British Gymnastics also have drunk the koolaid

[GColdtimer]

So my dds gym coach sent me the guidelines, knowing my stance on these matters and asked what I thought (well he said he probably knew what I thought but wanted to share).

Here you go:

On Definitions:

1.3 -Children sometimes know from a very young age and change their gender role sometimes before starting or during their early years in school. Others may only become fully aware when puberty starts. In some cases, such feelings may be repressed for many years.

1.6-1.7 refer to the EA, protected characteristics and the WEC

The rest of section one refers to the guidelines set down by the IOC etc which appear to be all about testosterone rather than muscle mass, lung capacity, strength etc.

1.15 says that pre16 boys (who identify as girls, purely because they feel like a girl) can compete alongside girls. Funny how it doesn’t mention trans boys. Is this because, perhaps, a 15 year old female bodied trans boy probably wouldn't want to compete alongside the boys because they will likely loose.

5.6 explains what being trans is about all over again "Signs can appear at a very young age e.g. a child refusing to wear typical clothes of their gender or taking part in non- typical games."

7.11 - Changing Rooms: Competition organisers must ensure that all participants are able to have access to changing rooms and toilets, according to the gender in which they present. It is not acceptable to restrict them to using disabled toilets or other unisex facilities unless this is specifically requested by the participant.

So boys can get changed with the girls because they say they are girls. And girls cannot complain or express their unease at this situation. What about protecting girls safety, dignity, privacy.

In their notes: "If an individual remains unhappy about a trans person using facilities appropriate to their gender identity, then they should make alternative arrangements” So basically if a teenage girl doesn’t want to get changed with a boy, it tough. She should go elsewhere.

And then this gem:

Residential events: As far as possible, trans people should be able to sleep in a room appropriate to their gender identity. However, some trans people may not feel comfortable doing this and in such cases alternative sleeping arrangements should be considered for privacy reasons. It is important to consider the options in advance and find out if they would prefer a separate room if this option would be available. Again, what about the girls privacy.

Who wrote these guidelines? Oh look, Stonewall and Mermaids advised.

I need to go for a run to calm down.

So would a trans girl / boy be at an advantage in gymnastic terms if they were legally allowed to use puberty blockers?

I agree, as someone who was a gymnast, I'm really upset about the way the sport has gone anyway, its become much more about strength and we would be fucked with vaulting etc competing with males.
Personally I feel its been very influenced by male gymnastics and therefore become much more about difficulty and strength rather than flexibility, and skill (sorry into stereotypes here which I hate) its like strength is more valued and of course men are generally stronger due to biology.

As a child that was very sidelined as a girl, doing gymnastics was something where I could not be compared to boy as boys did not do floor, beam, uneven bars. it was finally my own thing. Im not saying boys shouldn't do these, I suppose I'm saying it helped me that I had my own thing.

This is a safeguarding issue and its a fucking outrage, also there is a lot of a physical contact with a coach with spotting.

A transboy is never going to be at an advantage in anything.

That's why any sporting restrictions around trans are for transgirls / women only.

Men's sport is not under threat from women transitioning, even when they take testosteronce etc.

Its already a sport riddled with eating disorders, now girls who are already acutely body conscious, expected to share changing rooms.

Noooooooo

A transboy is never going to be at an advantage in anything.

Except wrestling (albeit USA): www.theguardian.com/society/2018/feb/25/transgender-wrestler-mack-beggs-wins-texas-girls-title

To be fair, Mack Beggs doesn't want to fight girls but was restricted to it.

Beggs is in the process of transitioning from female to male and taking a low-dose of testosterone. It was his steroid therapy treatments while wrestling girls that stirred a fierce debate about competitive fairness and transgender rights last season. His march to a state championship was dogged by a last-minute lawsuit that tried to stop him.

Beggs asked to wrestle in the boys’ division but the rules for Texas public high schools require athletes to compete under the gender on their birth certificate.

He entered this year’s state tournament with a 32-0 record, beating three female wrestlers on his way to the championship.

Nothing on the telly again

If parents or children are not allowed to identify anyone as trans without their permission, do you think BG are imposing a culture of fear to prevent anyone discussing trans issues , so they have no recourse to put in a complaint if a boy is in the girls changing rooms. It is absolutely appalling that adults who probably have children themselves are not doing any thinking. What girl going through pre puberty / puberty is not at some point really embarrassed about changing in front of other females at some point, let alone males. This will prevent girls participating

I don't mean to be trite with the wrestling example but...how long do you think girls and women's snowboarding and ski-ing competitions will remain free of transgender athletes who are indifferently ranked in the male leagues but could clean up (by virtue of strength/mass ratio) in the women's events?

It's also important to know that BG doesn't just cover artistic and rythmic gymnastics. Tumbling, trampolining, acrobatic gymnastics and aerobic gymnastics are also covered. Some of these especially favour those with more strength and power.

jbiscuits exactly its teaching girls that they have no right to speak up about something they are not comfortable with.
Its also teaching girls that their instincts are wrong, which is a total head fuck, and worse still that they are bigots if they feel this way.

I assume BG is a membership organisation, and gymnasts, coaches and volunteers need to be members and pay annual subscriptions.

How then can they make such dramatic changes to the safeguarding provisions, which could well have a profound negative impact on grass roots participation, without wide consultation of .the membership.

Perhaps people within the sport, ie members of BG could write to individual board/governing committee members and ask about the decision making process, and suggest that the introduction of the policy is suspuspended until the wider membership have been consulted. And until there has been a clear reconciliation between the new policy and current safeguarding guidelines, and and guidelines issued by either Sport England, the international federation (competitions abroad) and their specialist insurers. You might add that you are worried about the personal liability implications for volunteers, should the weakening of the safeguarding lead to problems, so need reassurance that guidance issued the BG is consistent, safe and accepted by all parties.

My guess is that there will be people on the Governing body who will be equally shocked, these boards usually have their fogey-quotient plus hopefully one or two with common sense, and who will take it forward. Probably by stalling implementation until there is clear Govenment policy on self-ID. It is not an area where gymnasts need to take the lead.

MsBee as well as teaching girls that their instincts are wrong, it is also undermining parents instincts and concerns about the safety of their children.

I care deeply about sport for children, and have given many hours as a volunteer. This has the hallmarks of a sport in self destruct mode. Not unlike the Green Party. I don’t understand the selfishness of a small group who would restrict opportunities for so many just to prove some political point.

I wrote this on the AIBU thread (riffing on the WPUK advice re unions).

---

British Gymnastics contact page and depts.

www.british-gymnastics.org/contact-us

www.british-gymnastics.org/contact-us/399-departments

1. Contact the CEO and the Safeguarding Dept. of British Gymnastics and ask

-how the decision was made -what consultation took place -what expert advice was involved in considering safeguarding risks

[email protected]

[email protected]

1. Mark your emails for attention CEO and Safeguarding Dept if you use the web contact form - use their names if you have them.

1. Cc to your local/regional club/group and make it clear you are expecting a reply. Regional secretaries addresses:

www.british-gymnastics.org/contact-us/403-regional-secretaries

1. Follow up in 7 days.

Thanks aaran. I have also alerted FPFW so they are also aware.

I feel a bit bad. Have posted about this on my FB - "would you be happy your teenage daughter sharing a room with a boy". Didn't mention trans. Lots of people saying "no way". I suspect any of my FB posts mentioning trans have not been getting out there. Anyway some lovely people sending me towards NSPCC guidelines and telling me it's against safeguarding. I am going to have to come clean but if it's raised awareness it's worth it I figure!

Needmoresleep exactly !

Maybe post the above advice about contacting BG to query it?

It would be interesting if your FB friends demur once they realise it's about trans gender and, if they felt prepared to say why?

I will let you know aaran. One at least is a MN so she has probably twigged.

I have emailed BG, as have about a million other lurkers too, probably. Thank you for the link.

A transboy is never going to be at an advantage in anything.

Well, once we've all perfected and introduced the "walking under a low bar" event suggested by (I think) Rat, they will be a shoo-in for gold

Thanks must. Do report back what they said.

Will do, Two.
(Sorry, haven't figured out how to incorporate the original poster etc in my reply).

FUck a fuckng duck.
I'm gobsmacked that this is so openly anti-female.
"Women, move over - a man who thinks he is a woman wishes to have your space and if you don't like it, fuck off and do something else, there's a dear. Off you trot now!"

This is all so painful. There are young people out there who sincerely believe they were born in the wrong body and would find it extremely painful to be told to compete with their birth sex. It is shameful that they (and their families) have been misled for so long to the extent that they now rely on external validation for their well being.

What needs to happen is that those same young people need to be fully and wholeheartedly supported according to whatever makes them feel comfortable without denying their biological sex. And for the bullying of gender non conforming people to stop.

It's the emboldening of people with bad intentions when we make it easy to have access to vulnerable groups and abandon safeguarding.

Despite all the rhetoric of safeguarding, there's a heart-rending thread about the sexual violence in our schools and how it's being victim blamed on the girls involved in the linked article.

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3364173-Our-kids-were-raped-by-classmates-DfE-wont-listen

Brassidium Children can't legally transition, and have the legal right to single sex facilities.