How to get school to back off.

[mouseymummy]

My 14yo dd is struggling to figure out where she fits in at the moment, she's more of a "tomboy" but will happily put on a playsuit and leggings etc etc.... You know. Usual stuff kids go through as they try to figure out what they like and suits them.

However, she's been hanging around with a girl who wants to transition, her parents are very vocal about it all and buying her a binder and demanding her school etc refer to her as her "true name" as well as other things.

I've explained to my dd that you can be a woman and wear jeans and a flannel shirt, get your hair cut short etc... I'm always wearing jeans and tees. I wear "work boot" style boots as they're comfy and I have a condition that causes my joints to be loose so they're practical too. I've explained that you can be whoever you want to be. She's just not understanding how you can be just yourself. She's very much falling into stereotypes and saying how I dress dd6 in dresses etc... Thus is what she chose when getting dressed that morning, she had jeans on the day before.

School is not helping this.

They've told me that I'm "damaging her" by refusing to take her to the doctors and persueing a "transition" she's 14! I'm seriously waiting for a phone call to social services for not taking her to the doctor as its apparently "emotional abuse" ffs.

Ive ok'd her getting her hair cut short and we went shopping a couple of weeks ago for her to get some clothes she felt comfortable in, she chose leggings, a couple of pairs of jeans, a hoodie and a couple of slogan tees from the mens section in primark (they have a lot better slogan style tees than the women's section)

She's asked for a binder and I've refused. This has all started since school told her she could (her exact quote) "become a proper boy and do all the boy stuff" I asked her what is "boy stuff" she had no answer.

Schools safeguarding team (yes, really) rang me to tell me that they will be referring to her as her "boy name" and when I call up I will have to say I'm the parent of said boy. When I questioned this and asked if they had found anyone else with parental responsibility to OK this as I hadn't (they don't have her dad's number as we're not together and he works away so wouldn't be able to collect her in an emergency) they responded with no but this is what they do when a kid comes and "officially self identifies".

OK, if my kid decides when she's older to crack on n transition, fine, I'll support and be there.

But at 14???? I refuse to be part of it until she is better prepared in life and actually understand what the processes entails etc.

What can I do here??

MurielPritchett that took huge courage to challenge them like that, well done

And I shouldn't be shocked anymore at all the unlawful bollocks being spread but I am.

@CharleyParley

You're right! I've just looked that up for myself. I think of myself as pretty well-informed and Id allowed myself to be hoodwinked.

Shame those carrying out Inspections or advising school's don't know. But now I'm off to email the person who delivered the training

Leave the school, now. Get your daughter away from the other child too. She's obviously being influenced!

Children are easily manipulated and change their minds all the time, the school are awful for encouraging this. I would be writing to the board to complain/get an appointment with the principle.

Jesus, I’d be down that school forbidding them to transition her.

This isn’t the first time I’ve heard of a parent getting the same phone call.

What's their safeguarding response to a situation where they had a girl who'd suffered sexual abuse or rape and a self id trans boy? Who's feelings come first?

Do you get on with your gp? It might be worth going to see them. At least to sound them out? I don't think they've all swallowed the Kool Aid.

Are DD behavioural issues connected to autism? There's seems to be a very high cross over with trans girls and autism. Could an autistic charity advise?

Find out as much as you can (if you haven't already) about the work of Dr Zucker. There was a great tv show, exploring his work. Sounds like you are doing all the right things, but there might be some helpful tips moving forward.

I think I would be asking school to separate her from the other child, if that's possible. I would be seriously limiting the wifi (again without alienating her).

Transgender Trend is your friend here.

Teenagers always like to rebel, this is why this is so fucking dangerous. This is probably the only thing I would take my child out of school and home educate over. I think it's one of the biggest risks a child can face.

Speak to the head. Maybe write first. You seem calm and measured. Get it in writing, then follow up. 60 -80 % of children with gender incongruence desist.

I'm so sorry this is happening to you both.
I've spent over 25 years working with children and this whole thing terrifies me.

Don't let them make you the baddy in this. You might have to grit your teeth through some bullshit.

Lily Maynard mobile.twitter.com/LilyLilyMaynard?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eserp%7Ctwgr%5Eauthor went through this with her daughter, she could be very helpful

We are here for you

It's not a school's role to transition a child.
They wouldn't give a child with an eating disorder a diet sheet.
They wouldn't give a child who is self harming a bigger razor blade.
They wouldn't give a child who is drinking excessively a cocktail

Schools would normally work with the parents and specialists to safeguard the child from the impact of their feelings / behaviour. Only with trans issues is the child's behaviour immediately affirmed and accepted with no questions asked. And as we now know from the leaks at the Tavistock Clinic - the centre of support for transitioning children - they are being pressurised. It has emerged that despite their years of working with this group of children, they have undertaken no long term research into outcomes and the impact of the hormone blocking drugs they've been prescribing!! They just treat on demand with minimal exploration of why the child wants to transition.

This is the stuff of nightmares.

And well done muriel for speaking up

I would double check your assumption that you cant change your daughters school. If you really cant change her school, if I were you, I would be removing my daughter from the school because there are huge safeguarding concerns here.

I would speak to a lawyer, your GP, and your local MP.

Your number one priority must be to keep these (absolutely bonkers) people away from your child. They'll have her squirreled away from you and taking T behind your back, permanently damaging her, in no time otherwise.

Good luck.

Liability. We need to be reminding people that their blithe acceptance of this ideology is creating a situation where they would be legally held responsible for the inevitable negative outcomes. Liability.

this is very close to my heart as dd is 14 and last year went through this whole phase. There was also a very active and vocal LGBT trans supportive group at her school. She cut her hair short, went even more 'tomboyish' in her clothes, and at one point asked me to get her boys boxers. (I had to explain that she wouldn't fit, as she is quite curvey.) She only wears sport crop tops, has never worn a bra, and wanted a binder too.

At first she wouldn't talk about it with me, I got the flounce and the 'you wouldn't understand' but I kept dropping things into conversation, and eventually we were able to have a big heart to heart.
She is gay, and very butch in her style. I was able to reassure her that she could be anything she wants to be, dress how she wants and behave how she wants.

Since she came out as gay, she has actually relaxed, and much to my surprise, recently slagged off her wonderful school club, which I think is quite healthy.

I was talking to her and raising questions - what does it mean to be a girl? How can you change your DNA? What is the difference netween body dismorphia when it is weight, and when it is gender? If we allowed boys to wear pink dresses, do you think they would still want to transition? and so on. All pretty laid back and in the context of conversations. But it all got her thinking.
One day she said - if society let people be themselves, there would be no need for transgender, and I knew she would be OK.

At one point I explained why I wasn't going to support a binder or hormone blockers (although she never asked for them, I wnated to let her know they were dangerous) and that I 100% supported her, but I wouldn't want her to do anything that would hurt her body as she is still working out who she is. She accepted that.

I believe it is still illegal to prescribe hormone blockers, so please ask them why they want to do something illegal, and despite the current newstories about the Tavistock clinic, I thought their advice for young teens was basically support them and wait and see?

My dd was being fed a whole pile of stiff via club and youtube. No-one was giving her another story. In particular, no-one was telling her that butch lesbians are OK, and normal, and not prototype boys!

sorry, that was long!
Oh and at one parents evening, one teacher was calling her by a boys name. I knew we were on the way out by then, otherwise I would have put in a formal complaint.

Liability. We need to be reminding people that their blithe acceptance of this ideology is creating a situation where they would be legally held responsible for the inevitable negative outcomes. Liability.

Definitely this if schools can’t be trusted to adequately safeguard children because it’s the correct thing to do then the liability issue and invalidated insurance issue needs pointing out to them. Repeatedly.

Mouseymummy
Dont have anything helpful to add just wanted to say sorry you are going through this. I can hardly believe whats going on in schools now and seems to be escalating.

@CharlieParley

You really dont know if the chkld was already on safeguarding's radar anyway for behaviour. Going to way wuth yhe school cpuld well make the whole thing worse.

If genuinely a child was struggling i wpuld wzng thdm to have tried counselling. Personally I'd want to do that privately so i could control the choice of counsellor.

If it does then go to SS, you can tell ss you are lookjng to support to child through counselling but are looking to leep everything else low key until it become apparent whether that it is a phase or something more serious. Tgat shuts doen the SS investigation (if they even bother to concern themselves)

School cannot complain you are unsupportive as you have listened to their concerns and taken action. Shuts them down and gives them no where further to go with it

Unless you are prepared to homeschool, going to war with the one school who is hitherto willing to take on your behaviorally challenged child is not the best plan.

exactly what @truthisarevolutionaryact says.the more airtime you give this, the more it becomes a thing.

You can go on a crusade over this, or you can shut a social sevices investigation down. I hope the OP works out whats best for her.

It worth remembering noone on mumsnet will be homeschooling your child for you...

Gah stupid fat fingers typing

Some fine posts here, I don't have much to add other than say stick to your guns, know your rights and that you're a great mother.

I've had an email regarding the policies. These are from mermaids as expected.

I've contacted the Head of the safeguarding department via email and lodged a formal complaint with the Head via email too.

I've also had a call off social services who asked me why I thought I was referred to them. I said it was because I was refusing to mutilate my 14yo because school think she's trans.

They've said it's not going to go any further and they agree that just because my daughter is going along with it, doesn't mean she's actual trans, its probably because the school will be pulling her from lessons and talking to her about it. This is really going to help someone who struggles as it is at school (insert sarcasm font here)

She struggles to concentrate for longer than 30 minutes and will start to act up in longer lessons. Shes been referred to camhs repeatedly but because she's not urgent, she doesn't get seen but would be seen over this whole trans issue. Just doesn't make sense to me at all!!!!

Thank you all for your support.

It seems everyone is so obsessed with not being called transphobic that theyre pushing it on people that aren't at all. It's bloody ridiculous.

Thank heavens Social Services were rational and helpful OP. There's lots of advice on here - hopefully some of it will be useful when you meet the Head.
They have some serious questions to answer about why their staff are discussing this with your daughter in this way. It is moving into very dangerous 'grooming' territory. These discussions are fraught with difficulty and only the most experienced of adults are in any way 'qualified' to have conversations like this with teenagers .

That a relief! Least social services seem to be being sensible for now.

Hope the complaints are taken seriously.

Schools would normally work with the parents and specialists to safeguard the child from the impact of their feelings / behaviour.

Exactly.

The school has no authority to undermine PR.

If the school becomes aware of a conflict between a child and its parents over gender identity issues it should proceed by involving the parent and child in discussions about what will or won't happen at school.

If, following such meetings or any particular disclosures from the child, it has safeguarding concerns about the parents then it should refer onwards, at which point a multi-agency team, also involving the parents, will discuss the best way ahead. If it does not, PR should be respected.

If the multi-agency team then has significant concerns about the parents, it may decide to initiate court proceedings to take over PR. From what OP has said, this is ludicrously unlikely in her case. Not immediately affirming an ROGD identity in a child who already has behaviour issues is not evidence of safeguarding concerns in a parent.

These are well established processes. No, they don't always work as well as they should but there is no way in which it is legal for schools to override PR. And certainly not as a solo enterprise. EVER.

@mouseymummy

Please can you also ask school for referral to ed psych. If you can afford it (and its not cheap) organise it yourself.

Just seen your post, OP. Thank heavens social services is still employing some common sense!

And good result OP

Well done OP.

Schools really need to be alert to the fact that they can’t just sign off on any old bollocks provided by pressure groups, that goes against long established safeguarding procedures, this is really basic stuff.