Stella O'Malley, Trans Kids: It's Time To Talk

[drum123]

Apologies if there is already a thread about this. Channel 4, 10.00 tonight. 'Stella O'Malley considers the huge rise in numbers of young people embarking on gender transition, through the prism of the gender identity issues she experienced when she was a child.' According to The Times no TRA groups were prepared to contribute to this . Stella feels this may be because she was a tomboy as a young girl, (even insisting she was a boy until she hit puberty), and is now a confident, mature woman who believes that nowadays she would be pressured to go down the transition route. Sounds like it will be worth watching.

As a general rule, I find explicit boundary violations to be emblematic of coercive behaviour exemplified by the Duluth model.

I think this group is now defunct. I'd be very sceptical of any group that wasn't independent anyway.

I might be interested in setting something up, as long as it doesn't facilitate men. The Trans Widows thread is called "Escape Committee" for a reason.

Good luck if you (or with others) decide to do this, it seems from an outside perspective that there's a very definite need.

I for one have lurked on the transwidow thread and it has offered me insight, which I value greatly, and I hope it has made me more mindful of considering the wives‘ perspective (which before was somehow just not present in my head - because it never is in media, I guess). I obviously don‘t comment there, but I agree, it is very important for us to get the whole picture, and quite possibly as the best life line women in this situation find.

Setting something up that is accessible on invitation only or so, might still be a good idea, because affected women can talk more frankly than they would on a publically accessible forum.

It would be very nice if transwidows could feel that their very specific and relevant perspective was acknowledged as important on other threads. It is such an inexplicably marginalized viewpoint, and while I think the transwidows thread is very important, I don't want this perspective hived off because it is a hugely important feminist issue.

This ^^

Funny enough, in my earlier woker days I remember watching a documentary about a couple in the US had transitioned, and they stayed together. And I was in awe at the transitioner‘s bravery and commitment to the family. And all my mum said was: ‚What this woman has to put up with is a disgrace. Selfish prat, of course it is comfortable for him like that. But what is with her?‘
She got it back then.

If people wish to form a a private group, invitation only, to discuss very private matters, that would be a sound idea, would it not?

Whereas this thread is about a particularly topical TV programme, and issues around it, and is surely open to all those with a legitimate interest in it, and have contributions to make?.

It may seem to some posters that everyone on it (except any trans/ transsexual people )thinks that such people have no contribution to make. The P.M. inbox says that some readers think otherwise.

It would be a shame of the thread did "end", as there is still a lot to discuss, and the issues are ongoing and will not go away.

If people wish to form a a private group, invitation only, to discuss very private matters, that would be a sound idea, would it not?

And how would women who need it find it?

A far better solution is for others to have the decency and integrity to respect boundaries and recognise when contribution is not contribution but rather intrusion and violation.

Funny enough, in my earlier woker days I remember watching a documentary about a couple in the US had transitioned, and they stayed together. And I was in awe at the transitioner‘s bravery and commitment to the family. And all my mum said was: ‚What this woman has to put up with is a disgrace. Selfish prat, of course it is comfortable for him like that. But what is with her?‘
She got it back then.

I was talking with my friends Nan recently who is 90+ and her very quick response was very similar. She also commented something along the lines of 'well there have of course always been men who do this dear'
She was mystified with what had happened in recent years but her immediate and primary concern was for children and young people being horrified that they were being enabled to have such such life-changing medical/surgical interventions.

It's a shame, Lang that some people appear to have the hide of a rhino when it's hinted at that they should stay out of certain conversations or places.

Yes, Tinsel, I find it fascinating that the suggestion that transwidows perspectives are extremely important and need to be front and centre is interpreted by some as a suggestion that the thread should end.

It is a real dilemma trying to create spaces where women can publicly share experiences.

How to fight against males socialised to feel entitled to intrude and centre themselves, whilst fighting female socialisation which enables males to do so, without this fight overshadowing the purposes of the space?

If women hide away, privately away from males, our voices are effectively silenced too.

It reminds me of that rule of misogyny. Women already have all the rights they need. The right to remain silent.

It reminds me of that rule of misogyny. Women already have all the rights they need. The right to remain silent.

I was saying on another thread recently how much I missed thebewilderness her timing with these was always very helpful.
I can never remember them and have to go searching!

here for reference:
THE RULES OF MISOGYNY

1st rule of misogyny: Women are responsible for what men do.

2nd rule of misogyny: Women saying no to men is a hate crime.

3rd rule of misogyny: Women speaking for themselves are exclusionary and selfish.

4th rule of misogyny: Women's opinions are violence against men thus male violence against women is justified.

5th rule of misogyny: WATM! [What about the Men] Women and Feminism must be useful to men or they are worthless.

6th rule of misogyny: Women who go around being female AT men by menstruating and breast feeding babies deserve punishment.

7th rule of misogyny: Women should always be grateful to men for everything.

8th rule of misogyny: Men are whatever men say they are and women are whatever men say they are.

9th rule of misogyny: Men always know the "real reasons" for everything women do and say.

10th rule of misogyny: The worst thing about male violence is that it males men look bad.

11th rule of misogyny: Basic pattern recognition skills are cruel and evil when they hurt men's feelings.

12th rule of misogyny: whatever women suffer from, men suffer from more.

LikeDust thank you for the timely reminder. I'm thinking carefully about these now.

Thinking about it, I think that Stella's conversation with Jennifer (I hope she is actually called Jennifer) is the first live interview I've ever seen with a transwidow. It's very easy to hide emotion in print; not so much on camera.

Thanks Rowan it is weird on FWR since bewilderness was picked off by Emma's mates.

I think its wierd too.
As this is the feminism and women's rights board, bewilderness's rules of misogyny were such an important consciousness raising element.

Maybe more of us should become better students!

We did have an AGP come onto the Trans Widows thread and offer to mansplain it all to us, including how his wife put up with it. He got very miffed when he was given short shrift.

Maybe only one in nearly a year is not bad going.

thread:
www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3236421-so-these-ere-rules-of-misogyny

We did have an AGP come onto the Trans Widows thread and offer to mansplain it all to us, including how his wife put up with it. He got very miffed when he was given short shrift

I'm not surprised... by the short shrift!

There's a powerful ring of female solidarity both within and without that thread.

It's only one thread though.

Its dreadful that you even had the one tinsel

I really really don't understand why posters feel the need to go on what is obviously a support thread and stick their oar in

Happens on aibu a lot as well

It is a shame that some people are unable to accept that their views do not automatically trump those of any others, on principle. It is a bigger shame when the others have views that are essentially the same on such as self ID .

This is a social media website. It is wide open to the general public. Open to many people, with many viewpoints. This is what free speech is like, in practice.

For some posters to try to co-operate to try to discourage people who are supportive of feminist ideas, who always try to be courteous and polite, by making generalised remarks between themselves cannot reflect well on those who do it.

The fact that this particular person is " for all practical purposes" female ( GRA 2004 ) should not be relevant. Common decency always is.

Now, wouldn't it be nice to get back to discussing the programme, and issues around it?

Now, wouldn't it be nice to get back to discussing the programme, and issues around it?

That's exactly what's been going on Kay.

3rd rule of misogyny: Women speaking for themselves are exclusionary and selfish.

Indeed, R0wan. I don't know what anyone else has been doing, but I was having a conversation about issues presented by the programme from a feminist perspective, this being FWR. Therefore I was interested to hear from transwidows about their unique viewpoint that doesn't get a wide enough hearing in the way that other particular perspectives do.

Therefore I was interested to hear from transwidows about their unique viewpoint that doesn't get a wide enough hearing in the way that other particular perspectives do.

Prompted by a specific observation from a segment of the program which generated some significant and thought-provoking perspectives.

A far better solution is for others to have the decency and integrity to respect boundaries and recognise when contribution is not contribution but rather intrusion and violation.

Especially when these issues are pertinent to the programme under discussion.