TG day of remembrance

[WomanAndProud]

When did 20 November become the transgender Day Of Remembrance?

Is there an International Women's Day of Remembrance? We bloody well need to get onto it given the numbers of us who are actually killed every single day. And given that the majority of women who are murdered are killed by men, that's anti-women (adult human female, to be clear - and that's not exclusionary, trans women don't want to be included anyway, they've made their own day they can't now complain about not being in ours).

And I do hope that they'll be remembering the trans people killed by other trans people. Because there are a fair few of them too.

They were transgender women killed, were they not? Why shouldn't transwomen have a day to remember themselves? They're entitled to that.

Naome Hersi’s death is tragic and sad. From what I understand, it was not a transphobic attack.

VerbeenaBeeks

Their deaths should be remembered for what they were: targeted attacks against sex workers. Why aren’t we having that conversation? You obviously aren’t actually interested in why they died. Just here yet again, to tell Mumsnetters what horrible shameful nasty women we are 🙄

Yes, a lot of trans women that are murdered are sex workers, ask yourself why they’re sex workers for a start? Could prejudice against trans people be preventing them from getting regular jobs? And yes, they were killed specifically because they were trans.

And for those saying I’m trying to shame people for their comments, absolutely I am. Making statements like what done have are disgusting. Having 1 day out 365 to just take 2 minutes to remember people that have been killed, doesn’t mean you can’t have another day for another group of people that are killed. The comments seem to suggest that there shouldn’t be a day of remembrance, which to me implies you’re saying we’re not important enough. We’re people, we bloody deserve it like any other targeted group deserves it. We have rememberence Sunday for the soldiers that died fighting a way 100 years ago for god’s sake. We commemorate world aids day, 9/11 - I’m not American, don’t live anywhere near the place, I still feel sad for the people who died, those that were injured and their families, because I’m human and it’s called a little bit of decency. If you don’t understand why I might be annoyed at some of the comments now then there’s nothing more I can say to convince you.

I want to know how many trans people have died from their medications, complications of surgery or suicide.
I want to know when they are remembered.
Those people would seem more relavent in this country, but they don't seem to be mentioned or remembered.
Im interested as to why that is.
I have my suspicions.

Why are you asking weird unrelated questions that aren’t based in reality? No other group has done this

They're perfectly valid questions and comments, not unrelated to what the thread is about at all.

I'm of the opinion even a relatively low number is too many murders

Of course it is.

Someone said
Depends. If gay people launched a day of remembrance where there were very few victims, and those who had died were victims of other awful circumstances,

I said where would your line be until it was an acceptable amount of people hurt/attacked/murdered before it was deemed not very few victims? When would be acceptable before they were deemed acceptable to have a remembrance day?
So wasn't just out of the blue and weird unrelated question.

A transgender woman was brutally murdered in the UK in March this year (2018). That it had very limited coverage in the national press, may have meant that people aren’t aware of it? www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2018/sep/25/man-murdered-naomi-hersi-three-day-sex-and-drugs-old-bailey-told

I also think that Transgender Day of Remembrance is also to remember those who have died through suicide. Of those, there are definitely many more.

Having 1 day out 365 to just take 2 minutes to remember people that have been killed, doesn’t mean you can’t have another day for another group of people that are killed

Exactly, it's not a "we don't have a day and neither do gay people so don't you be having one" scenario - I'd have no problem with anyone having a remembrance day.

The comments seem to suggest that there shouldn’t be a day of remembrance, which to me implies you’re saying we’re not important enough. We’re people, we bloody deserve it like any other targeted group deserves it.

Well said

The only acceptable number of lives lost is none. Zero. Nada.

Murder - whatever the motivation and reasons for it - is wrong, and if someone is murdered simply because they are different in some way, then that is repugnant.

I don't have an issue with a group of people wanting to have a day of remembrance for whatever reason. I do feel uncomfortable if the reasons for having that day appear to be less about genuine remembrance and more about co-opting someone else's tragedy for the purpose of making a political statement.

You are not a targeted group. The group targeted in the large number of murders are sex workers. That’s why they were murdered. Brazil itself has the highest rates of homicide in the world so the fact that’s where most of them occur is not surprising either. Their trans status is not the reason. In the UK, you’re less likely to be a victim of homicide as a trans woman, than a man is. Having a day of rememberance in a country where you are less likely to be a victim of homicide, and using deaths of sex workers in another country as a reasoning, absolutely deserves some scrutiny.

I do feel uncomfortable if the reasons for having that day appear to be less about genuine remembrance and more about co-opting someone else's tragedy for the purpose of making a political statement.

Yes. This sums it up well.

Could prejudice against trans people be preventing them from getting regular jobs?

Yes I agree with that as a possible factor. Prostitution has a murder risk in the US of approx 20 times the general murder rate and undoubtedly higher in Latin America. I would certainly applaud any initiative to get MTF trans people out of prostitution as an exploitative high risk means of survival by giving them exit strategies, as I do women.

You are not a targeted group. The group targeted in the large number of murders are sex workers. That’s why they were murdered.

Transpeople are not a targeted group? Are you being serious? Sadly, I think you are.
Even say if the large number of murders was because they were sex workers, why on earth can't transpeople have a day of remembrance to remember transwomen who were killed?
Transpeople do get attacked or abuse thrown at them just for being trans, surely you cannot deny that.

I we’re saying that there shouldn’t be a Transgender Day of Remembrance because it’s ‘co-opting someone else’s tragedy’ then surely we should also stop having a minutes silence for those who died in WW1? In the same vein, could Jean Hatchet be considered to be ‘co-opting someone else’s tragedy’ in riding to remember a dead woman that she doesn’t personally know?

It’s perfectly reasonable to have a day to compassionately and sympathetically think about people other than those you know personally.

Some of you get it, thank you.

Also, why should sex-workers be considered any less important to be remembered than anyone else? The fact that many of them may have been forced into that lifestyle just to survive, is surely reason to be more sympathetic towards them, not less??

Red

Again, the issue is they are murderered because they are sex workers. If that was the focus of the rememberance day, we wouldn’t be having this discussion.

Exactly, RedHoodGirl, are we only supposed to be sympathetic if it's our tragedy? 9/11 was mentioned upthread somewhere - so taking that as an example, I personally have no ties or know anyone in New York - should I think it's nothing to do with me, I'm co-opting and jumping on someone else's tragedy?
It's along the same line of thinking.
I can have compassion and realise that it's not all about me, there are people out there with their own struggles and why would I have a problem with them having a day of remembrance for those hurt/fallen/abused either verbally or physically?

I would certainly applaud any initiative to get MTF trans people out of prostitution as an exploitative high risk means of survival by giving them exit strategies, as I do women.

So would I. Is there any such initiative by any of the trans lobby groups we see given so much media attention?

Exactly, RedHoodGirl, are we only supposed to be sympathetic if it's our tragedy? 9/11 was mentioned upthread somewhere - so taking that as an example, I personally have no ties or know anyone in New York - should I think it's nothing to do with me, I'm co-opting and jumping on someone else's tragedy?
It's along the same line of thinking

No it isnt. Because when we remember those victims of 9/11, we remember why they were killed. That they were victims of terrorism. We don’t use their deaths for another cause.

Also, why should sex-workers be considered any less important to be remembered than anyone else? The fact that many of them may have been forced into that lifestyle just to survive, is surely reason to be more sympathetic towards them, not less??
You'd have thought.

Again, the issue is they are murderered because they are sex workers. If that was the focus of the rememberance day, we wouldn’t be having this discussion
That reads like you're wanting to conveniently airbrush out the fact they are trans, and wanting to just say "they're sexworkers, nothing more to it".
If they're trans, and wanting to remember other trans who were hurt or killed, why not let them? It hurts you not one bit.

No it isnt. Because when we remember those victims of 9/11, we remember why they were killed. That they were victims of terrorism

Awful atrocity, and rightly remembered.
You're right here though - Terrorism, yes, they were. Terrorism being a form of extremism......

I don't have an issue with a group of people wanting to have a day of remembrance for whatever reason. I do feel uncomfortable if the reasons for having that day appear to be less about genuine remembrance and more about co-opting someone else's tragedy for the purpose of making a political statement.

This.

Loads of female sex workers are murdered in Brazil. Loads of men are as well. The homicide rates in those countries are horrific, it's a huge problem.

To take that problem and use it to make out that trans people are specific murder targets all over the world is totally disingenous, and also quite insulting to the victims of these murders.

The murder of Naomi Hersi was awful and I really don't have a problem with people coming together to remember her.

VerbeenaBeeks

You’re asking the same questions and being given the same answers. I’m not wasting my time answering them with slightly different words. The problems have been made crystal clear by myself and others.