Telegraph article 'NHS trans row as men get access to women's wards if they identify as female'

[R0wantrees]

(extract)

"Hospitals routinely allow male patients to share female wards if they self-identify as women, an investigation by The Telegraph has found.

Despite official guidance intended to eliminate mixed sex wards, none of the NHS trusts in England require a patient to have begun transition for them to be treated as their preferred sex, according to responses to more than 100 Freedom of Information requests.

One trust even advises staff to consult with the transgender patient if a female victim of sexual assault objects to sharing facilities with someone who may be biologically and legally male.

The NHS is unable to track how many transgender people are accommodated on wards for the opposite sex because data systems record them as their “preferred” sex.

The Department of Health’s “elimination of mixed sex wards” guidance upon which individual trusts must base their policies says that “men and women should not have to share sleeping accommodation or toilet/bathroom facilities”. But the document adds, “except where it is in the overall best interests of the patient or reflects their patient choice”.

As a result, a physically intact male has the right to choose to be treated on a ward for women that is simultaneously declared to be single sex." (continues)

The Telegraph has been contacted by a nurse at a city hospital with a report of a patient identifying as a transgender woman who appeared to become sexually aroused on a female ward, causing distress to a group of elderly patients.

The incident raises concerns about the lack of “equality impact assessments” (EIAs) that should be undertaken by law to determine the effect on all groups that may be affected by transgender policy changes. EIAs seen by The Telegraph appear to have taken into account the impact only on transgender patients rather than on others who should also be considered because of their sex, age or religion." (continues)

www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2019/01/10/nhs-trans-row-men-get-access-womens-wards-identify-female/

This will have serious implications now it is becoming public knowledge.
see important article by Anne Harper-Wright & thread:

October 2018 'Sex, Gender & the NHS
Part 1: The “Single-Sex Hospital Wards” that have always been a lie'

medium.com/@anneharperwright/sex-gender-the-nhs-1e8f4e6363a6

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3396859-Weve-been-lied-to-about-Single-SEX-wards-since-2010

Just watched JV on +1. Apparently it is only an issue for old women

And the men on the panel were all clearly disquieted by the idea of self ID 'gendered' wards, but the only woman there did the "wouldn't bother me, can't we just be nice?" routine.

I wonder if that's because the men there understood what other males are actually capable of, and women are conditioned much more to 'believe the best' about everyone?

I also remember about 3-ish months ago a woman on Twitter who spoke about being on a mental health ward with a man IDing as a woman, who was alllowed access to female only spaces on a secure MH ward.

Isn't that how Karen White had access to rape a young woman which is why KW was sent to prison?

Floral, yes likely to be the result of women conditioned from a young age to be nice and to be accommodating. If we are conditioned via Disney and fairy tales to view males as our heroes then some will instinctively reach to help them when they are seen as vulnerable. Men on the other hand see them for what they are and have no compunction in calling them out, unless it aligns with their own inner thoughts in which case they can call it being inclusive

<a class="break-all" href="http://go.mumsnet.com/?xs=1&id=470X1554755&url=medium.com/@anneharperwright/sex-gender-the-nhs-bb86b0c3ebb" target="_blank">this brilliant articlee^ explains how NHS systems and guidance are set up to recognise the overriding importance of sex in screening and treatment, but that they have not been implemented. The irony is, the people who will be most at risk: those people whose gender identity does not match their sex.

In the short term maybe they are more at risk. But the obfuscation and confusion about sex and its importance will impact us all. Anyway, thank you, Dadjoke, for posting this article, I couldn't get there from part 1.

Another thread about sex and gender confusion:

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3475883-Council-confusion-over-sex-and-gender-could-put-women-at-risk

I wonder if that's because the men there understood what other males are actually capable of, and women are conditioned much more to 'believe the best' about everyone?

Such a good question floral I think your answer is right.

for what happened to you.

NOW on Loose Women

Stacey woke as anything.
Gloria Hunniford quotes 80% of transwomen not had surgery to transition.

I've been aware of this for a number of years as it is in the policy of the trust I work for
All my colleagues are horrified. Our equality training is online or face to face. It clearly states that trans women should be on a female ward and if a woman objects she should be moved. It uses the term bigot which I have never seen used regarding race/colour/religion
Transmen are not mentioned

"if a woman objects she should be moved"

Moved where exactly?

Frankly, if this does not peaktrans people, nothing will.

It's the naivity of it all. Wokeness triumphs over basic common sense. It is utter stupidity. Like sticking a peice of shit rapist into a woman's jail.

I’m cynical, but there’s surely very little naivety involved. This is being driven by predatory men and backed up with deliberate acts/propaganda to prevent discussion.

Gloria H sounding like she's actually done a bit of research.

Stacey not even understanding why a male body doesn't become female just because the owner feels like a woman, and apparently the only reason women would want to have a single sex wards is because they feel women.

*feel like women...

Of course there is no definition of transwoman or woman so the policy is meaningless

Apart from Stacey that was 3 women tortuously trying to explain why they did not want to share a hospital ward with a man - ever. It was painful to watch but I was glad they had the courage to be (almost) explicit.

On bbc politics now

The other thing I noticed about Loose Women is that the women who were tring so hard to say they didn't want male bodies around when they were vulnerable in an acceptable way, all suggested a variation on third space.

And the only counter to that from woke Stacey was, quite predictably "But they feel like women, why should they be in another space?"

It truly is the triumph of the Genderist religion that the other women bent over backwards to try and be as kind as possible, but in the end their own concerns were just not relevant to the youngest woman on the panel.

I find it absolutely fascinating that someone can be a committed Genderist, see "woman" as a feeling based on loose sex stereotypes, be a woman yourself and completely lack any empathy for other women whatsoever.

I hope Ash Sakar and Ian Dale's elderly female relatives are never in a situation where they don't want a trans woman next to them in hospital because Ash and Ian won't be fighting their corner, will they?

I find it absolutely fascinating that someone can be a committed Genderist, see "woman" as a feeling based on loose sex stereotypes, be a woman yourself and completely lack any empathy for other women whatsoever.

Me too. I think it's a deep form of internalised misogyny.

Just a heads up that Joani's article doesn't appear in the Scottish Telegraph. Don't waste your £1.80 like I did!

I wonder who writes the training material where anyone objecting to men on women's wards is called a bigot? Now, let me ponder this a while ....

"We get ourselves in such a tizzy over these fearmongering stories..."

Don't know who she is on the BBC politics but yeah great. Let's not get in a tizzy, let's apply "common sense" as she puts it, and validate AGP sexual fetishes at the expense of women's privacy, dignity and safety in hospital. Much more sensible.

Women, any discomfort, embarrassment or distress you suffer in hopsital by being bunked up with males is contributing to fearmongering stories. Stop it. You're damaging an ideology.

Genderism is about elevating the feelings of men above all other things. It is about preserving the genderism hierarchy of males superior, females inferior.

Therefore on women's hospital wards, male people's feelings are paramount in all circumstances. Men have the most entitlement to that female space and women the least entitlement.

Therefore, if a female person does not want to share a female space with men, then the female must be removed from the female space.

Because we must respect the hierarchy at all times.