asking for it when we give them the same message in a childhood version, like not accepting sweets or lifts from strangers? Why is it only victim blaming for rape, not kidnappers and pedophiles?
We all tell children not to go with strangers, not to accept things from strangers. We tell young people too, like the young women this ad is aimed at.

Can't speak about the knife crime one. But surely, telling young women not to go to strangers parties and drink and take drugs is normal, and something they should know anyway? I mean, it's a very simple message and one we all know and most of us on this thread probably wouldn't go to a strangers house party for free alcohol, driven there by a stranger, because we know it's risky and that anything could happen.

Would you be happy if your 15 year old daughter went to a party with her mates that was organised by a load of older blokes that they hardly knew and that you certainly don't know/ can't trace? Would you be victim blaming if you told her not to go?

I wouldn't tell my 15 year old daughter that being raped was the 'price she paid' for the crime of being female and attending a party.

This is just the sort of advice any sensible parent would give their child. I don't see it as victim blaming, just telling it how it is. The fact is that there are men out there who will prey on women, and if you make yourself vulnerable you are more likely to be attacked. Look at it from the point of view of one of these vile men. What sort of woman are you going for ? The one who is strong and in control who will fight back, or the one that is easy to control because she has made herself vulnerable? By the way, it's similar advice to that given to my 17 year old grandson after he was robbed and stabbed. Don't make yourself vulnerable by drinking too much, and stay with your friends.

They could have given a safety warning that emphasised the behaviour of the men involved and why they were best avoided. Instead of saying if YOU do this then this is the price YOU pay.

It's not just attending a party though, it's going with strangers to drink and take drugs and is extremely risky. You would tell her not to, if she asked why, you'd probably tell her there are predators or maybe you'd actually say rapists. That is what this ad is saying. Don't go, don't accept the free things, you could end up being raped.

Victim blaming bollocks!

Yorkshire police experts in this aren't they? Hillsborough, Savile, Rotherham...

And they clearly need a new SM team/policy

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-york-north-yorkshire-46362912

As for "what about stranger danger" that policy/campaign is being stringently criticised now by experts in csa as inaccurate and damaging.

"Why can't they just go after the predatory bastards?" THIS X MILLION.

And I know not just the police but the woeful lack of convictions and pathetic sentencing for paedos and rapists is NOT helping matters. There's no deterrent for these creeps!

"People do need to know this, and they do need to be reminded of situations that things are more likely." Girls and women ALREADY KNOW the risks of certain things! We guard against them every sodding day of our lives, it's about bloody time the potential perpetrators of such crimes were expected to modify THEIR behaviour!

"Because normal men already know not to rape and don't have the desire to" normal men? As opposed to what? "Dirty old man in a Mac hiding in an alleyway"? Who do you THINK commits rapes? NORMAL MEN there are HUGE issues around boys and men NOT understanding consent. NOT understanding what rape is, there's even numerous threads on mn by women who've been raped by their partners/husbands who aren't sure if they were raped, not because the situation was ambiguous but because as a group we've been gaslit into not recognising rape.

There's a few studies have been done and found that where a rape was described but not named as rape men are more likely to admit they've raped.

www.thecut.com/2015/01/lots-of-men-dont-think-rape-is-rape.html

There was a BBC documentary called "is this rape?" And it was young people discussing there were some really shocking WRONG attitudes and understanding about consent verbalised, even by women.

Most rapes are committed by someone the victim knows and trusts.

Please tell me there's an equivalent for males? You know, always keep with your friends, don't drink so much you can't remember where you were and what you did, don't put stuff in women's drinks, otherwise you won't look good in court, kind of thing?

Sorry -- my post was already on Graphista's pic!

They'll never catch all the bad people in this world, including rapists.

Well, especially if they don’t even try huh! Police response to rapes is disgusting. A young woman I know was asked why she wasn’t more upset by the police officer- met police.

This poster is disgusting. The language is atrocious. There’s a way to do this, this isn’t it.

There are predators out there and they really don't give a shit. Yes I wish we lived in a world where they didn't exist but that is a long time coming I think.

One of my best and oldest friends was raped by two men after she went back to their hotel room for a drink. She was very young and in her wildest dreams never thought anyone would be so evil. There wasn't even a snowballs chance in hell for justice. It was absolutely terrible.

All I can do with my daughters is let them know things to help keep them safe. Obviously, it's not the victims fault ever. But wishing rapists away doesn't protect women.

Tell your daughters what you want, but I'm realistic enough to try and raise mine strong but careful. Fuck the evil wankers who make us have to think like this.

Admittedly, the poster is badly written. And west Yorkshire police.......

Nuvanewname

How about leaflets telling young men not to rape?

Or are you one of these who think that men raping women is 'inevitable' like earthquakes or hurricanes? And that rapists are 'born evil' men who lurk in bushes in a trench coat, and there is nothing we can do to stop men raping women because ya know, it's what men do innit.

When I was a student in Leeds in the late 70s / early 80s, West Yorkshire police totally failed to catch Peter Sutcliffe (the so-called Yorkshire Ripper) because of their absolutely useless police work.

Instead they instigated a publicity campaign telling women to stay indoors and scaring the shit out of us with posters and ads on radio reproducing the words of the hoaxer they had been taken in by. They wanted to impose a curfew on women.

The focus was all on women's behaviour, men were never told to stay in and there was no suggestion that men's behaviour should be questioned at all, or that society more generally could do anything about male violence. On the one occasion that feminists suggested men could stay off the streets on a particular night (because the hoaxer has threatened an attack and it would have made it harder if there were fewer men about) my male friends were outraged at the suggestion that their rights should be infringed like this. It was regarded as laughably extremist by people who had been telling women they needed to take the 'sensible advice'.

This is why it's victim blaming or in fact shifting the responsibility onto women, whether we've been victims of crime or not. It's not up to girls to prevent grooming gangs from committing illegal, violent acts. It's up to the police to catch them and society more generally to prevent these crimes in the first place. Making the focus on women's behaviour normalises the behaviour of men in these situations - as if it's like the weather, something that will always be there and you can't do anything about it.

Clearly West Yorkshire Police have learned nothing, either in terms of improved police work, or in their attitudes towards women and girls. I see a link between these two things, most glaringly in that they wouldn't listen Sutcliffe's initial victims, and they haven't listened to the girls who were singled out by grooming gangs. In both cases, these were 'the wrong sort of women' and were blamed for their treatment by their attackers. If the police had listened to women they could've prevented further attacks and caught the perpetrators sooner. But they prefer to lecture women (and police thought crime, but don't get me started on that...)

Because normal men already know not to rape and don't have the desire to.

That is not how this works. This is based on the idea that there are good normal men and then there are rapists. That’s not reality.

Did you ever see the infamous reddit thread “ask a rapist”? There were thousands of posts, and maybe one or two were from men who deliberately set out to drug and rape women. The majority were from men who did not realise what they were doing was rape until later, and if you’d read them you’d know that’s true.

Where are the posters that say “if you have sex with a woman without her without her enthusiastic consent, or if she’s too drunk to consent, that’s rape”. Some people don’t yet understand why this message is necessary but it is.

Only 1.9% of reported rapes are prosecuted in this country. 1.9%

Its people pretending that if they do all these things they or their daughter's won't get raped. It's magical thinking. I do not know one woman who has not done something that would be considered risky, not one. Gone to a party, got drunk, got in a taxi, snogged a random bloke., been in a relationship, all high risk.

Ffs. You can’t keep yourself ‘safe from rape’ by following some rules. If it were that easy we would have all done it wouldn’t we? Do you really think women are raped by a lack of risk assessment and not by rapists?

Do women not get raped in countries where you’re not allowed to drink or go places on your own? Perhaps Saudi Arabia is a utopia full of women who have never so much as been in the vicinity of a rapist as they can’t ‘put themselves in vulnerable situations’.

Most rapists are normal men. Most people who are raped are average everyday people. You can believe all you like that you can follow the rules to protect yourself but realise when you parrot this magical thinking it can hurt women who’ve been there and couldn’t ‘choose’ not to be raped.

Just to correct some of the shitty rape myths being promulgated on this thread and WYP:

Women are victims of rape, not men

Women are more likely to be raped and sexually assaulted by a friend or partner in their own home than anywhere else. 'Party animals' are less likely to get raped than women who stay home with male friends or partners.

Yes, it's this idea that if you do these things it will keep you safe from rape. Its just not true.

Those comparing it to 'stranger danger' messages to kids, would you say "Don't accept sweets or gifts from adults you don't know. Nothing is free and the price you pay could be molestation!"

If not, why not? It's the same message.

I know why I wouldn't use that phrase, and it because making being a victim of crime a 'price you pay' positions the victim as having deserved or invited what happened. It almost makes it sound like a contract of sorts... you got free stuff, so of course you hap to be raped to pay for that.

Would a child who was told what I've written above be likely to report it if they were molested? Or would they feel too ashamed and guilty to do so?

Women are more likely to be raped and sexually assaulted by a friend or partner in their own home than anywhere else. 'Party animals' are less likely to get raped than women who stay home with male friends or partners.

I think this in turn all perpetuates the myth that there is a 'hierarchy' of rape. That it would be better to be raped by your husband than to be raped by a stranger at a party.

Statistically the most dangerous thing a woman can do is live at home with a man. Where are the posters about the dangers of that?

The 'free stuff can come at a very high price' line is fucking grim. You can see the misogyny oozing through the words.

Who signed this off? Fuck WYP.

No!

Don't accept sweets from strangers. Don't accept drugs from strangers.

This is common sense. Stay safe.

The message in that poster is Go nowhere you have never been before, speak to nobody youhave never spoken to before or you will get raped

They could have simply re-written the knife crime poster. Men do not rape!

Imagine the kniofe crime re-written in the same was as the rape one:
Don't go anywhere that might be a bit dark, a bit secluded, cos if you get knifed you will have asked for it!